Author Topic: Patina Hyena - 550/650 674cc Hybrid Cafe Build (Read 347584 times)

DaveBarbier · « **Reply #200 on:** October 22, 2014, 04:32:45 AM »

I posted these pictures before. I messaged Hondaman a month ago and he said it looked like it was oil starved for a little bit but doesn't look too bad.

I'll cross this road after I mic it up.

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1978 Honda CB550K

Maurice · « **Reply #201 on:** October 22, 2014, 06:37:54 AM »

FWIW I installed the pucks dry. In fact, everything dry (top end only). Put 2500 miles on it no leak (knock on head/wood). Probably got lucky I guess, but I'd rather fix a leak than the results of a clogged oil passage.

Do measure the cam lobes, never hurts, IMO unless the engine was run dry for some time or has over 200k miles they will be well within spec. All the ones I've seen have these marks where they rub the tappets which can be deceiving. Mine even had small casting imperfections but Dave500 (blessed be His username) said it's ok.

Looks purdy!

DaveBarbier · « **Reply #202 on:** October 22, 2014, 03:04:50 PM »

I measured the cam. My measurements are as follows for the lobes. I did two measurements per lobe to check for even wear. This tool isn't great as I describe below so I didn't do three across the lobe like Cal suggested.

Intake: wear limit=35.85mm
35.06/35.06
35.05/35.06
35.05:35.06
35.07/35.06

Exhaust: wear limit=34.45mm
34.67/34.67
34.67/34.67
34.67/34.66
34.66/34.67

Now, I don't have really good quality calipers. Just those digital ones everyone has off Ebay for like $15. Only goes down to hundredths. And because of the design of them it's not easy to measure cylindrical objects accurately in my opinion. I've used this type below which I find better because there's a larger contact surface so you can sit squarely on the object to be measured and not be slightly cocked. So take these measurements with a few grains of salt.

Wait, I just did a double take at my intake measurements. Can this be? 8/10ths of an inch (edit: crap, I mean millimeter) smaller then spec? Am I measuring this wrong? Can the Clymer have a typo? I'm measuring this while the cam is in the head. But I'm pretty sure I'm getting the full height.

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1978 Honda CB550K

DaveBarbier · « **Reply #203 on:** October 22, 2014, 03:08:00 PM »

Remeasuring gives me the same values. Gauge is zeroed out before the measurements. I can't find a spot on any intake lobe that's more than 35.07mm.

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1978 Honda CB550K

Maurice · « **Reply #204 on:** October 22, 2014, 03:32:51 PM »

The manual seems to have a typo, wear limit says 35.85mm (note: mm, not inches, eh), while standard value is between 34.93mm and 34.97mm. Doesn't make sense. Seems to me wear limit should read 34.85mm.

Given measurement/instrument error (your exhaust measurements are also above new) you seem to have a nice camshaft, actually?

DaveBarbier · « **Reply #205 on:** October 22, 2014, 03:48:36 PM »

Ok, good. That's what I'm thinking. Browsing the Internet I found someone else who says it's wrong. If the wear limit is in fact 34.85mm then yeah, it seems like I'm ok. I still want others to chime in on the Clymer error, though, haha. Just to be doubly sure.

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1978 Honda CB550K

Maurice · « **Reply #206 on:** October 22, 2014, 04:20:21 PM »

Thanks

Tews19 · « **Reply #207 on:** October 22, 2014, 06:42:15 PM »

Dave where are you located?

DaveBarbier · « **Reply #208 on:** October 22, 2014, 06:54:34 PM »

I'm in southern CT, USA.

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1978 Honda CB550K

DaveBarbier · « **Reply #209 on:** October 23, 2014, 04:54:54 AM »

Anyone know for a fact that the Clymer and Honda manual is wrong with the intake cam lobe height service limit?

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1978 Honda CB550K

DaveBarbier · « **Reply #210 on:** October 23, 2014, 12:02:51 PM »

Bump

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1978 Honda CB550K

dave500 · « **Reply #211 on:** October 23, 2014, 12:25:28 PM »

the Honda one has them back to front I think?

DaveBarbier · « **Reply #212 on:** October 23, 2014, 01:19:08 PM »

I don't know if that's the case. Here's a screen grab of the Honda manual. I just think it's simply a typo. I think someone typeset this page on their first day...notice the "Service Date". The other pages say "Service Data". And "runont" instead of "runout". It's riddled with mistakes.

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1978 Honda CB550K

calj737 · « **Reply #213 on:** October 23, 2014, 02:07:19 PM »

Not to mention the inch/metric equivalents are incorrect.

Based upon the consistency of your measurements, I'd go forward with no concerns.

DaveBarbier · « **Reply #214 on:** October 23, 2014, 02:40:39 PM »

Quote from: calj737 on October 23, 2014, 02:07:19 PM

Not to mention the inch/metric equivalents are incorrect.

Based upon the consistency of your measurements, I'd go forward with no concerns.

Ah, I didn't even convert them to see. Ok, thanks guys. Cam cover is going on as we speak...after liberally oiled. Elastic bands on the tappets after they were unscrewed out as far as they can go. Anti seize on the new stainless allen head bolts with a torque wrench. Let me know of anything I'm missing. Thanks.

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1978 Honda CB550K

DaveBarbier · « **Reply #215 on:** October 25, 2014, 08:59:20 AM »

All buttoned up. Just put in the starter, points plate, adjusted the cam chain and valve clearance (I'll have to do again once warm, just a preliminary adjustment), gapped new sparks plugs and installed. I have not yet put in the oil pump; I'm going to wait until that's in so I can fill it up and slap it on before start up...and also fill it with oil, can't forget that! Anything I should be doing to prep for the first turn over? Everything is lubed up inside. I'm just waiting for a friend to come help me. Might not get done today. Speaking of which, anyone want to come to southern CT right now for zero dollars to give me a hand? No? Ok, no problem.

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1978 Honda CB550K

dave500 · « **Reply #216 on:** October 25, 2014, 01:03:25 PM »

once the head is on rotate it by hand a few times over,recheck the cam timing,you can spin it over on the starter to get oil flowing if you want with the spark plugs removed once your sure its all good to spin fast.

DaveBarbier · « **Reply #217 on:** October 25, 2014, 04:25:01 PM »

Thanks Dave. That brings me to a question...how do I know the cam is in the proper orientation to the crank/piston position? The manual said to put it at 1-4 TDC which I did. Am I looking to just have the cam's cutout mark line up with the head surface while the motor is at 1-4 TDC? I supposed it doesn't matter which piston (1 or 4) is firing.

I might take the valve cover off to double check...unless there's a way to make sure I didn't advance or retard it a tooth with the valve cover on?

I'm getting a lazy friend to come over when he wakes up at 11 in the afternoon. This coming week (maybe Monday) I'm firing it up. I'm very excited.

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1978 Honda CB550K

calj737 · « **Reply #218 on:** October 25, 2014, 05:56:08 PM »

And you did re-torque the head after 24 hours...?

DaveBarbier · « **Reply #219 on:** October 25, 2014, 07:47:29 PM »

Quote from: calj737 on October 25, 2014, 05:56:08 PM

And you did re-torque the head after 24 hours...?

Yes sir. And I could tell that it stretched...I think. I loosened them a half turn starting at 6 o'clock. So half turn loose to 12 o'clock then tightened back to the recommended torque and they went to about 9 o'clock-ish.

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1978 Honda CB550K

DaveBarbier · « **Reply #220 on:** October 26, 2014, 10:01:40 AM »

Motor is IN. A friend came over just now and helped drop it in. It went a lot easier than I thought.

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1978 Honda CB550K

DaveBarbier · « **Reply #221 on:** October 27, 2014, 11:28:38 AM »

Day off today, good for recovering from a chili cook-off and finishing putting everything together on a bike.

Just a question on clutch operation. I filled the crank case with oil and I'm running through the gears with my foot and my hand spinning the rear wheel. I feel all gears and can locate neutral easily but if I'm in any gear when I pull the clutch lever the wheel is still locked. Like the clutch isn't disengaging.

I adjusted the clutch so the dots are aligned on the cover and arm and have about the recommended free play in lever. The lever feels normal when I squeeze it. Before assembly I soaked the clutch plates in oil. Clutch cable is routed correctly and isn't snagged on anything.

This doesn't seem normal.

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1978 Honda CB550K

Tews19 · « **Reply #222 on:** October 27, 2014, 11:43:02 AM »

I had this same problem with my 550 build. When I started the bike it would kill it self when I let off the clutch just a tad. I got it to shift better after playing with it but once the bike got warm it was damn near impossible to change gears. I'm sure it was an oil issue. I am in the process of swapping out engines and will see if this issue happens to the "newer" engine.

Maurice · « **Reply #223 on:** October 27, 2014, 11:51:01 AM »

Give it more force. There is always some drag, by hand it will not be easy to spin the rear wheel. Check with the kickstarter it's easier. Careful don't bash your knee or other valuable body parts anywhere, it will come down easier than expected. If that is still dragging bad there could be an issue...

DaveBarbier · « **Reply #224 on:** October 27, 2014, 12:35:18 PM »

Quote from: Maurice on October 27, 2014, 11:51:01 AM

Give it more force. There is always some drag, by hand it will not be easy to spin the rear wheel. Check with the kickstarter it's easier. Careful don't bash your knee or other valuable body parts anywhere, it will come down easier than expected. If that is still dragging bad there could be an issue...

Ah yes, kick starter is very easy and doesn't turn the motor over when used if I have the clutch lever pulled. I guess either this is normal and it'll work normally when it's running and warmed up or it's not fully disengaging. I'm going to play with the adjustment a little.

Thanks

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1978 Honda CB550K

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Author Topic: Patina Hyena - 550/650 674cc Hybrid Cafe Build (Read 347584 times)