Topic: Sleeve differences for performance engines.

[gschuld]

I skipped basic metallurgy at school(like many others I suspect)

I’d like to start a discussion on sleeve material for high(er) performance builds.

Factory sleeves are said to be “spun cast iron”

A screen shot each from LA Sleeve and Advanced Sleeve below are for reference.

So, for example, for an 736-836 road race engine build, is there an advantage to using a set of aftermarket sleeves based on metallurgy or is the material in the factory cast iron sleeves just fine for the job?  Does this change depending on compression level or forged or cast pistons?

Thanks in advance.

George

[dragracer]

So this question has been viewed 80 times and no replies??. Sorry George but I don't have an answer for you either. Just wondering why our usual, forum experts haven't chimed in. I'm curious about the differences myself.

[kmb69]

I'm like Frank, I have no solid answer.
My gut instinct says there's nothing you can do in the 836 range, short of a blown fueler, that requires anything better than stock.

[slikwilli420]

Ive gathered as much as well. The only thing I would think about doing on a smaller displacement racer is the aluminum Nikasil plated sleeves. The main reason would be weight reduction, and cooling secondary to that as well as lower bore wear but after pricing it out, it would be very difficult to justify the cost for the above stated benefits.

[turboguzzi]

the factory cast iron sleeves are just fine for the job.

switching to nikasil is nice if you can afford it AND know where to source the right rings to run on a nikasil bore. Being way harder. Nikasil reuqires different alloy/surface threatment of the rings.

[Big Jay]

Our experience has shown that oem sleeves are usually harder than aftermarket cast iron sleeves.  Ductile like we used in the top fuel blocks is harder and stronger than oem.

[gschuld]

So in short (discounting aluminum/Nikasil), OEM sleeves are generally a step up from regular aftermarket cast sleeves, but not at strong or desirable as ductile iron aftermarket sleeves?

George

[Medyo Bastos]

RC-G have you priced APE sleeves? I’m not sure I’ve seen them on cbrz...


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[gschuld]

Medyo,

No I have not.  I’m primarily interested in trying to understand the differences between the types of iron used in the sleeves we use and the benefits of each for a performance application.  OEM and aftermarket varieties in general.

George

[NitroHunter]

Good question George.
I'm familiar with Darton sleeves, we use them in the TFX blocks in a pretty severe application.
I'd definitely check out their website. I found this interesting read on sleeve metallurgy here:
https://dartonsleeves.com/ductile_info.html

Also found this under their Motorcycle application.
Motorcycle
DARTON is a leader in production of motorcycle sleeves for the street and the track. Our centrifugally cast "iron" sleeves for street use are typically 20% to 30% stronger and exhibit better wear characteristics than any sleeve available at any price. The street user needs total ring seal while at the same time being assured of dependability for long mileage. DARTON sleeves are the answer. For race bikes on gas or fuel, DARTON's centrifugally cast nodular iron sleeves represent the highest strength part available for the most severe duty in any application. With DARTON sleeves, there will be no hard spots, no meltdowns and a guarantee of perfect ring seal.

[754]

I have a set of sleeves in a box   I bought years ago. The OD was different than the ones in a 970 block I have.
 The logo is not totally readable, it looks like a nut or hex, the writing is in a semi circle, i can only read the end which says sleeve.
 I wrote the measurements , as perhaps they likely change by manufacturer.
 OD of sleeve    3.0      lip OD is 3.18
 Lip is .200 long,  with 4. 125 of the 3.0 dia    OAL is 4.325
 ID is 68.7 mm or 2.708
 So looks like they are good for 1000cc and I think 970.
 It looks like they were wrapped up in 2007, not sure if they were made then.

[gschuld]

Frank,

They sound like the stamping from LA Sleeves.

Medyo has a set of 3” OD LA sleeves(stamp in picture) that came out of an RC cast block.

George

[754]

Thanks, looks like it, even the groove and lip up top look like that.
 I knew the name was too long to be LA, didn't think about full name..lol