Topic: duplicolor and spraymax 2k real advice?????

[mario medeiros]

Not sure if this is where i am to ask but.....i am hoping to do this once and want  to know by those who have used these paints some real advice.I have a gas tank that is in bare metal,i put on bondo to fill in some dents and was told to spray it with etch primer ,then 10mins later a coat of sand-able primer ,then 10mins later paint, then 10mins later a second coat of paint then 10mins later a coat of spray max and you guessed it 10mins later a second coat of spray max. Is that correct? Would it be better to have the duplicolor dry for say a week before i spray the spraymax 2k? And if that is the case do i give the tank a sand before i spraymax? Thanks guys

[calj737]

Most paints have a flash time between coats. It’s important to adhere to that so there’s still chemical adhesion before the prior coat cures.

[mario medeiros]

So don't wait a week but just spray the spraymax over the duplicolor 10mins after my 2nd coat? I was thinking leaving the paint to dry a week before adding  the clear would be better? Not sure never used spraymax before.

[calj737]

For best results: follow the directions printed on the product. They are, after all, written by the product developers. 

[mario medeiros]

Primer and paint are Duplicolor and clear coat is Spraymax 2K, sooooo??

[Yamahawk]

So don't wait a week but just spray the spraymax over the duplicolor 10mins after my 2nd coat? I was thinking leaving the paint to dry a week before adding  the clear would be better? Not sure never used spraymax before.

What kind of clear is the SprayMax? Is it Urethane, or is it 2kLacquer? Or is it enamel? It is important to know which type of products you are using.
On my tank, side covers, and headlight shell, I used the base silver/candy red Duplicolor in the quart cans... it is lacquer, which has no re-coat window... now, that is for compatible paints. As far as your etch primer, I would wait for the time called for, to paint over it with other paints, not its own re-coat window. That might be 20-30 minutes, it will tell you on the can. Now you spray the filler/primer, and wait for the wet sand window, and wet sand with 600-800grit, to reveal the low spots, with a sanding block! Then wash, rinse, dry and spray again with filler/primer... remember to wipe with a tack rag first after every coat of paint has dried. Then when your last coat of primer/filler has been sanded, and washed, dried, and wiped, THEN spray the Duplicolor base silver coat. When that looks good, let it dry (no re-coat window), wipe with tack rag, and spray the 1st candy apple red or whatever color you are using. (This is assuming your paint is candy apple base and color coat). NOW in the USA, there are no 2k lacquer products available, so I used Shop Line clear coat with hardener, after letting the Duplicolor lacquer gas off for 3 days or so. This is because the Shop Line is a Urethane, and will react if the lacquer isn't allowed to evaporate the initial solvents out of it. I have had a good result doing this.
Now, if you live in Europe or the UK, there are 2k Lacquer products available, which you could use according to their instructions over the Duplicolor lacquer without compatibility issues, I believe. Hope this clarifies things a little
Charlie

[Yamahawk]

Ok... it seems from the MSDS for SprayMax that it is acrylate resin, with Aliphatic polyisocyanates hardener. This is for use over base coat systems, which are usually acrylic enamels, or urethane paint base. I would NOT paint this immediately over Duplicolor lacquer based paint. I would wait several days for the lacquer to evaporate and stabilize on the surface before using it, and I would test it on a test panel, maybe an old side cover or piece of metal, prepped and primed and painted with Duplicolor like you are going to do with your tank. That is the only way to safely determine how it will react with the primes, and Duplicolor lacquer.
Charlie

[mario medeiros]

Thanks Yamahawk,

I am using Duplicolor  enamel paint and Spraymax 2K i will let the paint sit for at least a week before i spray the clear.

Thanks again

[05c50]

I have done exactly what you want to do. I painted a tank with Duplicolor, but wanted a more durable coating than the Duplicolor can provide. I contacted the Spraymax manufacturer and Eastwood (they sell 2k clear also) and both would not recomend using the 2k over a non 2k finish. They didn't say it would not work, but would not recomend it. I ended up painting the tank, let it sit a week (until the chemical odor disapated), scuffed the tank, and sprayed the 2k. It's been over a year since I did it and it still looks great.

.........Paul 

[Yamahawk]

Thanks Yamahawk,

I am using Duplicolor  enamel paint and Spraymax 2K i will let the paint sit for at least a week before i spray the clear.

Thanks again

There is two type of adhesion, as Cal stated, there is chemical adhesion, between compatible plants, and then there is mechanical adhesion, from lightly scuffing with wet sanding, as Paul did. Now, I am not sure about the Duplicolor Enamel, If it is car paint in spray cans, make sure of what you are using, as some is lacquer. Others offered by them might be enamel. Either way, shoot a test panel first, it doesn't have to be a large one, but check for compatibility. The adhesion is important, as your paint may shift in direct sunlight after the two paints cure. And, the 2k clear is commonly shot over base coat, which ISN'T 2k... so, they are doing ye olde CYA routine in case something screws up lol...
Now, an old painter told me that modern base coat is VERY similar to acrylic lacquer, which is what Duplicolor sells in their car paint line. After it cures, you can shoot the 2k clear. If you are not using a candy color, I would recommend a wet sand with 600-800 grit for adhesion of your clear. If using the 2 part base/candy apple paint, don't wet sand, and use it directly over or clear first with the 1k lacquer clear Duplicolor sell, then wet sand, and clear with the 2k SprayMax after it gasses off in a week.
Charlie

[Ujeni]

You will have bad adhesion between the duplicolor and spraymax coats. The spraymax stuff is a better product (about as close as you can get to painting with a proper spray gun). I would use spraymax primer, color and clear coats.

[Yamahawk]

You will have bad adhesion between the duplicolor and spraymax coats. The spraymax stuff is a better product (about as close as you can get to painting with a proper spray gun). I would use spraymax primer, color and clear coats.

Is this your actual experience with the two types of paint, or just an opinion? Have you actually sprayed the Duplicolor and then used the Spraymax over it with bad adhesion? Let us know, as I haven't used SprayMax 2k rattle can clear, but have used ShopLine 2k clear over the lacquer that Duplicolor sells in the quart cans, with no adhesion issues so far.I did let it cure for a week before clear coat. And, of course it is always better to use a product line's primer, base coat and clear, as they produce them to be compatible...
Charlie

[Ujeni]

I have used both of these products independently. I have use a duplicolor high heat engine paint primer and a urethane paint on top (was not spraymax). It was clear to me that the adhesion was not great. Did it work? Yes, but it flaked off in areas that received more stress (under bolts for example). Using duplicolor high heat engine paint for the primer and the color/top coats and then baking the part to harden the paint worked far better. Spraymax is even better than that.

Most painters will tell you that you can mix brands when it comes to things like reducers for example. But they will likely also tell you that mixing paint types (the duplicolor stuff is an enamel and the spraymax isn't) is not a good idea.

Do yourself a favor and stick with one brand that is designed to work together. It will cost you very little more and your chances of success will go up.

Good luck!

[Yamahawk]

I have used both of these products independently. I have use a duplicolor high heat engine paint primer and a urethane paint on top (was not spraymax). It was clear to me that the adhesion was not great. Did it work? Yes, but it flaked off in areas that received more stress (under bolts for example). Using duplicolor high heat engine paint for the primer and the color/top coats and then baking the part to harden the paint worked far better. Spraymax is even better than that.

Most painters will tell you that you can mix brands when it comes to things like reducers for example. But they will likely also tell you that mixing paint types (the duplicolor stuff is an enamel and the spraymax isn't) is not a good idea.

Do yourself a favor and stick with one brand that is designed to work together. It will cost you very little more and your chances of success will go up.

Good luck!

Ujeni,
Not sure why you used a high heat engine paint as a primer. It actually could have been a ceramic base paint, as that is what the high heat stuff is, at least the really high heat exhaust paint, or it could have been their enamel. I agree that high heat engine enamel should be baked for hardening, but I wouldn't use a urethane color or clear over that as it isn't made for that.
This fellow is painting his gas tank, and wants to use a regular 1k paint, and 2k clear over it... that's a lot different than what you used. Duplicolor makes a lacquer paint that isn't enamel, and that is what he really should be using on the tank, not enamel, if he wants to use a 2k clear coat over it.  I used the Duplicolor automotive acrylic lacquer that comes in quart cans, and can be reduced with acetone, but is premixed and ready to spray. They also have spray cans of lacquer in automotive color matching. You can use their 1k clear over either of those, and then use the 2k Spraymax or Shopline 2k clear over it after cure and wet sand.

Thanks Yamahawk,

I am using Duplicolor  enamel paint and Spraymax 2K i will let the paint sit for at least a week before i spray the clear.

Thanks again

I'm not sure what Duplicolor Enamel you are using, but personally I wouldn't use any of the Duplicolor Enamels for a good paint job, on a gas tank. They make auto color paint in spray cans, that match automotive paint colors, and they are all acrylic lacquer. You can clear over that with good results. There isn't really much call to clear over enamel, as it is a single stage paint that is made to just spray and let dry. So, I think the approach that you are using is not what you should do. Acrylic lacquer can be clear coated, then the 2k clear can be shot over that, after wet sanding with good adhesion.
Charlie