Topic: CB350F (car full of stuff X2) build

[wolf550]

better start this before I get too far into it.
been looking for the wife a 350f to buy and get her started riding but with these bikes being way out of my budget I started looking out of state for something I could put together and fix/build.
found the titled up in KY and a parts donor in OH.
I figure they are similar to my 550's and some areas where they are not.
all the odd and ends are in storage for now while I focus on the engines and carbs to see what the PO's left for me.
alot of weathered parts on these motors and carbs. on the titled motor there is some sort of a sealant at most of the connected areas of the motor. same with the donor motor. Every screw and bolt so far has been fighting me. I got the JIS bit into the impact screwdriver and went to work on the engine covers. after awhile with no budging I realized i just wasn't hitting hard enough. alot of good oil build up, dirt, bugs and webs in the chain guard area.
on both the 350 engines the tach plug was stuck to the rocker cover and had to drill and back out what was left of the screws.
I started unscrewing caps and saw a new surprise with the tappet adjusters having a square screw instead of flat head tops. I backed those off and took the rocker covers off to see both engines have silicone on them following the outside edge of the gaskets. one was clear and the other a shiny dark red. not sure if these were household silicones but cant wait to see what else I find inside them.
I didnt have a stand of any kind to set these engines on to let out the oil so I used a couple pieces of wood to raise high enough to slip a cut out plastic jug under the titled engine to realize that the oil pan DOES NOT HAVE A SCREW ON IT! after confirming there is supposed to be one on there by looking at the donor engine, I took to removing the oil filter housing and draining some of it from there. After picking up the engine tilting but not much coming out I decided to prep the floor with paper towels and drop the pan.
I did this on the donor motors also but was so much easier with a drain plug on them.
I am guessing that the 400 motor is mainly the same as the 350 just bored out with some different internals?
All the carbs seem to be 656 or 565 somewhere along those lines.
It started to rain so I had to bring everything outside in trying to keep it all somewhat organized.
I got them ranked with the titled motor and carbs first, the donor motor second, and the 400 motor last.
I gotta download the manual and do some reading up on this

update I was able to find a pic of the title bike before I blew it apart

[MauiK3]

Now there is a parts collection! Should be a fun journey.

[WideAWAKE]

How does the 350/4 compare to the 350 twin??

Never had or ridden a 350/4 - I’ve had 5 or 6 twins throughout the years and they were great for around town. Wish I still had a few of them.

[wolf550]

I just got to see what are the best parts and which motor is the closest to stock as there are things on each that don't seem to be original from factory but more from local shop type fixes.

Not sure how this small 350f compares to the twins but I hear great things about the 10k rev on it

[newday777]

How does the 350/4 compare to the 350 twin??

Never had or ridden a 350/4 - I’ve had 5 or 6 twins throughout the years and they were great for around town. Wish I still had a few of them.

The twin had lots of vibration, a little more power compared to the 350 four.
The 400 four was marginally stronger but more fun with the 6 speed.

[MauiK3]

I owned a 350 twin many years ago, it was a solid Honda motor but lacked poetry. The four, however, was a beautiful songstress.

[wolf550]

woke up this morning with the wife poking me in the head saying "honey... honey... you gonna work on my bike today?"
got a roller assembled to see if she can get on the bike okay. it did not have the engine so I sat on the front.
after a go from the boss, I started checking out the parts.

[wolf550]

alot of rusty and crusty all around.

[wolf550]

there was only one front fender from the titled 350f that the guys dad ran into some shrubs and bent the front.
I can chop that off and keep the rear for now.

[wolf550]

so the handlebar controls. getting the phillips screws out was not happing so they were grinded away. inside all the bits and pieces were rusted and or not there just rust dust. looks like Im going to spring for some used or repros.

[wolf550]

for some reason I thought I did not have a center stand so looking online I was giving myself the old "you gotta be kidding me" on prices for these on ebay.
luckily I dug through the parts and found it lying around.
i forgot to take a pic of the before but alot of dirt oil and sand mixed and baked for who knows how long.
alot of brushing and sanding then a shot of rust inhibitor spray until I get the rest of the parts gone through the same process.

[wolf550]

I have the good set on the roller for now but...
Im going to have fun with this.
I can see why the donor bike did not have a front fender.
anybody got a good idea besides drilling out the middle and using extractor let me know.
if that does not work its going to be a donor for the new triples.

[wolf550]

and the top triple!
I did have a good one from the donor bike but did not find it till going out the storage unit.
so after looking on ebay and finding one for 750. ( check the wanted thread about this)
yes that is 750. I asked the guy if it was a typo and he said no good luck finding one.
so I got the cracked on taped and did the first mold.
it worked out except the sand where the fork tubes go and the stem did not stay put so that will be filled.
I also beefed up the clamp areas where the crack is with putty and taped up.
these areas came out in the mold good.
guess I am on the look out for a 33mm drill bit and whatever the stem size drill bit is.
going to be heading back out to the boneyard and seeing if that 350 is still out there and maybe see about those 650 cams.

[grcamna2]

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[wolf550]

I saw that home Depot has the 33 mm drill bit for the fork hole but still need to see that the stem size is. Can't wait to give this a try.

update on those drill bits they were not in stock around here but the price seemed to change for ordering from 20 bucks to 70.

I did see amazon had both sizes available but going to hold off on them until I get some more funds.

but I can still make a blank for now and show the almost finished product with the beefier clamping points.

[RAFster122s]

EDM at a machine shop or would Alum dissolve the bolt out of the fork tube?

[wolf550]

last time I did a bolt in my 550 engine, I had to grind a hole in the middle big enough to fit the extractor.
I tried with small drill bits to no avail and then switched to diamond dremel bits.
that took forever from what I remember but made the hole deep enough to grab and pull the bolt out.

also saw on an episode of fast and loud where they used a putty that acted with the metal to bond to the other half of a bolt making a weld and just unscrewed out.

this right side on ebay did not look too expensive but since i already have a good one this is just for practice I guess.

[wolf550]

easy part done.
hard part is next.

[wolf550]

until I get those drill bits this is as far as Im getting on this side project.
reinforced the outer upper lower clamping area to look more like the 500/550 triples.
got most of the flash cast grinded away.
a couple areas that didnt fill in all the way but are not killers. they can be filled or drilled.
it could be the way I went about filling the cast. next time if this comes out I will have to flip it upside down.
I dont have a bandsaw to cut the thin space but I can take my time with a small jewel saw.
still waiting to see what the refurbished triple goes for on ebay that is listed for 125 starting bid. if it gets anywhere near that 750 price the other is going for that will be insane.

[grcamna2]

wolf,those triples you've cast look like they may work ok.
The OEM top triples seem to have a very hard type of cast aluminum;when you tap them on the side with a small wrench,they have a very high 'ring' sound that emanates out of it.

[wolf550]

Right now they have a clunk sound being a solid block but I'm sure after drilling out the holes and some of the top it will make music. About that hard type aluminum I was going to use aluminum that I melted from broken 750 657 carbs I had laying around. The reason is I had made a couple covers from them but when I went to drill out the holes they deadened my drill bits from making that shrieking sound and the drill bits were new. I don't know what other material was added in them but it would make a good triple casting material. The only problem would be drilling out these holes.

[wolf550]

got some stuff done yesterday. most of the frame parts cleaned off from the rust. still have to work on the areas of the frame before painting all the parts. and then I can get started on the carbs and then engine.
I really like the clutch cover for the 400f with that area that covers the lifter.
need to find out if that can be used on the 350f engine and if so then I just have to find that little cover and do that.

[wolf550]

wolf,those triples you've cast look like they may work ok.
The OEM top triples seem to have a very hard type of cast aluminum;when you tap them on the side with a small wrench,they have a very high 'ring' sound that emanates out of it.

also I have been interested to see if maybe using copper or brass would be a better material to use.
melted copper and melted brass.
would these have more give to the piece even if over torqued?

[Gibbon]

wolf,those triples you've cast look like they may work ok.
The OEM top triples seem to have a very hard type of cast aluminum;when you tap them on the side with a small wrench,they have a very high 'ring' sound that emanates out of it.

also I have been interested to see if maybe using copper or brass would be a better material to use.
melted copper and melted brass.
would these have more give to the piece even if over torqued?

Using Brass, or probably better one of the engineering Bronze alloys is an interesting thought. I would think the strength would be similar but would likely weight much more than Aluminium. Copper I think is more ductile than Aluminium alloy but ultimately not as strong.

A simpler solution could be to make the gap between the tightening lugs smaller.   

[wolf550]

I did see one aftermarket triple that does not clamp down on the outside of the triple but on the inside. it has a piece that once the bolt starts to screw in the piece presses up against the fork tube snugging it up.
wouldnt know how to do that though! LOL! but a machinist would.