Topic: Homemade Manometer

[acteg]

Anyone able to find a national chain that carries the 5mm threaded mig welder tips?  I checked Lowes, home depot, auto zone, pepboys, and sears and they all seemed to carry the same tips (which all appeared to be large).  Sears was half the price of lowes/home depot by the way.

[Buber]

I had good luck with the grease nipples - there is one with a proper thread, and then it's just about connecting the hose..

[w1sa]

..............only just read this thread.
I use a set of 4 vacuum gauges for carb adjustment . They work very well. I used fluid (glycerine) filled instruments with readouts to 32"/100kpa. The connectors to the carb are each drilled at 1/10".   The fluid inside the instrument dampens the oscillations/fluctuations of the pulsing vacuum to the instrument and allows for very steady needle movement/readout. No additional cumbersome valves/plumbing etc.
Fluid filled vac gauges should be readily available from industrial suppliers. I paid $85aus 3 years ago for the lot (new).

..........Cheers

[noobie dave]

I used "sticky tack" to attach the tubes to the ports...and then the engine sucked water into the Cylinders.  After they dried out I coughed up $60 for a decent set on ebay.

[MoTo-BunnY]

Anyone able to find a national chain that carries the 5mm threaded mig welder tips?  I checked Lowes, home depot, auto zone, pepboys, and sears and they all seemed to carry the same tips (which all appeared to be large).  Sears was half the price of lowes/home depot by the way.

Dunno about your Home Depot, but I saw them at our location, just the other day? They were in the tool section, right by the welders (*duh*  lol). They were 5mm thread, so they would work fine - might have to turn the end down a bit, depending on the size of hose you are using.

Also, I saw the same 5mm MIG tips at Harbor Freight for real cheap - like $5 for eight of them or something?

[WFO]

sets of these are averaging around 70 bucks delivered

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=220280897341&ssPageName=MERC_VIC_RSCKCK_Pr12_PcY_BIN_Stores_IT&refitem=330265097894&itemcount=12&refwidgetloc=closed_view_item&usedrule1=StoreCatToStoreCat&refwidgettype=cross_promot_widget&_trksid=p284.m183&_trkparms=algo%3DDR%26its%3DS%252BI%252BSS%26itu%3DISS%252BUCI%252BSI%26otn%3D12

[MoTo-BunnY]

sets of these are averaging around 70 bucks delivered

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=220280897341&ssPageName=MERC_VIC_RSCKCK_Pr12_PcY_BIN_Stores_IT&refitem=330265097894&itemcount=12&refwidgetloc=closed_view_item&usedrule1=StoreCatToStoreCat&refwidgettype=cross_promot_widget&_trksid=p284.m183&_trkparms=algo%3DDR%26its%3DS%252BI%252BSS%26itu%3DISS%252BUCI%252BSI%26otn%3D12

yeah but I'll bet money that's all China components - NO thanks! I'll use light use tools and stuff from China but not anything I have to depend on any real accuracy with. That's basically why I decided to make my own manometer set - all the retail sets I saw were either really expensive or cheap looking. I'm sure that set works and everything, but it could have been made better, ya know? Even the Morgan unit (at over $100) uses a lot of plastic - even the hose fittings?!?

I built my own for around $40 - German gauges, Italian chrome plated brass ball-valves, USA vacuum line, recycled old Honda nuts and bolts, brass hose barbs, and assembly in the US by moi   

[Buber]

I built my own for around $40 - German gauges, Italian chrome plated brass ball-valves, USA vacuum line, recycled old Honda nuts and bolts, brass hose barbs, and assembly in the US by moi   

Now, don't get me wrong but knowing the European prices and labour costs, plus shipping, there's NO WAY you can have made-in Germany gauge for 10 dollars - that is 7 or 8 euros. Sorry, those may as well be Chinese, only repacked or something in Germany.

[MoTo-BunnY]

I built my own for around $40 - German gauges, Italian chrome plated brass ball-valves, USA vacuum line, recycled old Honda nuts and bolts, brass hose barbs, and assembly in the US by moi   

Now, don't get me wrong but knowing the European prices and labour costs, plus shipping, there's NO WAY you can have made-in Germany gauge for 10 dollars - that is 7 or 8 euros. Sorry, those may as well be Chinese, only repacked or something in Germany.

dunno doOd. . .they say "Made in Germany" right below the "No Shok" logo, at the very bottom of the gauge faceplate. . . I'm looking at one, right now. Seems like that would be awfully misleading, if they weren't??

here's the listing ($3.30 each) - they are kind of small like 1 1/2" / 40mm diameter, if maybe you were thinking they were bigger or something?  Also, keep in mind that this feeBay listing is purchasing them directly from the company.


NOSHOK 1.5" Dial Size 1/8" NPT 30" Hg Vacuum Gauge NIB

[MoTo-BunnY]

I just went and took this photo - I had the feeBay photo area set up from earlier, shooting manuals, anyways (it was still a pain though - kept getting glare off of the face. .. acck!. . .thus the odd angle) . . .so here ya go   

[Buber]

Look, I don't want to scare anybody, or whatever, but
1. living in Europe
2. working in a machinery producing company
3. in cooperation dept - cooperating with Germans as supplier

sorry - I can't see it as made in Germany. Maybe "packed" or "assembled", but (just think a minute)
if 1 piece goes (as you say) for 3,5$, so that is about 2,5 euros. Where' s the profit? Where are shipping costs?

I WISH that this is like you say - but I heavily doubt.... Well, my company has opened a plant in China, yet all machinery is indeed "Made in Poland". We of course give all guarantees, we have our quality control, and the product isn't bad - but that's not 100% "made in EEU".

BUT - if they work, then what's the problem? I mean, nowadays it's so difficult to know who made what. A simple example - crankshafts, etc. for Triumphs (I read an article about it) are caste in India and other places, and blanks are only CNC machined in England. So, is it made in India, or made in England? Quality is good of course.... And the price (or profit, whatever) is right... 

[MoTo-BunnY]

Look, I don't want to scare anybody, or whatever, but
1. living in Europe
2. working in a machinery producing company
3. in cooperation dept - cooperating with Germans as supplier

sorry - I can't see it as made in Germany. Maybe "packed" or "assembled", but (just think a minute)
if 1 piece goes (as you say) for 3,5$, so that is about 2,5 euros. Where' s the profit? Where are shipping costs?

I WISH that this is like you say - but I heavily doubt.... Well, my company has opened a plant in China, yet all machinery is indeed "Made in Poland". We of course give all guarantees, we have our quality control, and the product isn't bad - but that's not 100% "made in EEU".

BUT - if they work, then what's the problem? I mean, nowadays it's so difficult to know who made what. A simple example - crankshafts, etc. for Triumphs (I read an article about it) are caste in India and other places, and blanks are only CNC machined in England. So, is it made in India, or made in England? Quality is good of course.... And the price (or profit, whatever) is right... 

You know, I'm sure with globalization and all that, things are made all over. But, a company that clearly labels the very front of the gauge faceplate with "Made in Germany" (and there are no other "Made in.  ." anywhere on it or the box) but they aren't??? It would be amazingly sleazy for them to do that, I would think - I'm just not seeing it, sorry. If factories could get away with that so easily, blatantly mislabeling countries of origin on tools and such, why is ANYTHING ever marked "Made in China" if they could just put whatever they wanted on it? They would totally make bank doing that - especially on tools and such!

These are company direct - maybe they are phasing them out or something, selling at a loss. . . who knows?  Maybe they are/were made in (former) East Germany with cheaper wages or something?  I mean, Germany still DOES make stuff, right?

Also, I have a pretty good amount of industrial experience, myself - worked at several industrial suppliers and have been around tools and turning a wrench for many, many moons, so I have seen a few things. I also worked at a foundry, in the lab, testing metal quality all day long. Took the teardrop drop thingies that came out of the molds, polished the ends, etched and examined with microscopes, Brinell hardness testing, and even worked the (very big and VERY expensive) gas spectrometer testing actual metal compositions.

China can build some stuff alright - they are doing far better than they used to and will eventually catch up in quality on the high end stuff. Looking at and using these gauges, I just don't see the looseness of assembly and sketchy quality control I see with China stuff. These gauges, right out of the box, were all within a tick mark of each other, when I checked calibration - every single one (and I bought 10 to make a few sets).

I have China dial indicators and calipers, various hand tools, compression gauge, tire gauge, etc. If these vacuum gauges are China, then they are THE best China stuff I have EVER seen - but I really don't think they are. Maybe the ABS plastic case and faceplate is, who knows. The metal parts seem to be of just too high a quality and the assembly, tight.

Also, I will have to disagree that an India made crankshaft or whatever is equal to anything originally made in England - I just don't see their metallurgy being quite there, yet. Eventually, I'm sure, but not yet. I used to do a lot of older VW stuff and the German made parts were TOTALLY better than anything I have ever seen come from India, Mexico, or Brazil (other places VW aftermarket parts are commonly made). Same thing with tools - I have NEVER seen anything China made come close to vintage or modern US, German, or England made. Heck, my little stick arms can break or stretch the jaws of a China wrench tightening a bolt - it's happened several times but NEVER with US, German, England, or quality Japanese made stuff. Maybe Chinese aerospace stuff is there, but their typical consumer products - NO way.. .. .

I'll tell you what though. . .I will go ahead and contact NoShok, for the heck of it, see if they will respond and what they say, alrighty? 

[Tower]

@Buber sounds like a practical, if not somewhat cynical fellow.  Add the old saying, "If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is." and I  can understand the perspective.  Normally, I might even tend to agree with that perspective.

However, there are always exceptions, and MoTo-BunnY may have found one.  @MoTO-BunnY, your stamp of quality approval goes a long way in my books.

So, my only question is....Do these NOSHOK folks make any other gauges and at such value prices, and if so, where can I get me some?  

[MoTo-BunnY]

@Buber sounds like a practical, if not somewhat cynical fellow.  Add the old saying, "If it sounds too good to be true, it probably is." and I  can understand the perspective.  Normally, I might even tend to agree with that perspective.

However, there are always exceptions, and MoTo-BunnY may have found one.  @MoTO-BunnY, your stamp of quality approval goes a long way in my books.

So, my only question is....Do these NOSHOK folks make any other gauges and at such value prices, and if so, where can I get me some?  

I'm pretty practical/cynical too - especially with Home-Ec and beauty stuff. The scams companies try to pass off on women for the sake of "beauty", fashion, or food stuffs are immeasurable, they are so common place. So yeah, I tend to suspect the deals that are too good to be true, in a BIG way. .. .

However, I have also seen my share of industrial surplus sales where stuff is being sold for less than the metal in them would sell for scrap, so there ARE crazy deals to be had. I think these gauges are just "on clearance" or they are "last years model" (lol) or something like that, as yes, they DO seem to be too good to be true. That's exactly why I have kinda pointed them out so people can enjoy the deal (and a great home made manometer set). The company itself, is definitely all into gauges of every type - check out their site, all sorts of crazy stuff:


http://www.noshok.com/indexmain2.html




I'm contacting them and seeing if they want to comment on their products here (or I will relay the info) - might be fun to see what they say, but unlike me, they might not have someone with a bit too much time on their hands to comment. .  he he he. 

[dn4911]

OK I just ordered 4 of the Noshok gauges from the guy's ebay store, hope they work, thanks Mo, it does look like the Noshok guy has a direct line to the Noshok store in Berea Ohio. 

I made the manometer using the set up described in Clymers with the vacuum tubes and bottles, used water and food coloring.  But instead of building the restrictors, I used the MIG tips.  Unfortunately the #4 sucked it through 15 feet of hose.  I pulled it before it hit the carb but too scary, and not sure how to control it.  Wondered if replacing the water with heavy oil would require more vacuum to pull it, but decided to go with the gauges.

Got the mig tips from a local welders' supply, they were $3.20 for 5 and fit perfectly. Although they didn't say 5 mm on the label.

[dn4911]

First, yes they do say made in Germany, and they do work with shipping they were $19 for all 4 ($3.99 plus shipping).  Now they are small, 2.5", but big enough to work.
\
My question is what is the correct number to use when synching?  My #1 is pulling a lot more ( I knew it was because that is the one that sucked the most! LOL), so I know it needs to come down, but none of the other three are the saem either.  Is there a standard to use? Or just take the average of the other three and go for that?

[TwoTired]

Don't care much about the reading on the scale.  All four should pull the same amount of vacuum.

[crystalhelix]

I made my own gauges as well from harbor freight stuff.  I will try to take some pictures in march or april when I do my balancing.

[Bodi]

Your first step is to connect all four gauges to a single pipe, and put vacuum on all four at once. They should all read the same! There may be a way to calibrate them if not (usually you remove the guts and move the needle on the shaft) or you could make a simple chart of equal readings.
The price is not unreasonably cheap, really. The gauge is brutally simple inside, and is made on automatic machines. They probably cost about 25 cents to make.
I bought a kitchen alarm clock at a dollar store - one canadian dollar. It didn't work, and I decided to take it apart to see how it worked, not expecting to be able to reassemble it (only a dollar, after all!). The problem was a simple assembly error, the main spring had not engaged its shaft correctly and I fixed that quickly and did manage to get it together again and it works fine. But, I was really disturbed that any place on earth could manufacture such a complicated device - over 20 fairly high precision parts - and ship it halfway across the world to sell it at retail for one dollar. We are screwed here where factory workers make fifty bucks an hour - there's no way we can compete.

[OldSchool_IsCool]

I was really disturbed that any place on earth could manufacture such a complicated device - over 20 fairly high precision parts - and ship it halfway across the world to sell it at retail for one dollar. We are screwed here where factory workers make fifty bucks an hour - there's no way we can compete.

With the rising costs of transportation due to energy, I wouldn't be surprised the see a need for more localized manufacture.  $50/hour prolly not, but at least local... Unless the shipping companies return to SAIL power!

[NitroHunter]

I agree with Bodi about calibrating the mechanical gauges TOGETHER from a common source. Just remember that when syncing, you're looking for a REFRENCE value - that is, all ports see the same vacuum at idle. It doesn't matter so much what the needle says, as much as they all say the same thing at the same vacuum. Some carbs just transition better at higher or lower readings.
The best dial gauges have an adjustment screw for calibration, but those were Mil-spec units. And they were calibrated for accuracy in specific ranges, much like a torque wrench.

And therein lies the beauty of common sump carb sticks.

[Popwood]

Is $80 that much of a hardship?

http://www.jcwhitney.com/Motorcycle-Fuel-System-Tools/600014252.jcw

Just wondering, this rig is now $120.99. That's a 50% price increase since last July. $80 isn't a burden, but sounds a lot better than $120. What's going on? Thoughts, ideas?

[TwoTired]

It might be lack of competition?
Since mercury was governmentally banned, the far cheaper mercury sticks are no longer sold, which used to siphon off sales.

Similar to freon, which before the ban was $1.68 per 1 lb can at K-Mart.
Now if you have a license ($$$) you can get thirty pounds for $1300.   But, for resale to customers during servicing, it's $50 -$75 per lb.
To the rescue R134a (yeah right), works almost as good as R12 freon, but at the low price of $100 to $150 per 30 Lb can. Or, about $5 to $10 a lb. to consumers.

Pretty easy to see that the mandated shift was for profit, both by the manufacturers lobby group, and the government collecting more money in tax revenue.

[hapakev]

And let us not forget DuPont and their patents on the refrigerants running out every 17 years, and magically coming out with reports of said refrigerants damaging the ozone. They always seem to come out with a new non-ozone damaging refer, that will damage the ozone in 17 years 

[winnipeg550guy]

 I was wondering, couldn't a person just use one of the manometers for dual carb set ups on a 4 carb set up by keeping 1 gauge attached to the right outer side vacuum port and using the second line to do the other 3 one at a time.
 Obviously it's much quicker to do all 4 at the same time but if times not an issue what could be wrong with doing it this way. I'm curious to know