Topic: 530 chain conversion on a 77 750

[Peters1983]

After spending all day yesterday looking for a 630 chain for my 750  and getting answers like why not change to a 530 I have deciced to look for a conversion kit.

I have found a few sunstar rear sprockets but no fronts for the conversion. Does anyone have any info on this or maybe a place that I can find a kit?(I have looked almost everywhere)

[eldar]

You can go with sunstar OR JT. I got my whole setup at mawonline.com
However, there is no reason to go to 530 if you do not want to. Less gearing combos but greater strength.

[clearcan]

Lots and lots of threads on this subject, use the search and you will get a lot of opinions!

[eldar]

You will but the bottom line is there is absolutely no REAL reason to have to do it. I went 630 for years and was fine. I went to 530 and gained nothing but did not lose anything either. Only thing you get is the somewhat greater availability of parts and a bit better gearing options but nothing to write home about.
You lose strength with the 530 but out stock bikes will not really test a good 530 chain. A 630 is virtually indestructible.

[Peters1983]

My main reason for going with a 530 is availability, every shop I went to had it readily available and all of the 630's were on back order for a while.
 
As far as gearing I would like to get a little more top end out of it but I am not really sure where to start. I ride on the highway a lot back and fourth tho work and at 70-80 I am sitting around 5-7000 RPM's

also is there any way to swap out 4th and 5th gear from a super sport?
or would it be more trouble than its worth?

[moham]

here is the info I used to do mine...

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=372.0

scroll down to the appropriate topic.

[paulages]

530 chain= less rotating mass. there's a reason. 

[Peters1983]

excellent information, I have searched a few topics with good results but some of this info I could only get from the guys who have done what I am about to undertake.

are the any difference between the front sprocket output shaft from 69 to78? I know the bikes are a little different from 69-76 and 77-78 but as far as output splines I am not sure

[BobbyR]

I buy may chain from this guy. http://www.loudfastugly.com/     I stayed with the 630, it looks right on the bike.

[eldar]

The difference between the rotating mass is completely un-noticeable. The gearing of 17/48 is slightly taller and generates a little more rpm at any speed, however I have not noticed any real increase in acceleration. All in all, availability is about the only perk. Cost MAY be slightly lower but very little.

[754]

There is a definite difference in rotating mas...

[GammaFlat]

Here's a link to some pictures of the differences between a pre-77 530 and a post-76 630 front sprocket and output shaft (as well as associated discussion).

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=37174.msg384249#msg384249

I'd love to switch to the 530 on my '77 but I'm trying to gear down (less teeth up front) as opposed to gear up. 

Keep us posted!

[eldar]

Yes there may be a difference but as the chain path is fairly narrow as opposed to say a tire, the effect is lessened.
I rode the 630 for years and then went to 530. A speed trap might show a difference but I did not notice a difference to rave about. Being a 78K rider, I think I would be a better judge than a person who rode a k8 once or not at all. As the 76 and earlier 750 only used 530.

Like I said, there is nothing wrong with doing it but there is not going to be a super difference.

[paulages]

Yes there may be a difference but as the chain path is fairly narrow as opposed to say a tire, the effect is lessened.
I rode the 630 for years and then went to 530. A speed trap might show a difference but I did not notice a difference to rave about. Being a 78K rider, I think I would be a better judge than a person who rode a k8 once or not at all. As the 76 and earlier 750 only used 530.

Like I said, there is nothing wrong with doing it but there is not going to be a super difference.

if it's the only thing a person is doing to reduce rotating mass, you probably wouldn't notice a difference. if you're advising someone else though, there is a REAL reason people do it though. modern bikes don't run smaller chains, light wheels, etc. for nothing.

[KingCustomCycles.com]

"modern bikes don't run smaller chains, light wheels, etc. for nothing." 

Exactly! too much time is spent debating and deciding what is best for performance improvements, the answer is sitting on the showroom floor of your nearest Honda dealer!

[eldar]

As the OP did not say his bike was on a diet, it makes little difference now doesn't it. If that where the case, I would say to get everything as light as possible. Make your own frame out of titanium, ect. As there were no mention of losing weight, it is a very minor consideration. As for a noticeable difference, you may notice it on a dyno or speed trap but thats it. I DO ride a K8. I HAVE used both chains. I will safely say there will be little difference. How many of you have ridden a k8 more than once if at ALL besides bobby? Most of you ride smaller or deride the K8 so while you know the 530 weighs less, you do not know if there is any actual performance gain. It would be like me saying the 550 is automatically better than the 500, even though I have never ridden one.

As for modern bikes, since when are our bikes modern? Besides that, it is not just the chain that saves all the weight. It is all the parts together with improved building methods. If you want all the light weight, then GET a modern bike.

[GammaFlat]

I ride a '77 750 (Eldar, what are the differences between a '77 and '78?... I'm sure you'd know better than me but not too many is what I'm thinking....) and I'm anxious or at least curious about converting to a 530. 

In my mind the spinning (HPs) and unsprung weight (handling) are things to not overlook.  Since the heavier 630 has seals and the 530 does not, there's less friction to overcome (yet the 530 wants more maintenance ).  I'm told the difference between a 630 and 530 at the rear wheel is about 1 HP in favor of the 530.  That's about a 2% "free-ish" increase in horsies.  I'll take "free" for a chain that costs less (assuming I'm in need to replace which frankly is not too likely with a 630). 

I'm just not sure if I can get over the "output shaft difference problem" to my satisfaction (see the link in my previous post in this thread). 

Anyone found a 530 front sprocket that takes two bolts to hold it down?

[paulages]

Anyone found a 530 front sprocket that takes two bolts to hold it down?

all the early ones do. sprocket specialist sprockets use a circlip which works quite fine.

eldar- i really don't care to argue with you, i was just pointing out that there is a "real" reason to switch. you're never gonna break a modern 530 chain that is properly maintained, and the benefit is hardly mythical. to each his own i guess.

[ev0lution7]

uh ya the chain costs more but concider this:

1. time spent researching sprocket combos that are CLOSE to the 15/41 that came on the "K" model...
2. time spent chasing down and remembering were you bought those parts .... 3000miles ago because a 530 chain will not hold up as much
3. the initial cost of buying sprockets (530) sometimes its hard to bite off the first time i know that next time it will be cheaper on a chain but the chain does not last as long...
4. you will not notice a difference i rode a 78F and i rode it before and after the conversion and i couldnt tell at ALL even "free HP" i just couldnt tell now give someone "free" 10% power and you will fell it you wont feel 1 HP!
5. just buy your 630 chain (get an xw ring) from Z1enterprises.com they are cheepest around ship fast i run one on my bike and ran a roller 630 on my last 750 (which was way warn out) for well over 9k miles without a problem 630 rocks!

i also considered doing this swap when i was rebuilding my bike instead i opted for the 630 due to the minimal maints that they require and there is a reason honda added this chain to the 77-78's i think and at the time i bought new sprockets because i'm anal and i like to have new sprockets every other chain and well my old sprockets and rusty chian (sat for 10+ years) was worn out so bottom line if it aint broke dont fix it... unless your making a cafe bike and want to spend all weekend working on your bike and ridding for 3 hours just to do it again... come on i rode the first 300 miles on my chain and the book says to check and adjust after 100 miles and my chain was Exactly were it was when i left on the maiden voyage! no adjustment nessicarry.. so i threw some lube on there and called it a day...

[eldar]

One more back from ev0. Gamma, You should just be able to get k8 conversion sprockets. That's what I did at mawonline.com

As for seals, the original chain had seals but you will not want to get a standard 530 roller. You will also want seals and those chains have greater tensile strength. A 530 X-ring is still less in tensile than your average 630 roller. It is the seals that rob power.

As for unsprung weight, there are a lot of other areas than the chain that will make a bigger difference. The narrow path of a chain reduced the effects of unsprung weight AND rotational mass. It is all about speeds. Take a 1 ounce weight at halfways on a spoke, now move it to the end and there is greater effect. Same principal with the chain.

[BobbyR]

Chains and oil are threads that can go on forever. I use a 630 cause I get them reasonable and it looks better. I may lose 1 hp, but I am sure I lose more than 1 HP when I sit straight up. Rotating mass works both ways. It takes a bit more to get it up to speed, however it also acts like a flywheel when once you have it moving. Honda went 630 after they had a lot of chain breakages, I am sure they softened up the rear hub rubbers also since I just bought a new set from Honda and they are quite soft. Today the alloys make the 530 very strong. The sportbikes use the the 530's, but the sportbikes have a lot of design changes over our steel tube frames. It may be the 539 allows them to use a more compact design.
This is a matter of choice. If you use a quality 530 or 630 and maintain it you will be fine.   

[754]

630 chain..the end of an error..


How ,any bikes did you guys say , run them nowadays?

[PJ]

I agree with Bobbyr, Alot of bikes have been junked over a broken chain slapping a hole in the case. It seems like it was fairly common back then. I will have to buy a chain soon, it may or may not make a huge difference but I think I'll stay with the 630 so I can sleep a little better.

[eldar]

754, as the 630 is available from almost every chain manufacturer, I would say the 630 is relatively common. You can bet d.i.d, rk and others would NOT make a chain for 2 years of 1 bike. That should be all the proof you need. Anytime a business even gets an idea that something is not going to be profitable, they drop it like a turd. So clearly there are still a lot of bikes out there running 630.

The end of an error came when honda redesigned the ugly pre-76 750 into something that actually looked decent.

[mustangcar]

replaced my 630chain with an rk630,,what i noticed it has not needed any retightning on the chain after putting 1000 miles on it,,i guess having less links in the chain is less pivets to wear out thus less chain wear, been using chain parrafin wax spray , i like the 630 ,,some biker girls went up to it and said wow thats a big one    k8