Author Topic: Main Jet Size  (Read 9451 times)

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Dan-O

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Main Jet Size
« on: January 28, 2009, 09:22:19 am »
I'm going to run my CB750 with air filter pods and open exhaust. Currently the high speed jets are stock or 110 in size I believe. I'm sure others have already done the work so hopefully I can get someone to share that knowledge.

What size of jets should I use?

Thanks,
Dan

Offline sangyo soichiro

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Re: Main Jet Size
« Reply #1 on: March 02, 2009, 12:35:18 pm »
Hi Dan,
I went to pod filters and a 4 into 1 exhaust (after using makeshift drag pipes).

I put in #120's.  These worked very well for the drag pipes, but I notice a little mid-range hesitation with the 4-1 exhaust.  I will probably have to try more sizes and play with it more.  You may start with this size (or your own best guess), but you'll probably have to play with different sizes to see what works best.  The jets aren't too expensive (around 2 and a half bucks a piece (you'll need 4)).

From what I gather, there are many factors that affect the engine's respiration.  There are some rules of thumb in jet sizing, but in the end, it seems to boil down to trial and error.

Many folks use the spark-plug reading technique where you try to tell if the engine is rich or lean from how the plugs look.  I would not be able to explain this technique adequately here.  There are pictures of spark-plugs from various degrees of fuel/air mixtures to compare with.  I even think my Clymers manual has some of these pictures.

Another thing to try is playing with the choke while riding (higher than idle RPMs).  Basically, if the engine hesitates while riding, try the choke.  Either the engine will perform better, worse, or no difference.  If it runs better, then your mains may be too small (remember, you are choking the air intake).  If it runs worse, then the mains may be too large.  If there is no difference, then maybe the problem's not necessarily with the jetting.

Another thing you'll have to adjust is the slow jets.  My '72 CB 750 has adjustment screws (I didn't have to change the stock #40 slow jets).  Basically, as you idle down (such as when you're coming to a stop light), if you hear popping in the exhaust, then that means that there's fuel in the pipes that's cooking off.  You'll want to adjust the slow jets so that you minimize this popping noise. 

This discussion would not be complete without a mention of carburetor balancing (also called synchronizing).  This involves hooking up vacuum gauges to the carbs and adjust the carbs so that they all pull about the same vacuum.  I've seen some home-made 'manometers,' some inexpensive manufactured ones, and also gauges that are a slightly more expensive.  Balancing is a little out of the scope of this post.  It is not difficult, but when you attempt it, I suggest reading a more detailed description of the procedure than what I could try to give here.  Perhaps someone in the forum has already explained it (not sure... I'm still new here).


Best of luck to you.  It's a lot of fun playing with these bikes.
« Last Edit: March 02, 2009, 12:40:18 pm by soichiro »
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Offline BobbyR

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Re: Main Jet Size
« Reply #2 on: March 02, 2009, 02:57:48 pm »
Dan, this is very heated topic and has been discussed and discussed. If you do a search you will see the threads. There are people who have had good luck with PODS and they go into great detail as to what they did. You will find what you are looking for in there I am sure.
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Offline sangyo soichiro

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Re: Main Jet Size
« Reply #3 on: March 02, 2009, 03:44:30 pm »
Dan, this is very heated topic....

I'm curious... why is it heated?  Am I correct in assuming that there are two schools of thought - one for pods, the other against?  Or is the heat due to jetting?  I suppose I could try to find the discussions, but thought I'd ask anyway.
1974 CB 750
1972 CB 750 http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,57974.0.html
1971 CL 350 Scrambler
1966 Black Bomber
Too many others to name…
My cross country trip: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,138625.0.html

Offline BobbyR

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Re: Main Jet Size
« Reply #4 on: March 02, 2009, 03:53:46 pm »
Dan, this is very heated topic....

I'm curious... why is it heated?  Am I correct in assuming that there are two schools of thought - one for pods, the other against?  Or is the heat due to jetting?  I suppose I could try to find the discussions, but thought I'd ask anyway.
Fair enough question. There are pro and anti POD factions. Some people have had problems with crosswinds causing losses of power and other ills. On the other hand, some people have had great luck with them. I am stock since my bike is stock and I am also a lazy bastid so I keep my tinkering to just what I need to make the bike safe and running well.
I suggest you read the threads so that you will see what the people who have had good luck did, this will make it easier and faster for you on the long run.
Dedicated to Sgt. Howard Bruckner 1950 - 1969. KIA LONG KHANH.

But we were boys, and boys will be boys, and so they will. To us, everything was dangerous, but what of that? Had we not been made to live forever?

Dan-O

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Re: Main Jet Size
« Reply #5 on: March 02, 2009, 03:57:52 pm »
Thanks "soichiro"... Very informative. Now I'll do the search on the "heated" pod subject. I like the looks of the pods over the stock breathers. That's why I decided to go with the pods. I didn't figuar individual pod filters would make a big differance.

Thanks
 

Offline coyotecowboy

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Re: Main Jet Size
« Reply #6 on: March 03, 2009, 10:59:37 pm »
If you're running a low-restriction (read uncorked) 4-1 and pods go ahead and get 125s and 130s.  I started with 120s and the needles in the 4th position (one up from the bottom slot) and off idle and mid range acceleration were really good, but it would run out of gas on the top end and the plugs confirmed it.  Went to 125s and it was better, but not perfect especially in 4th and 5th when it was really pulling.  Stepped up to 130s, now it pulls hard to redline in every gear and my plugs look great.  I like to ride fast and it's windy here, so I try to run a tad on the rich side.


BUT..... (you knew this was coming) differences between well, basically everything under the sun, might dictate different sizes for your bike.  Altitude, miles on the carbs, type of pods, type of header (Yosh here  ;D ) earths rotation, phase of the moon, and that little Irishman named Murphy that rides #$%* with you everywhere could affect any and all of the above.
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Dan-O

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Re: Main Jet Size
« Reply #7 on: March 04, 2009, 04:47:00 pm »
Thanks coyotecowboy... I bought a multi set of jets, 120-140 I believe. I put in the 130's but haven't touched the needles yet. When it warm enough I'll give it a try.  Thanks again.

Offline sangyo soichiro

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Re: Main Jet Size
« Reply #8 on: March 04, 2009, 05:07:08 pm »
It's a good thing others were reading this thread... I totally forgot to mention adjusting the needles.  (I didn't have to adjust mine by the way.  But then again, it's not running quite right since I put the 4-1 exhaust on....)
1974 CB 750
1972 CB 750 http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,57974.0.html
1971 CL 350 Scrambler
1966 Black Bomber
Too many others to name…
My cross country trip: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,138625.0.html

Offline rafanomenon

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Re: Main Jet Size
« Reply #9 on: April 12, 2009, 01:47:21 am »
I can vouch for this being a "trial and error" process. I'm a relative n00b to the whole process, and I've had to approach it with an open mind, and not 100% confident in knowing what I was doing. Yay.

I have a '77 750F. Started out with pods because I was tired of removing the airbox for multiple carb diagnostics. I also like they way they look and how they clean up the middle section behind the motor. I bumped the mains to 120. A week later, my cycle X 4-2-1 pipe arrived and noticed a "gargling" sound every time the throttle snapped above 5,000 rpm. It needed more gas. I moved up to 125. Still the gargling, but not as bad. Moved up to 130. There's still a little gargle and popping, but close to redline, so I think I'm almost there. I may go 132 to get it just right, or 135 to run it a little rich.

Now I'm noticing a lagging throttle response in the lower range, 1,000-3,000, so i may move the needles up one-click to see if that does anything. after reading coyotecowboy's response, I'm positive that moving the needles up will help with the lower range. Sucks that needles are more of a pain to adjust than jets :( Hopefully I can dial it after these final adjustments so I can finally carb sync, which will also be my first attempt at doing.

Point of post: It takes a LOT of jetting, riding, removing carbs, rejetting, assembly, riding, repeating, etc. to hear and see what you're looking for... Best of luck!


Offline stockscreamer

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Re: Main Jet Size
« Reply #10 on: May 30, 2009, 12:48:54 pm »
I have just converted to pods I have had the 4 into 1 pipe damn near since I bought the cb750k 75' around 4 to 5 years ago. When I converted to pods I set the needle clip down one and popped in some 135 mains set the air screws at 1 1/4 turns out took her for a ride for the first time. Can really tell the difference pulls like a freight train through all 5 gears. (Loved having to hold the bars tight so I wouldn't fly off the back) :) couldn't believe hitting 100 that fast.
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