Author Topic: what electronics can you upgrade? (78 cb750)  (Read 14120 times)

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Offline timdhawk

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what electronics can you upgrade? (78 cb750)
« on: February 26, 2009, 07:50:35 pm »
using smallest form factor as the template, (cafe project) what electrical upgrades are recommended when the OEM look/layout is not part of the equation?

i.e.- modern rectifier/regulator upgrade , electronic ignition, fuse holder, etc

ideas/links appreciated.

 
« Last Edit: February 27, 2009, 12:28:27 pm by timdhawk »
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Offline GammaFlat

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Re: help w/ electrical upgrades list - 78 cb750
« Reply #1 on: February 26, 2009, 08:24:26 pm »
I am right in the middle of gutting my electrical "panel".  I will publish all that I'm doing but just to get you a preview, I'm changing the fuse holder, rectifiers, voltage regulators, connectors, etc.  Here's what mine looked like before the surgery (stole this from a recent post):


This stuff is NOT rocket science and I have to be thankful to this forum for getting me the "scoop". 
1) Starting from the top left is the fuse box - take out the 2 8mm bolts, follow the cable attached to it and unplug it from the harness and you'll have your fusebox in your hand.
2) middle is the voltage regulator (with the 3 leads going to it).  See the green/white/black sticker?  Wadda ya know, those are the corresponding wires going to it - more on this later in the post - I think I have a smaller, very cheap and more efficient solution for this which might fit your needs. 
3) Lower right - Rectifier (nice arrangement of diodes that turns AC from your alternator to DC).   You can follow the wires up to it's plug.  I'm replacing this too.  In theory, newer rectifiers are more efficient (essentially make less heat and therefor have less losses). 
4) The red circled thingy is the mystery dangling green wire.  It's a harmless ground that can be used on a flasher that needs one or possibly on a solid state voltage regulator that needs a ground... hmmmmm
5) The bottom left - looks like a black boxy thing is a diode that does not exist in all incarnations (years).  It's related to your neutral switch/cutout circuit.
6) Cannister looking thing (upper middle - right-ish) - solenoid. 

This picture was "liberated" from user DHonda's post - Thanks Man!

The below picture shows a Ford Regulator (Duralast VR730) available at AutoZone for 13 bucks (sitting next to a Honda VR).  I tore it apart - it used to be mechanical inside like the Honda's but is now solid state but has the same "form factor"/case that it had when originally introduced. 


I tore it apart and tin-snipped the daylights out of it to get it down to this - compare the size of the white connector with the above picture - it's the same "guts" with all the tin cut away (now 2"x2" overall):


I also bought some connector parts and tools from www.vintageconnnections.com (nice guy and great stuff - hey, how did that old rectifier sneak into the picture?):


I'm having a blast working on this stuff and expect to do a "step-by-step" on the forum.  Stay tuned. 

John


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Offline timdhawk

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Re: help w/ electrical upgrades list - 78 cb750
« Reply #2 on: February 27, 2009, 12:27:44 pm »
any others beside gamma?
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Offline HavocTurbo

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Re: what electronics can you upgrade? (78 cb750)
« Reply #3 on: February 27, 2009, 12:44:59 pm »
I would say:

electronic ignition (dyna)
coils (dyna)
modern reg/rect
custom fuse box (blade style)
custom wiring loom

That what you were looking for?
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Offline 78CB750CAFE

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Re: what electronics can you upgrade? (78 cb750)
« Reply #4 on: February 27, 2009, 02:03:57 pm »
What Havoc said...
Also, if you get a new starter solenoid from Honda it is about half the size of the original.

I have got a solid state reg/rec from Mikes, one of the new Honda solenoids, bladed fuses, led lights everywhere but the headlight, relayed lights and horns, a Hondaman ignition box and an AGM battery. Most of these things are smaller then the stock bits, and way more efficient than the 30 year old stuff, which makes your charging system a little happier.

I will post some pics of my set up soon, luckily my seal and sidecover is off already because I just made a new battery cable, and shortened the stock leads for the ground and solenoid to starter wire.

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Offline bwaller

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Re: what electronics can you upgrade? (78 cb750)
« Reply #5 on: February 27, 2009, 02:52:36 pm »
Just made a bracket with four individual blade fuse holders (cheap), and the coil relay for the Dyna's beside it. An Oregon rectifier/regulator attaches out of sight under the battery box. Electronic flasher relay is behind the solenoid. Headlight relays in the bucket.



Offline cben750f0

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Re: what electronics can you upgrade? (78 cb750)
« Reply #6 on: February 27, 2009, 03:46:47 pm »
i swapped out my melted box with a newer blade type fuse box..



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Offline rachet

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Re: what electronics can you upgrade? (78 cb750)
« Reply #7 on: February 27, 2009, 05:22:05 pm »
Very cool stuff!  With my Cafe build I want to minimize everything to hide it better.  I'll subscribe to any and all electrical builds along these lines!  In fact... maybe I'll search "electrical" and see how many posts show up.

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Offline timdhawk

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Re: what electronics can you upgrade? (78 cb750)
« Reply #8 on: February 27, 2009, 07:06:30 pm »
thanx guys, thats what im looking for... keep'em coming!
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Offline CrescentSon

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Re: help w/ electrical upgrades list - 78 cb750
« Reply #9 on: February 28, 2009, 01:41:33 am »

4) The red circled thingy is the mystery dangling green wire.  It's a harmless ground that can be used on a flasher that needs one or possibly on a solid state voltage regulator that needs a ground... hmmmmm


I read that the "red circle thingy" was for the European regulator, just so they could mass produce harnesses for both sides o' the pond.
-Daniel

Offline timdhawk

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Re: what electronics can you upgrade? (78 cb750)
« Reply #10 on: March 02, 2009, 10:58:04 am »
anybody else?
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Offline Duke McDukiedook

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Re: what electronics can you upgrade? (78 cb750)
« Reply #11 on: March 02, 2009, 01:36:47 pm »
LED lights, running, blinker, stop. I think that about covers everything electrical on the bike (the whole post).
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Offline 78CB750CAFE

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Re: what electronics can you upgrade? (78 cb750)
« Reply #12 on: March 02, 2009, 01:46:52 pm »
LED idiot light replacement bulbs too
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Offline SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan

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Re: what electronics can you upgrade? (78 cb750)
« Reply #13 on: March 02, 2009, 05:51:23 pm »
(1) Solid State Rectifier/Regulator;
(2) NOS Fusebox;
(3) NOS or replica Wire Harness (you will probably need to go with a K0/K2/K6 replica since K7 and K8's are impossible to find);
(4) Dyna-S or Dyna 2000 Ignition and 3.0 ohm coils;
(5) New Headlight
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Offline CrescentSon

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Re: what electronics can you upgrade? (78 cb750)
« Reply #14 on: March 03, 2009, 03:22:19 pm »
Info or part numbers please...
Oh and a few questions. 
(1) Solid State Rectifier/Regulator
My Stock reg/rec are separate, is the afore mentioned solid state unit a 2 in 1 and is a 2 in 1 preferred?
...if you get a new starter solenoid from Honda it is about half the size of the original.

I have got a solid state reg/rec from Mikes, one of the new Honda solenoids, bladed fuses, led lights everywhere but the headlight, relayed lights and horns, a Hondaman ignition box and an AGM battery. Most of these things are smaller then the stock bits, and way more efficient than the 30 year old stuff, which makes your charging system a little happier.
Being ignorant (in nearly every aspect of the word) to electronics, I was wondering if the solenoids are interchangeable, or do I need one off a specific newer model for a CB750-F3?  Who is mike pedaling the reg/rec's?

I'm also planning on the Hondaman transistorized ignition if that makes a difference. 

...and stop giggling damnit, not knowing electronics doesn't make me less of a man!
-Daniel

Offline timdhawk

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Re: what electronics can you upgrade? (78 cb750)
« Reply #15 on: March 03, 2009, 07:42:38 pm »
can we get links to items and/or part numbers...?
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Offline HondaMan

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Re: help w/ electrical upgrades list - 78 cb750
« Reply #16 on: March 03, 2009, 09:09:05 pm »
I am right in the middle of gutting my electrical "panel".  I will publish all that I'm doing but just to get you a preview, I'm changing the fuse holder, rectifiers, voltage regulators, connectors, etc. 

Way cool!  8)
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Offline GammaFlat

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Re: what electronics can you upgrade? (78 cb750)
« Reply #17 on: March 04, 2009, 12:47:49 am »
can we get links to items and/or part numbers...?

Here you go on what I'm doing so far.  Soon I'll have lots of this stuff installed.  I'm hoping to keep up with the pictures and possibly a video. 
Wonderful connectors and tools:
http://www.vintageconnections.com/


Blade Fuse Holder at http://www.wiringproducts.com/index1.html part number AF-CFB4


Ford Voltage Regulator from Autozone (I chopped mine up - before pic and after)
http://www.autozone.com/R,1783273/initialAction,partProductDetail/store,2548/partType,00097/shopping/partProductDetail.htm;jsessionid=A63C007A819BB82E322506AD28C00007
Ford voltage regulator on the left and Honda on the right:


After I butchered up the Ford regulator - I hope to get it inside the Honda enclosure (yes, it's the same one as the above pic.  I pulled the top off - it seemed to be glued, then I got the tin snips out and cut away most of the rest (The AutoZone part number is VR730):


RadioShack rectifiers (25A 50V) - better ones can be used but I got antsy and found them locally.
Find it here: http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2062584
Also shown in this pic is a heat sink from an AMD CPU based computer (not sure of the vintage but heat sinks are cheap and widely available - mine is just an old spare part. 

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Offline 78CB750CAFE

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Re: what electronics can you upgrade? (78 cb750)
« Reply #18 on: March 04, 2009, 04:19:20 am »



Info or part numbers please...
Oh and a few questions.
Quote from: CB750 Cafe Racer Fan on March 02, 2009, 08:51:23 pm
(1) Solid State Rectifier/Regulator
My Stock reg/rec are separate, is the afore mentioned solid state unit a 2 in 1 and is a 2 in 1 preferred?
Quote from: 78CB750CAFE on February 27, 2009, 05:03:57 pm
...if you get a new starter solenoid from Honda it is about half the size of the original.

I have got a solid state reg/rec from Mikes, one of the new Honda solenoids, bladed fuses, led lights everywhere but the headlight, relayed lights and horns, a Hondaman ignition box and an AGM battery. Most of these things are smaller then the stock bits, and way more efficient than the 30 year old stuff, which makes your charging system a little happier.
Being ignorant (in nearly every aspect of the word) to electronics, I was wondering if the solenoids are interchangeable, or do I need one off a specific newer model for a CB750-F3?  Who is mike pedaling the reg/rec's?

I'm also planning on the Hondaman transistorized ignition if that makes a difference.

...and stop giggling damnit, not knowing electronics doesn't make me less of a man!



I am pretty sure the solenoids are the same/interchangeable right through the Nighthawks and Rebels.

I lost my computers OS so I cant track down "Mikes".... I remember I found them originally through an add in one of the classic bike mags.... try googling "mikes motorcycle electrics" or I believe Z1, cyclex and even Bike Bandit sells the same product. It is 2 in 1, and requires that you chop off connector to stock one and replace w/ either a diff 6 circuit plug or some spade terminals.

Me and a hundred other people here on the board will readily sing the praises of the Hondaman box.... do a site search and see all the raves.
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Offline goon 1492

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Re: what electronics can you upgrade? (78 cb750)
« Reply #19 on: March 04, 2009, 06:52:03 am »
I found a few things in the dennis kirk catalog last night for leds I will find a link and post it later, Gamma flat keep it comin' your going to make me do the same to mine this year with your help.  ;D ;D
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Offline J.Webster Designs

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Re: what electronics can you upgrade? (78 cb750)
« Reply #20 on: March 04, 2009, 07:12:34 am »
yeah... Gamma.. I am interested in what you are doing as well.... I want to redo my entire electrical and will be following your process and parts closely.
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Offline SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan

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Re: what electronics can you upgrade? (78 cb750)
« Reply #21 on: March 04, 2009, 09:35:40 am »
I'd say the 2-in-1 solid-state rectifier/regulator, I think it's a good idea if you want to reduce clutter and replace worn, old electronics that may crap out on you -- especially if you are not going the OEM restoration route and your emphasis is on reliability and performance.   You can buy them at:

Cycle X ($117) http://www.cyclexchange.net/Elec%20System%20Comp%20Page.htm

David Silver Spares ($83) http://www.davidsilverspares.co.uk/parts/part_40963/

Parts n More ($95) https://www.partsnmore.com/cat_index.php?model=cb750_sohc&category=electrical

Z1 Enterprises ($63) http://www.z1enterprises.com/detail.aspx?ID=2055
« Last Edit: March 04, 2009, 10:00:45 am by CB750 Cafe Racer Fan »
1975 CB550K1 "Blue" Stockish Restomod (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=135005.0)
1975 CB550F1 frame/CB650 engine hybrid "The Hot Mess" (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,150220.0.html)
2014 MV Agusta Brutale Dragster 800
2015 Yamaha FZ-09 (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,186861.0.html)

"There are some things nobody needs in this world, and a bright-red, hunch-back, warp-speed 900cc cafe racer is one of them — but I want one anyway, and on some days I actually believe I need one.... Being shot out of a cannon will always be better than being squeezed out of a tube. That is why God made fast motorcycles, Bubba." Hunter S. Thompson, Song of the Sausage Creature, Cycle World, March 1995.  (http://www.latexnet.org/~csmith/sausage.html and https://magazine.cycleworld.com/article/1995/3/1/song-of-the-sausage-creature)

Sold/Emeritus
1973 CB750K2 "Bionic Mongrel" (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=132734.0) - Sold
1977 CB750K7 "Nine Lives" Restomod (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=50490.0) - Sold
2005 RVT1000RR RC51-SP2 "El Diablo" - Sold
2016+ Triumph Thruxton 1200 R (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,170198.0.html) - Sold

Offline dragon79

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Re: what electronics can you upgrade? (78 cb750)
« Reply #22 on: March 04, 2009, 10:03:59 am »
anyone know if these will work on 550's?

Offline HavocTurbo

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Re: what electronics can you upgrade? (78 cb750)
« Reply #23 on: March 04, 2009, 10:19:22 am »
anyone know if these will work on 550's?

While some are "model specific" - they can all be adapted to work on any bike.
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Offline GammaFlat

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Re: what electronics can you upgrade? (78 cb750)
« Reply #24 on: March 05, 2009, 04:29:25 pm »
Built the fusebox assembly today.  I used parts listed earlier in this post. 

I used the original wire but everything else is new.  The fuse holder has blade connectors.  I decided to enlarge the hole in the male blade connector, poke the wire through and solder it in place.  In order to solder these parts, I removed them from the holder with my nifty "removal tool" (small screwdriver will do it).  Then I put some "heat shrink tubing" over the soldered / exposed connector.  Then the tubing over all wires, then installed ends for the 6 connector plug.  Those connectors were installed using the fancy shmancy crimper/connector tool from vintageconnectors.com.

I chose not to use the blade connectors in a conventional way for one primary reason - losses.  I've now taken three fuse boxes off of my three different bikes (Honda 750s) and every one of them was melted (the plastic part of the fuse holder) to some degree.  It was always the 15amp fuse holder (main).  Back to my reasoning... I'm thinking that if I add a female connector to the end of the wire and then plug the female connector onto the male fuse holder, I'm adding more opportunity for loss.  Every extra connector is an opportunity and to some degree certainty that you'll have additional loss. 

I have a piece of flat aluminum that I'll use to adapt the new fuse holder to the same spot as the old one. 

I am by no means an expert and am kind of winging it so your input/criticisms are welcome. 

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K7 
Suzuki GN400 - Ignition fixed!
03 KLR650 - Doesn't do anything very well but.. well.. does everything.