Topic: Multiple murder in Darien IL

[syth82]

http://www.dailyherald.com/story/?id=364217

The article pretty much says it all. I work two bays down from where Jacob did at the suburban BMW dealership. He seemed like an ok guy to me, never said a bad word about anyone else, I've never seen him angry.

[tramp]

what makes people think of doing those things
never in my wildest nightmares could i stalk down people and kill them
how cheap is human life?

[syth82]

that's the thing to me... I know this guy, talked to him every day, grabbed lunch with him several times. I could never imagine him doing anything like this. It's absolutly insane.

[sangyo soichiro]

It makes me wonder if anyone is capable of anything at any time.


That's usually what I hear; "I would have never expected it...."


Just Sunday a 13 year old kid killed his Grandfather just the next town over from me.

[edbikerii]

The article said that there was a "heated custody battle".  I wonder if the mother and her family had been denying the father contact with (or threatening to), or otherwise harming the child, shortly before the incident.  The father may have been exasperated with family court nonsense, and finally flipped out.

Surely no excuse for murder, but family courts are desperately in need of reform for these kinds of abuses.  Family courts are notorious revenue generators for unscrupulous attorneys at the cost of ruining millions of children's lives.

[syth82]

That would probable make me feel better about it (not much), but it appears to be a contract killing, my co-worker didn't even know the people he killed.

[mystic_1]

The article said that there was a "heated custody battle".  I wonder if the mother and her family had been denying the father contact with (or threatening to), or otherwise harming the child, shortly before the incident.  The father may have been exasperated with family court nonsense, and finally flipped out.

Are you basing these conjectures on anything, or are you just throwing out unsubstantiated wild ass guesses?

Because we could also wonder if the murder victims were former Nazis, aliens from another planet, or cannibals.  We could also wonder if the father was the one who was harming the child, and perhaps he wanted to gain custody in order to have someone to continue to victimize.

See how useless this sort of "wondering" is?

mystic_1

[edbikerii]

No, I read the article, and I simply choose to remain objective.  There's no telling what kind of crazy #$%* the mother or her family pulled, but the reporter most certainly did not investigate that, or even raise the question.  As for conjecture, are we to assume, based on the reporter's conjecture, that the dude was just nuts and had no motive?  I prefer to believe --as any objective person or investigator should-- that there was a motive.  The most obvious motive is the presence of a "heated custody battle".

Either way, there are heinous abuses committed on either side of custody battles every day, and events like this might actually serve to shed some light on the problems and biases within the family court system.  Better to make a positive out of something so negative, no?

Further, MOTIVE is merely a reason -- NOT AN EXCUSE!!!

The article said that there was a "heated custody battle".  I wonder if the mother and her family had been denying the father contact with (or threatening to), or otherwise harming the child, shortly before the incident.  The father may have been exasperated with family court nonsense, and finally flipped out.

Are you basing these conjectures on anything, or are you just throwing out unsubstantiated wild ass guesses?

Because we could also wonder if the murder victims were former Nazis, aliens from another planet, or cannibals.  We could also wonder if the father was the one who was harming the child, and perhaps he wanted to gain custody in order to have someone to continue to victimize.

See how useless this sort of "wondering" is?

mystic_1

[mystic_1]

I wouldn't agree that you're being objective, as you're assuming wrongdoing on the part of the victims.

On objective position would be more like, "we don't have enough information to postulate causes of this crime."

mystic_1

[edbikerii]

OK, I see your viewpoint, and it is valid.  Just for clarity, I am not assuming wrongdoing, but I am introducing the possibility into the discussion as a very likely motive.

I wouldn't agree that you're being objective, as you're assuming wrongdoing on the part of the victims.

On objective position would be more like, "we don't have enough information to postulate causes of this crime."

mystic_1

[HavocTurbo]

OMG someone smack me.... I arrived at the same emotional conclusion as Ed!!!

Gah!!!


 

Here in IL the courts are HEAVILY biased towards the mother. Even going so far as to allow her custody even while enrolled in various abuse programs.

Not to say that the courts here are one sided.... but they border that line almost everyday. My friend fought his drug/alcohol abusing "baby momma" for almost 3 years before the court would take away the child. She left it alone in a car twice, lost the child in all sorts of various public places, even forgot her in a gas station.

Yet every time they continued to give the child back saying... "that the mother is an integral part of early child development."

And yet still.... I agreed with Ed. OMG someone smack some sense into me.  


lol sorry Ed I find this funny. (the replies, not the people who were killed, I feel horrible for their families losses)

[edbikerii]

Wow, HT, I had no idea that you felt you disagree with me on so many issues.  I thought you and I were quite well aligned on excessive size of government, excessive government control, excessive government intrusion into our daily lives, excessive taxation, and plenty of other issues.

As far as I recall, the only issue we had a disagreement on was socialized medicine.

OMG someone smack me.... I arrived at the same emotional conclusion as Ed!!!

Gah!!!


 

Here in IL the courts are HEAVILY biased towards the mother. Even going so far as to allow her custody even while enrolled in various abuse programs.

Not to say that the courts here are one sided.... but they border that line almost everyday. My friend fought his drug/alcohol abusing "baby momma" for almost 3 years before the court would take away the child. She left it alone in a car twice, lost the child in all sorts of various public places, even forgot her in a gas station.

Yet every time they continued to give the child back saying... "that the mother is an integral part of early child development."

And yet still.... I agreed with Ed. OMG someone smack some sense into me.  


lol sorry Ed I find this funny. (the replies, not the people who were killed, I feel horrible for their families losses)

[HavocTurbo]

Yessir that is most likely our only obvious split point.

I was making an exaggerated observation based on the high emotions this subject has seemed to stir up.

But in all honesty I find myself taking opposite sides almost automatically. Sometimes it's kind of scary.

Please forgive my apparent lack of sarcasm skills over the interwebs.

[edbikerii]

No harm, no foul.  I even think that if the healthcare "debate" were broken down into its individual issues rather than constantly being treated as a wholesale government overhaul, we would also reach agreement on many, if not most, of the key issues.

Yessir that is most likely our only obvious split point.

I was making an exaggerated observation based on the high emotions this subject has seemed to stir up.

But in all honesty I find myself taking opposite sides almost automatically. Sometimes it's kind of scary.

Please forgive my apparent lack of sarcasm skills over the interwebs.