Author Topic: CB750 890cc Engine build [Codename: Rattlesnake]  (Read 19794 times)

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Offline sangyo soichiro

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Re: CB750 890cc Engine build [Codename: Rattlesnake]
« Reply #50 on: May 27, 2010, 11:00:06 AM »
Michrobi, I was wondering if you measured your Cycle X Super Rods to get the bearing size?  If so, maybe you and I can cross-reference to double check each other...

I measured (with calipers) 1.5375 in. +/- 0.0005 in.  Of course, calipers are not as accurate as my error would indicate, but I'm making a subjective judgement here...  All the rods measured the same (which is comforting).  Anyway, this corresponds to about 39.053 mm.  The largest value in the bearing table is "3", which goes form 39.016 - 39.024 mm.  My rods measure about a thousandth of an inch (0.001") larger - nothing I have to worry about, I think.

I will try another measurement with telescoping gauges.  I just did this quick measurement late last night.

Anyway, if I'm right, then the bearing number that corresponds to this is "3". 



So what did you come up with?
1974 CB 750



Offline michrobi

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Re: CB750 890cc Engine build [Codename: Rattlesnake]
« Reply #51 on: May 27, 2010, 11:43:39 AM »
Actually, I sent my rods to APE with the crank. I am putting this build together with a stage IV port under the KPMI 5mm conversion valve train and a very aggressive cam, so the rods are going to put to the test with this engine. I have so damn much bread invested in it that I felt it was better to let Jay handle the rod install himself. The rods appear to be really nice. The thing that concerns me is that the rod manufacturer is some kind of secret. "Not made in China" is not much information. And Taiwan isn't China. I don't mean to sling #$%* at Ken, I wouldn't have bought them if I was worried. I just thought it best to let Jay install them is all.   ;)
-Mike

'78 CB750F All stock except for the powerplant. Jived it off my Dad in the spring of '94. He had it since 1980 and it's the first bike I ever rode on.

Current project: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=67756

How's them SOHC4 patches coming?



Offline Jerry Rxman Griffin aka MuthaF'er

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Re: CB750 890cc Engine build [Codename: Rattlesnake]
« Reply #52 on: May 27, 2010, 12:23:55 PM »
This should be fun. We may be on the same pace.

I'm using the Henry Abe "900" kit which I believe is actually a 890 but since they say 900, and 900 sounds better, I'll say 900  ;) Jay did my crank and installed the Carrillos. I too thought that would be the way to go since he had both. Mike did my Stage IV head too. I'm waiting on the frame from the powder coater. Dropped off the lower case half yesterday to have a broken 6mm bolt removed then engine pieces go to the coater. I'm going to send the tranny out for undercutting, etc. Just got my CR31's in on Monday. I should be ready to assemble really soon. We'll have to compare notes and dyno figures when done. I have to find a dyno first. This isn't an old Japanese HiPo motorcycle build type town.
As of today 3/13/2012 my original owner 75 CB750F has made it through 3 wives, er EX-wives. Free at last.  ;-)



Offline MRieck

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Re: CB750 890cc Engine build [Codename: Rattlesnake]
« Reply #53 on: May 27, 2010, 12:29:10 PM »
This should be fun. We may be on the same pace.

I'm using the Henry Abe "900" kit which I believe is actually a 890 but since they say 900, and 900 sounds better, I'll say 900  ;) Jay did my crank and installed the Carrillos. I too thought that would be the way to go since he had both. Mike did my Stage IV head too. I'm waiting on the frame from the powder coater. Dropped off the lower case half yesterday to have a broken 6mm bolt removed then engine pieces go to the coater. I'm going to send the tranny out for undercutting, etc. Just got my CR31's in on Monday. I should be ready to assemble really soon. We'll have to compare notes and dyno figures when done. I have to find a dyno first. This isn't an old Japanese HiPo motorcycle build type town.
It's about time Jerry. ;) ;) ;D
Owner of the "Million Dollar CB"



Offline sangyo soichiro

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Re: CB750 890cc Engine build [Codename: Rattlesnake]
« Reply #54 on: May 27, 2010, 12:37:59 PM »
Actually, I sent my rods to APE with the crank. I am putting this build together with a stage IV port under the KPMI 5mm conversion valve train and a very aggressive cam, so the rods are going to put to the test with this engine. I have so damn much bread invested in it that I felt it was better to let Jay handle the rod install himself. The rods appear to be really nice. The thing that concerns me is that the rod manufacturer is some kind of secret. "Not made in China" is not much information. And Taiwan isn't China. I don't mean to sling #$%* at Ken, I wouldn't have bought them if I was worried. I just thought it best to let Jay install them is all.   ;)


Thanks for the reply. 

Well, I suppose I'll try another technique for measuring and give it my best shot at ordering the right size.  I'll be sure to plastigauge to make sure.  Worse that can happen is I end up with $100 worth of extra bearings that I can't use.   :)
1974 CB 750



Offline MCRider

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Re: CB750 890cc Engine build [Codename: Rattlesnake]
« Reply #55 on: May 27, 2010, 12:48:27 PM »
Actually, I sent my rods to APE with the crank. I am putting this build together with a stage IV port under the KPMI 5mm conversion valve train and a very aggressive cam, so the rods are going to put to the test with this engine. I have so damn much bread invested in it that I felt it was better to let Jay handle the rod install himself. The rods appear to be really nice. The thing that concerns me is that the rod manufacturer is some kind of secret. "Not made in China" is not much information. And Taiwan isn't China. I don't mean to sling #$%* at Ken, I wouldn't have bought them if I was worried. I just thought it best to let Jay install them is all.   ;)

Thanks for the reply.  

Well, I suppose I'll try another technique for measuring and give it my best shot at ordering the right size.  I'll be sure to plastigauge to make sure.  Worse that can happen is I end up with $100 worth of extra bearings that I can't use.   :)

I've mentioned this before on other threads, we need a bearing clearing house for unused shells. I've got several pairs of yellows, probably some others. Green is most prevalent. I don't think I have any of those, but others might.

I don't have any rod bearings though as Jay installed mine as well.
« Last Edit: May 27, 2010, 01:10:35 PM by MCRider »
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Offline michrobi

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Re: CB750 890cc Engine build [Codename: Rattlesnake]
« Reply #56 on: May 27, 2010, 01:02:58 PM »
Dang Ron, that quote's all jacked up  :D

Hey Jerry, sweet man! We might need to find a mid point in Idaho this fall that has flat roads and serves beer. What cam are you putting in? I might have some teflon buttons you can use  ::)

soichiro, If you can't get someone to loan you a bearing or 8 for gauging you can borrow my bore gauge. I payed one arm and an eye for it and it'll probably be sitting around for awhile. If your local autozone doesn't have a loaner.
-Mike

'78 CB750F All stock except for the powerplant. Jived it off my Dad in the spring of '94. He had it since 1980 and it's the first bike I ever rode on.

Current project: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=67756

How's them SOHC4 patches coming?



Offline MRieck

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Re: CB750 890cc Engine build [Codename: Rattlesnake]
« Reply #57 on: May 27, 2010, 01:38:45 PM »
The aftermarket rods I have seen use the minimum big end ID which means green or yellow bearings
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Offline sangyo soichiro

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Re: CB750 890cc Engine build [Codename: Rattlesnake]
« Reply #58 on: May 27, 2010, 01:49:24 PM »
soichiro, If you can't get someone to loan you a bearing or 8 for gauging you can borrow my bore gauge. I payed one arm and an eye for it and it'll probably be sitting around for awhile. If your local autozone doesn't have a loaner.

I appreciate that, but I couldn't ask you to do that.  It's not like we live near each other.  But I do appreciate the offer.

The aftermarket rods I have seen use the minimum big end ID which means green or yellow bearings

Strange... mine seem to be larger than the largest ID in the table.  And my crank was marked 3333, so that would correspond to Browns.  Have you ever worked with the Cycle X Super Rods Mike?
1974 CB 750



Offline Jerry Rxman Griffin aka MuthaF'er

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Re: CB750 890cc Engine build [Codename: Rattlesnake]
« Reply #59 on: May 27, 2010, 11:34:28 PM »
Michrobi,

Going with the Megacycle 125-75. That's Mike's suggestion. He probably has a bigger cam and doesn't want me besting his 98HP  ;) but that's why he's building a tech bih engine now  8) I got him scared.

I'm all about beers. Idaho has some great roads too! Thanks for the teflon button offer however I'm using the clips that came with the kit. I DO have 2 sets of buttons however and a Gordon's Frame Kit installed  ;). Those buttons came with Big Jay's 1000 kit and the NOS 1080 kit I have. Both kits have cylinders ready and waiting. I wonder how long it would take to do a top end swap?
As of today 3/13/2012 my original owner 75 CB750F has made it through 3 wives, er EX-wives. Free at last.  ;-)



Offline andy750

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Re: CB750 890cc Engine build [Codename: Rattlesnake]
« Reply #60 on: May 28, 2010, 06:46:04 AM »
Michrobi, Jerry and Sochiro,

I am eagerly awaiting all your builds! Its very cool that you are all doing 836 - 890 engines with such excellent underlying engineering and looking forward to seeing the end results.

Looks like Ill have my petit 810cc engine with stage II head work, megacycle cam with 125-65 specs, on the road first and will dyno as soon as I can to give you all a benchmark  - your engines will be bigger and better so will be interesting to compare ;). Of course the common theme here is Mikes head work!  Good stuff! If Ive learned anything from Mike (and Ive learned a lot!) its his attention to detail so take your time and assemble carefully!

good luck
Andy
 
Current bikes
1. CB750K4: Long distance bike, 17 countries and counting...2001 - Trans-USA-Mexico (CB750K4), 2003 - European Tour (CB750K4), 2004 - SOHC Easy Rider Trip (CB750K4), 2008 - Adirondack Tour 2-up (CB750K4) , 2013 - Tail of the Dragon Tour
2. CB750/810cc K2  - road racer with JMR worked head 71 hp
3. VStrom DL1000 2003

Where did you go on your bike today? - http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=45183.2350

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Offline MRieck

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Re: CB750 890cc Engine build [Codename: Rattlesnake]
« Reply #61 on: May 28, 2010, 07:03:23 AM »
soichiro, If you can't get someone to loan you a bearing or 8 for gauging you can borrow my bore gauge. I payed one arm and an eye for it and it'll probably be sitting around for awhile. If your local autozone doesn't have a loaner.

I appreciate that, but I couldn't ask you to do that.  It's not like we live near each other.  But I do appreciate the offer.

The aftermarket rods I have seen use the minimum big end ID which means green or yellow bearings

Strange... mine seem to be larger than the largest ID in the table.  And my crank was marked 3333, so that would correspond to Browns.  Have you ever worked with the Cycle X Super Rods Mike?
 No. Carrillo, Falicon and Crower. You have to measure those ID's with a bore gauge that goes, at least, to 1/2 a thou.
« Last Edit: May 28, 2010, 07:05:30 AM by MRieck »
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Offline sangyo soichiro

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Re: CB750 890cc Engine build [Codename: Rattlesnake]
« Reply #62 on: May 28, 2010, 10:48:27 AM »
Michrobi, Jerry and Sochiro,

I am eagerly awaiting all your builds! Its very cool that you are all doing 836 - 890 engines with such excellent underlying engineering and looking forward to seeing the end results.

Looks like Ill have my petit 810cc engine with stage II head work, megacycle cam with 125-65 specs, on the road first and will dyno as soon as I can to give you all a benchmark  - your engines will be bigger and better so will be interesting to compare ;). Of course the common theme here is Mikes head work!  Good stuff! If Ive learned anything from Mike (and Ive learned a lot!) its his attention to detail so take your time and assemble carefully!

good luck
Andy
 

Thanks Andy.  Just a little correction though... I didn't have Mike do my head.  I originally was going to, but decided to give it a shot myself.  I'm using the stock valves and guides, but polished the valves up.  My thought is, the head is fairly easy to take off, so in a couple years when it's due for a good cleaning, I'll likely send it Mike's way for the valve job and full porting job.

soichiro, If you can't get someone to loan you a bearing or 8 for gauging you can borrow my bore gauge. I payed one arm and an eye for it and it'll probably be sitting around for awhile. If your local autozone doesn't have a loaner.

I appreciate that, but I couldn't ask you to do that.  It's not like we live near each other.  But I do appreciate the offer.

The aftermarket rods I have seen use the minimum big end ID which means green or yellow bearings

Strange... mine seem to be larger than the largest ID in the table.  And my crank was marked 3333, so that would correspond to Browns.  Have you ever worked with the Cycle X Super Rods Mike?
  No. Carrillo, Falicon and Crower. You have to measure those ID's with a bore gauge that goes, at least, to 1/2 a thou.

Thanks Mike. 
1974 CB 750



Offline Jerry Rxman Griffin aka MuthaF'er

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Re: CB750 890cc Engine build [Codename: Rattlesnake]
« Reply #63 on: May 28, 2010, 11:34:04 AM »
I'm looking forward to this very much myself. It's been a difficult road for me trying to locate all the resources. I just wish I'd had the cash and resources when I first put the 812 together way back when. I did it on the cheap. Bored to 812 because I dropped the valve and obliterated the top end. Replaced intakes with stock size stainless, stronger springs since I floated the valve, and yes a cam since I had it apart. No degreeing the cam. Put it back as you would a stock cam. I'd liked to have been able to do it up right and at least dyno'd it. It sure would have been nice to compare to stock and what I'm doing now. Plus it would have been a good comparison to Andy's with Mike's magic vs my Yoshi Daytona cam as compared to the 125-65.
As of today 3/13/2012 my original owner 75 CB750F has made it through 3 wives, er EX-wives. Free at last.  ;-)



Offline michrobi

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Re: CB750 890cc Engine build [Codename: Rattlesnake]
« Reply #64 on: May 28, 2010, 12:20:59 PM »
Hey Jerry, what coating are you doing to the cases? Powder?
-Mike

'78 CB750F All stock except for the powerplant. Jived it off my Dad in the spring of '94. He had it since 1980 and it's the first bike I ever rode on.

Current project: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=67756

How's them SOHC4 patches coming?



Offline Jerry Rxman Griffin aka MuthaF'er

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Re: CB750 890cc Engine build [Codename: Rattlesnake]
« Reply #65 on: May 28, 2010, 12:53:40 PM »
Yeah, I'm planning on going powder. I need to get the lower half back from having one of the 6mm center bolts removed where it snapped. I will then take everything to the coater and finalize the plan. Going black with some detail work done. I'll have the outer ring on the stator cover done in silver as well as the space around HONDA in silver. I'm also hoping to do silver around the shift pattern too as well as the serial number area. Oil filter housing in silver. I have to ask about having the jugs done too. I'm unsure if it's possible without heat damage. I have too much time and $$$ in that kit to jack it up. Last time I talked to him he said it would be possible but I didn't have it with me. I have had a black engine with silver jugs but I'll go all black and polish fins this time. Looks like I'll spray that expensive Stage IV head Mike did for me. WAY too much $$ involved to jack it up and I don't want to take it apart to coat either. I'd really like to have the engine together by the end of July but June would be even nicer.   
As of today 3/13/2012 my original owner 75 CB750F has made it through 3 wives, er EX-wives. Free at last.  ;-)



Offline michrobi

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Re: CB750 890cc Engine build [Codename: Rattlesnake]
« Reply #66 on: May 30, 2010, 06:35:56 PM »
I might need to powder coat mine. Guess I'll shop around for a good powder coat place in the area. I don't think I'll be ready as soon as July. In fact, I may postpone until the winter season. Every day I'm thinking more and more about doing a full frame up. Steering bearings, wiring (with reg/rec combo and updated fuse-box), eurobars and guages, Gordon frame kit, powder all the bits that need powder, brakes all rebuilt and drilled, swing-arm rebuild, front springs...

All of that kind of stuff, yaknow. It's hard to do a motor and not do everything else at the same time.
-Mike

'78 CB750F All stock except for the powerplant. Jived it off my Dad in the spring of '94. He had it since 1980 and it's the first bike I ever rode on.

Current project: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=67756

How's them SOHC4 patches coming?



Offline Jerry Rxman Griffin aka MuthaF'er

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Re: CB750 890cc Engine build [Codename: Rattlesnake]
« Reply #67 on: May 30, 2010, 07:46:10 PM »
It's kinda contagious. What started out as a bigger oil leak I attributed to cam tower pucks (which actually wasn't) turned into a full blown restore/rebuild. I started collecting NOS parts about 3 years ago then I started picking up available new parts all the while getting the high performance engine parts. Addiction on the 3 year installment plan is the best description. I now have everything I need so it's time. Got expensive somewhere along the way but I've always wanted to do this since I blew the engine in '76 so here I am.

YES, I DO KNOW!  8)
 
As of today 3/13/2012 my original owner 75 CB750F has made it through 3 wives, er EX-wives. Free at last.  ;-)



Offline michrobi

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Re: CB750 890cc Engine build [Codename: Rattlesnake]
« Reply #68 on: July 09, 2010, 09:37:01 PM »
Look what was on my doorstep today   ;D







Just need to get the cases coated and I'm ready. The head is on it's way, so I should be ready for final assembly before the cases are finished. Still shopping for a local powder coat shop and still a few weeks away from ordering the rockers. Money got tight awful quick this last week   :D

-Mike

'78 CB750F All stock except for the powerplant. Jived it off my Dad in the spring of '94. He had it since 1980 and it's the first bike I ever rode on.

Current project: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=67756

How's them SOHC4 patches coming?



Offline Jerry Rxman Griffin aka MuthaF'er

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Re: CB750 890cc Engine build [Codename: Rattlesnake]
« Reply #69 on: July 09, 2010, 11:41:39 PM »
Looks great!

I picked up my engine pieces from the coater last week. Fantastic! We discussed coating the cylinders and head. Definitely no on Mike's expensive head. Then we turned to the cylinders. Not as expensive BUT after discussing the "at home" BBQ grill method of removing the liners and the need to bake the cylinders at 380 degrees to sweat out oils, etc then bake the coat at 380 degrees we decided not to coat the cylinders. My guy is good but.... we left nothing to chance. 

Just something I thought I'd throw in. If you do it and all is well I'll be pissed I didn't go ahead  ;)
As of today 3/13/2012 my original owner 75 CB750F has made it through 3 wives, er EX-wives. Free at last.  ;-)



Offline michrobi

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Re: CB750 890cc Engine build [Codename: Rattlesnake]
« Reply #70 on: July 09, 2010, 11:53:18 PM »
I'm planning to paint the cylinders and head, just coating the cases and maybe the covers. I'm actually toying with the idea of a dark red on the head. We'll see what comes of it.
-Mike

'78 CB750F All stock except for the powerplant. Jived it off my Dad in the spring of '94. He had it since 1980 and it's the first bike I ever rode on.

Current project: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=67756

How's them SOHC4 patches coming?



Offline tweakin

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Re: CB750 890cc Engine build [Codename: Rattlesnake]
« Reply #71 on: July 10, 2010, 07:55:02 AM »
Awesome, that thing is going to rip.  Jeff at rainier powdercoating in Pacific, WA does good work for a real fair price.



Offline Big Jay

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Re: CB750 890cc Engine build [Codename: Rattlesnake]
« Reply #72 on: July 11, 2010, 01:04:03 AM »
Look what was on my doorstep today   ;D







Just need to get the cases coated and I'm ready. The head is on it's way, so I should be ready for final assembly before the cases are finished. Still shopping for a local powder coat shop and still a few weeks away from ordering the rockers. Money got tight awful quick this last week   :D




Looks awsome!!! :D



Offline traveler

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Re: CB750 890cc Engine build [Codename: Rattlesnake]
« Reply #73 on: July 11, 2010, 01:08:49 AM »
I hear it saying "100 horsepower"....do you guys hear it? ;)

~Joe



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Re: CB750 890cc Engine build [Codename: Rattlesnake]
« Reply #74 on: July 11, 2010, 01:11:55 AM »
Looks great!

I picked up my engine pieces from the coater last week. Fantastic! We discussed coating the cylinders and head. Definitely no on Mike's expensive head. Then we turned to the cylinders. Not as expensive BUT after discussing the "at home" BBQ grill method of removing the liners and the need to bake the cylinders at 380 degrees to sweat out oils, etc then bake the coat at 380 degrees we decided not to coat the cylinders. My guy is good but.... we left nothing to chance. 

Just something I thought I'd throw in. If you do it and all is well I'll be pissed I didn't go ahead  ;)


Do you hear the swooshing sound?  That's the sound of power going out the window!

Hope you rethink that move....

~Joe

 

Honda