Topic: Garage Wiring Considerations

[Accolay]

Hey Fellas,

I'm supposedly buying this old house and I'm going to have to wire the detached garage myself to save cash. I'm wondering how much power I should put in there? Not my dream house, I don't envision staying there for longer than 10 years, and the garage isn't really suitable for heating, so I don't think I would want power for that (but then again, MN winters are rather long and motorcycles get lonely).

I'm thinking three or four 115V outlets, lighting, at least one outside 115V power outlet, an outlet for a garage door opener and maybe a 220V outlet for possible heavier power tools. Would it also be wise to add another dedicated 115V outlet?

Thank you and I appreciate your ideas in advance.

[Skunk Stripe]

Mine runs all on 1 circuit and I have no 220. It sucks. Lights are on their own at least. If I had to make a change, a 220 would be it.

[Bob Wessner]

That's what I did. My garage is a stand alone, it shared a circuit with the house, single 110v for 70 years. Decided to do it right. Dug a trench (may 25 ft.) from the house to the garage. Installed conduit and ran a separate 220v circuit to the garage. I have 2 outlets on each side wall, the back and two on the ceiling for batt. tenders. I've also installed a elec. heater, not for use when it is 0F  , but once we have some days in the upper 30 or 40's enough heat to let you work out there.

[BeSeeingYou]

Use the grey plastic conduit for this.  It is really cheap, bury it about 18 inches and use individual stranded wire as it will pull through the conduit easier.  I have done this several times for people, it's amazing what I find.  Buried extension cords, ROM X 6 inches under the ground, you name it.  2 20 amp circuts plus the 220 would be plenty.  

[flybox1]

def run 220v  in conduit.  diggin the trench is where the time is at.
you can never have too many outlets either. 
put 2 low on most walls, and one chest height for workbenches you might install later on for your powertools.
put outlet(s) on the ceiling in addition to your normal light fixtures.
later on you might want to hook up hanging shoplight(s), or a retracting cordlight, etc.

[Bob Wessner]

diggin the trench is where the time is at.

Amen! We have a good deal of clay in our soil, what a pain, hard as a rock in July. I finally got out a two-stroke powered cultivator and just kept going over a stretch to loosen the soil, then removed it, and as they say, repeat.  Used a shopvac to suck a heavy cord tied to the wiring through the conduit, then pulled the line through.

[BeSeeingYou]

diggin the trench is where the time is at.

Amen! We have a good deal of clay in our soil, what a pain, hard as a rock in July. I finally got out a two-stroke powered cultivator and just kept going over a stretch to loosen the soil, then removed it, and as they say, repeat.   Used a shopvac to suck a heavy cord tied to the wiring through the conduit, then pulled the line through.

The last one I did was to a garage and  a large fish pond.  Close to 100 feet luckily it was all sand.  The time before it was in gravel and that was unpleasent.

[bradweingartner]

A LOT can happen in 10 years! I've been in my place ~7 years and I've gone from thinking I had more outlets (24x24 workshop with at least 30 110v outlets + one 220v) than I knew what to do with to wanting to add two more 220v outlets and a handful more 110v.

So whatever you do, account for possible expansion and keep good notes of the things you did so even if YOU don't expand, it's valuable for the next person.

[MoMo]

I have a 24x24 with two outlets on each wall-that is code here-and two on the ceiling. That is adequate for the 110 but I need a 220.  Does your township or city have a code? Recommend a separate circuit for the compressor and a separate circuit for the set of outlets on each wall. Install a 100 amp panel and wire from that...Larry

[flybox1]

Does your township or city have a code?

doing it to save cash might not involve purchasing a high-volt electrical permit to comply with code      

[BeSeeingYou]

In Minneapolis if you get a permit the homeowner or a licensed electrician can do the work.  Now...a lot of this type of work is done without permits and in Minneapolis most get away with it.  Just make sure you do it up to code and the worst that will happen is you get caught down the road and have to pay a permit fee.  Getting caught is unlikely in my experience in the city.

[dave500]

what domestic supply do you guys have over there?we have standard 240 in houses and work shops can have a three phase 415 volt for heavy gear,415 can also be connected to houses with a hobby workshop if required,its a big four pin plug with a screw ring connector.

[Accolay]

Thanks for the ideas.

I think the permit in Mpls is about 90 bucks. I don't know if I would necessarily go and get it, but I think there is a hefty fine if they find you out. I have only started preliminary research, but I don't think conduit is necessary by code in Minneapolis except where the wire runs up from the trench. I think you only need the water resistant wire.

srust- I know what you mean when you say "it's amazing what I find." The garage is technically "wired" now. They used three single strand wires, all the same color:green. One for ground, one for hot and one for return.

[Accolay]

Dave- no idea about the 415.

[BeSeeingYou]

Thanks for the ideas.

I think the permit in Mpls is about 90 bucks. I don't know if I would necessarily go and get it, but I think there is a hefty fine if they find you out. I have only started preliminary research, but I don't think conduit is necessary by code in Minneapolis except where the wire runs up from the trench. I think you only need the water resistant wire.

srust- I know what you mean when you say "it's amazing what I find." The garage is technically "wired" now. They used three single strand wires, all the same color:green. One for ground, one for hot and one for return.

You are right about the conduit.  I still use it as I have seen more than once where landscapers or sprinkler installers tear up wiring that was either not deep enough or not in conduit. 

[flybox1]

Thanks for the ideas.

I think the permit in Mpls is about 90 bucks. I don't know if I would necessarily go and get it, but I think there is a hefty fine if they find you out.

"..but mr electrical inspector, sir, i bought the house like this.  you cant seriously fine me for sh**y wiring the PO did?" 

[strynboen]

in denmark ve have 240v 16a    400v #3 16-32a in normal houses,,do you have 3 fase 220 ?? ve have some us motore ve not can use..ve have 3 fase 400 volt

[Accolay]

We have household single phase 120v for most electronics, but large appliances like dishwashers and washing machines are 240v at I think either 15a or 20a. A lot of home power has 100a service total, but people are upgrading to 200a service.

[strynboen]

have you 3 fase 240 volt..for welders and bigger motors/mashines?

[mark]

have you 3 fase 240 volt..for welders and bigger motors/mashines?

It depends on what part of town you live in. As 3-phase power is mainly used for industrial equipment, it isn't usually supplied in residential areas.

My neighbor is replacing the irrigation machinery on his place. The power co. was out last year to replace all the poles down the road and add new wire. Now there is 3ph power on a pole in my yard, just out of reach.....

[Bodi]

Here in Toronto and most of Ontario residential power is 120/240 single phase. New homes are pretty much all 200A, older places can be as low as 60A.
Industrial/commercial is 120/208 3 phase and heavy industrial tends to be 347/600V 3 phase. Quite a few  office buildings run the lighting on 347V, you can have a lot of fixtures on one 14ga wire with that voltage.