Topic: Vietnam

[BeSeeingYou]

Your Father was a brave man and you can only imagine what he saw during those intense battles.

I had a friend who was badly wounded there by a mortar round with several others. A Chinook driver who had come through the #$%* and was gone, heard the call and came back through the #$%* to pick those boys up.

I am tired of wars, I am tired of the US getting into everyone's business. We are not the only Country with a military. If there is evil to be dealt with, let someone take a turn dealing with it.

If the Iranians block the Strait, The Chinese get more oil than we do from there, they have a shiny new Carrier, let them try it out. 

I remember too well what war looks like.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who belives it's time for us to stop being the worlds muscle.

Something that is really bothering me lately, are the comments I've heard from Old people about The mental problems being caused by the way wars are fought.

I have a semi-related family member who was in Iraq, and was totaly "destroyed" by the experience. I don't want to go into it, but he's messed up.
When my grandpa heard about how he's messed up all he said was " He must be on dope, none of the people in MY generation every had these problems". He has become so Pro War( ANY WAR, for anyreason is justified it seems to him) that anyone who has come back messed up, must be on drugs/fakeing. I've heard many other old people say things like this. And now i'm hearing whisperngs on TV that a few politicans are trying to impliment a draft in the future.

That really bothers me. Mabey it's time for the Old people go fight and Die if they belive they are so right. I'm tired of war and death for no seemingly real reason.

     Instead of the old people it would be better if we send the political leaders and corporate industrialists who start (and benefit from) the wars to go fight them.  As they are the ones who benefit the most let them along with their sons and daughters be in the first wave to hit the beach.
     Just about any war can be traced to incompetent political leadership on one or both sides of the countries involved or just plain avarice and greed.  I would fight to defend my country if I felt the reasons just but I would never fight just because my government tells me to.
     In the case of Vietnam the U.S. supported Ho Chi Minh during WWII as he fought the Japanese.  FDR was an anti-colonialist and promised support for Vietnam's independence from France.  When Truman took office at the death of FDR he reneged on the promise and the rest is history.  The whole tragic mistake could have been avoided with competent strong moral leadership.

[faux fiddy]

Your Father was a brave man and you can only imagine what he saw during those intense battles.

     Just about any war can be traced to incompetent political leadership on one or both sides of the countries involved or just plain avarice and greed.  I would fight to defend my country if I felt the reasons just but I would never fight just because my government tells me to.
     In the case of Vietnam the U.S. supported Ho Chi Minh during WWII as he fought the Japanese.  FDR was an anti-colonialist and promised support for Vietnam's independence from France.  When Truman took office at the death of FDR he reneged on the promise and the rest is history.  The whole tragic mistake could have been avoided with competent strong moral leadership.

I never heard this stuff until this last  decade or less.  I think this tune galvanizes the whole sentiment of those that were or were not trapped by conscription.

18 - The Flying Burrito Brothers - My Uncle

[demon78]

Speaking of politicos making stupid decisions and then sitting on the side lines with their collective thumbs up up their collective asses you've got admire the Brits sending future kings into the hot spots, yes I know that people will be around to look out and look after them but how many of our future leaders are going to get close to being in harms way, I would think that a dose of being shot at would improve the outlooks and philosophies of our current and future leaders on the average. As far as being the worlds muscle I believe that the UN was originally set up to be the worlds muscle and that didn't work to well so I think that a new way of looking the problem is needed.
Bill the demon.

[wedoo2]

The most fascinating thing about Viet Nam, and I suppose most wars, is the political aspect.  The behind the scenes machinations.  There are two books that are the best I can suggest that will give a great history of the war, and the entire time period involved.  Nixonland and The 50 Year Wound.

Both deal with the era and the political, and social changes that took place.  If you have to pick one, pick Nixonland.  The other is about the idiocy that took place during the cold war starting with Truman and ending in victory.  But, my god, what a way to live.

My personal experience is one of a young guy who got away from little Terre Haute.  Away from the racial problems going on.  Something big and exciting.  I remember Da Nang and now see they have condos on the beach.  Ton Suh Nhut is now a modern airport that is a wow.  Things I could not imagine at the time.

For the average person in the country life is most likely the same as it was the day I left except they are not in the line of fire.  Sometimes literally.  They didn't know freedom before and do not know it now.  The average American at the time wanted to win until the weariness took hold.  I, like Kong, remember very little about it; didn't get hassled when I got home, got back and got with it.  Glad to be away from the heat and the stink of the place.  Didn't kill anyone directly.

War has always, and always will be, an exercise in dick waving.  True in 1812 and in Afghanistan today.  Kinda primal, huh?

[BeSeeingYou]

War has always, and always will be, an exercise in dick waving.  True in 1812 and in Afghanistan today.  Kinda primal, huh?

Ya got that right.  1000 year old petroglyph in a remote box canyon in Montana.

[wedoo2]

War has always, and always will be, an exercise in dick waving.  True in 1812 and in Afghanistan today.  Kinda primal, huh?

Ya got that right.  1000 year old petroglyph in a remote box canyon in Montana.

I don't think that is an arrow coming out of his quiver there.   

[BobbyR]

I was only hassled one at a fancy Cocktail party, some clown asked if I got extra points for kids since they were harder to hit. He of course was not hard to hit.

I signed up, they kept their end of the bargain and I kept mine. While I did not forget much, every day was ground hog day. Up in the morning, breakfast. briefing, and sometime later wind them up and skim over what seemed to be the same trees, make a lot of noise. Eat, sneak a couple of shots, get some rack time and do it again tomorrow.

Nothing changed till I got back. 

[my78k]

"True in 1812 and in Afghanistan today"

1812 ?? what happened in 1812?

Oh yeah I remember now....we kicked your ass and burned down your White House!!! 

I shouldn't kick the bees nest I know...

Dennis

[faux fiddy]

Hey, maybe this one belongs in the what celebrety thread, but my brother, smoked dope from viet nam. Just heresay, but his best friend's brother sent it back with instructions.

At the time in Wichita, KS it was felony, the hallucinations included, according to him, heresay, was that they smoked the sh8 and started hearing sirens.  I believe it, kids 14 years old commiting a felony at the time, and the stuff like unobtanium coud lead to paranoid hallucinations(?)!

Kids themselves as it were makes it a viable and now deniable story.

The same kid that got the dope from his brother from Viet Nam was dating Kirstie Allie, Yes the Kristie Ally [sic?] from the series CHEERS.  Yes, check it , she is from Wichita, KS.  She is 'nam  era.

[BeSeeingYou]

"True in 1812 and in Afghanistan today"

1812 ?? what happened in 1812?

Oh yeah I remember now....we kicked your ass and burned down your White House!!! 

I shouldn't kick the bees nest I know...

Dennis

Hey...don't get to full of yourself.  After the Revolution 100,000 Americans (loyalist Tories) immigrated to Canada.  It is said that 1 in 5 Canadians has a direct Torie ancestor.   

[my78k]

lol...I am 1of those 5!

My mom's entire family were Empire Loyalists and I also still have lots of family in the Rochester area. I have to rest on our laurels as now even a decent sized street gang from Detroit could probably take us over...lol

Dennis

[BeSeeingYou]

lol...I am 1of those 5!

My mom's entire family were Empire Loyalists and I also still have lots of family in the Rochester area. I have to rest on our laurels as now even a decent sized street gang from Detroit could probably take us over...lol

Dennis

If you are interested in the history a book titled Tories by Thomas B. Allen is a good read.

[faux fiddy]

My ancestor's house in PA was burned down by torries.

[BeSeeingYou]

My ancestor's house in PA was burned down by torries.

It's not well covered in our school taught history but the Revolution was just as much a civil war.  Many battles were fought between Americans from both sides but the battles with the British are the ones most of us know about.