Topic: understanding the "simplified" wiring diagram, and adding to it?

[jason41987]

a previous thread of mine lead me to some more questions that was getting off-topic on that thread so im continuing it here

what im doing is rewiring my CB550, and ive decided to go with the simplified, scaled-back diagram floating around

http://www.hondachopper.com/garage/simple_wiring_diagram/simple_wiring_diagram.jpg

what id like to do is add turn signals to this.. so ive been studying the stock diagram for my CB550 to get a better understanding of how its set up and trying to figure out how to add the turn signals to the simplified diagram because although theyre not required in my state, i do want to travel to other states that do require them

so, im following the wires on the stock diagram from the turn signals, one wire grounds to the frame, the others go to the handlebar controls that when selected bridges with a wire that leads to the turn signal relay... then the turn signal relay has another pin grounded to the frame, and a third pin which is connected to a black wire that also connects a bunch of other unrelated accessories... so im assuming the three pins are positive, negative, and ground?

the simplified diagram however doesnt seem to be wired in any related manner, battery is grounded directly to the frame and the components have wires either wired hot or grounded to the frame with no third wire... so what im trying to determine now is how do i add a 3-pin flasher into this simplified diagram, or would i be better off with a two-pin flasher wired in series on the live-wire?

also, another quick question is i would like to add an extra power adapter, the kind you find inside a car for 12v accessories... looking at the diagram posted above, how would i wire one of these in, protected by a fuse of course, so that i can run different accessories while traveling, such as a GPS system?... i believe it would be best if power was only supplied while the ignition was on

[bollingball]

jason Go here use the 500 diagram turn off every thing but the left/right turn. Then you will have what you need to incorporate into your wiring.
http://oldmanhonda.com/MC/wiring.html
Then go here to get a better understanding of how Honda chose to wire their bikes read (reply9) pay attention to the black wire (sw power)
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=1012.msg188242#msg188242
Ken

[luap]

also, another quick question is i would like to add an extra power adapter, the kind you find inside a car for 12v accessories... looking at the diagram posted above, how would i wire one of these in, protected by a fuse of course, so that i can run different accessories while traveling, such as a GPS system?... i believe it would be best if power was only supplied while the ignition was on

if you tie into black - power would only be supplied with ignition on. If you want gps to only be on when you want- black to one side of toggle(on/off) other side to Accessory Outlet - the other side of AC outlet to ground
Paul

[jason41987]

well, my GPS is actually my android tablet which has an internal battery supply, so basically all it would need to be would be a charger, so it can run for many  hours on its internal battery... so ground one wire to the frame, and the other one would be connected where?... on the ignition, or acc. pin of the ignition switch?

also, the second post, which is the first reply im not sure he fully understood my question... with the wiring harness i posted, theres really no positive, negative, ground... it seems to just be positive off the battery, negative/ground to the frame, so wouldnt that mean a two-pin electronic turn signal flasher relay would better work, and be more appropirate for this simpler, scaled back wiring?

and if so.. how would a two-pin flasher be wired into this?.. turn signals ground to the frame, one pin of the flasher wired to the frame, the other pin would be wired to the switch, and the switch would bridge the power wire of the signal to the relay?....

or should the ground/negative wire of the turn signals be wired to the controls, then a wire from the controls to one of the flasher pins, with the hot wire wired to the ignition portion of the ignition switch along with the other pin of the flasher relay?

[jason41987]

heres how im thinking of doing it.. the positive, hot wire on the turn signals and the two-pin relay would be wired to the IGN. pin of the ignition switch, so juice is only supplied to these parts when the ignition is on

then the negative/ground wire of the turn signals and the two-pin relay are wired to the switches, and bridged together depending on which direction is selected

[bollingball]

also, another quick question is i would like to add an extra power adapter, the kind you find inside a car for 12v accessories... looking at the diagram posted above, how would i wire one of these in, protected by a fuse of course, so that i can run different accessories while traveling, such as a GPS system?... i believe it would be best if power was only supplied while the ignition was on

if you tie into black - power would only be supplied with ignition on. If you want gps to only be on when you want- black to one side of toggle(on/off) other side to Accessory Outlet - the other side of AC outlet to groundPaul

The black wire is DC power and that is what you want same as on a car. The 3 yellow wires are AC you DO NOT want that. Or did you mean Acc. Outlet instead of AC outlet?
Ken

[jason41987]

acc.. accessory outlet which will be a DC outlet of course... ill probably get a handle-bar mounded DC power jack and mount that to the handlebars... with an inline fuse of course, i cant risk a valuable piece of hardware getting sacraficed to the power surge gods

with the three pins on the ignition switch... theres the battery which always has power supplied to it, ignition which only supplies power with the ignition on, and is the acc.  pin one that is enabled with the ignition switch supplying power, but without the bike not started?.. if so, ill wire an in-line fused wire to this acc. pin, and the other to ground for the accessories

and should the live-wire of the turn signal be wired to acc. as well, or should the ignition be on as a requirement to use the turn signals requiring me to connect the livewire to the IGN. pin?

[luap]

if your using the stock ignition switch an doing a simple harness you dont use the brown or brown/wht

[bollingball]

i cant risk a valuable piece of hardware getting sacraficed to the power surge gods
Fuses are not for the surge Gods just the short and overload gods. They are to protect the wire not the device.
with the three pins on the ignition switch... theres the battery which always has power supplied to it, ignition which only supplies power with the ignition on, and is the acc.  pin one that is enabled with the ignition switch supplying power, but without the bike not started?
I don't have a acc. on mine. I do have park and the only thing that comes on is the tail light. You need to hook the new power socket to the  ignition part of the sw. so what ever you have plugged in will work and charge up while driving. With acc. it will only work while parked. They do it this way because the bike came with points and with the the sw. in acc. or park you don't want power to the points if they are closed they will burn.
Ken
Ken

[bollingball]

 Forgot Turns to Ign. If you want to use them going down the road
Ken

[bollingball]

This is why you have a fuse box.pretty soon you will not have enough room on that sw. You may want to rethink the layout. Honda did it right. Feed the main fuse from the batt. from that fuse go to the key sw. From the key sw. go back to the other fuses to feed lights power socket.
Ken

[bjbuchanan]

I say go with bollingball and add a five piece atc fusebox. They are like 7 bucks. Power to a good quality switch then back to a fusebox and start running your selected accessories

[jason41987]

besides the turn signals and requires flasher really, the only accessory I want to add is a 12v power outlet

do the signals or relay need a fuse?

also, I've considered having a frame mounted ignition switch... I don't have a key for the switch I have now... I'm open to changing it even though its cheap and easy to have a key made

[bollingball]

Jason Lights are accessories. I like the engine ie coils points on one headlight on another and taillight on another maybe the turns with them That is three The more the better you don't want every thing going off at once heck you won't know if a light went to short or a coil went bad. Makes it hard to trouble shoot at night and 2am 30 miles from no where. Plus they all draw different loads so need a different size fuse. Then your 12v socket on number 4 when sizing the wire and fuse for it it will say on it how much it can handle.
Ken

[jason41987]

why are you talking about coils?

[bjbuchanan]

Look i don't want to come off looking like a d!ck but what i suggest is that you sit down and look at wiring diagrams and other custom jobs, not only bikes but old cars and get a grasp of how these systems flow


Even a hacked crap harness will make more sense than just mentally trying to plan

[jason41987]

i actually intend to follow the harness i posted above to a T, with the addition of turn signals, and the power outlet.. other than that i see nothing wrong with the above diagram... as for the turn signals what im having issues with is this...

if i wire the ground wire to the handlebar controls for switching, where would the live wires need to be wired to?, in this diagram it lists "ACC." "IGN." and "BATT." as part of the ignition switch.. i cant tell if this is a stock ignition switch or not, that being said ive thought about going with a frame mounted switch like some of the older bikes had purely for aesthetics.

anyway, the question remains, where is the live wire of the turn signals wired to?.. either ACC. or IGN. and i dont know this specific ignition switch to know which each one does?... i assume things connected to IGN are powered only when the ignition is on and the bike is running, and i also assumed ACC meant devices that are powered with the key in the ignition whether the bike was running or not

i could be wrong with those assumptions because im not familiar with this ignition switch or that wiring, but it seems likely thats what they are..

another thing that confused me is that the tail light seemed to be wired to both the ACC and IGN pins and doesnt seem to show a ground anywhere.. so the wiring of the tail light on that diagram confuses me as well

[bjbuchanan]

Check it out think of it just like a car system it is easier. Consider your acc setup just like in a car where you get the radio and on some "lights" or a running tail light. Otherwise you want all running thru that big gage from the batt to the switch(fused at thebox but separate from the others, ie not split off). Then route the power to a fuse box( tech there already). Take your large like ten guage to a hot terminal and then distribute out to your diff fuses. Obviously on other sides of fuses is your hookups. Small lights get a 5. Give headlight diff fuse. Power the coils w a fuse to a relay. Whatever floats your boat. All fused and high quality connections

[jason41987]

do you have any recommendations for an aftermarket fuse box?.. something easy to hide under a seat?

[bjbuchanan]

Yeah its the five position atc ummmm i made mine but its available on ebay and maybe like autozone. The idea is just five slots for you to make power from. Hondaman has a fusebox too but he admits its just the easy way out.

I believe you are getting confusion from how diff components are grounded in a system. Some tail lights like a Lucas( tho its a #$%* ground)  are grounded thru being bolted down.

Weak ground thru many multiple connections.

Some handlebar switches ground thru their "locating" post and thats a sh!it ground if i may say myself. Take similarly located components and do a gang ground. 2 sufficed for Honda. Any more is plusses.

Any fusebox you make or buy will be small, near the stock size. It will be  easily hideable.
Live for a turn signal must be from ign" terminal bc its only hot when engine is hot.

The switches for a turn signal( diagram wise) can be a mind fu$k bc they work AFTER you ground the circuit by moving your lever to the right or left. Either direction completes the circuit

[jason41987]

so the signals, they dont go through the fuse box? just the IGN of the ignition switch?.. i figured the ground wire was the one that went to the handlebars

[luap]

ACC not AC sorry bout that
Ken how well would one of those protect a GPS
http://www.ehow.com/how_7925174_install-surge-12-volt-dc.html

i cant tell if this is a stock ignition switch or not" No its not a stock ignition Stock Is Bat, Ign ACC 1brown ACC2 brown an white
Maybe I didnt try enough ways but you cant run the ACC brown or brown an white with a simple harness using a stock switch
few other things on that diagram that are different then our bikes.
Ive always uses inline bus fuses Not real sure why I havnt used a block Lots cleaner an cheaper
 

[bollingball]

why are you talking about coils?

I was considering any thing it takes to run the engine as a separate circuit to be fused. That would be the main power or key sw. coils and points and the wires that connect all of them.
Ken

do you have any recommendations for an aftermarket fuse box?.. something easy to hide under a seat?

http://sohc4shop.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=23&products_id=48
http://easternbeaver.com/Main/Products/products.html
The first link is HondaMans. I use his stuff and it is very good. He is a member here and is top notch IMO. Have not used easterbeaver.

Ken

[bollingball]

Luap Check your PMs.
Ken

[jason41987]

this diagram makes more sense now that i know its an aftermarket switch... heck, even a 2-position switch should work because its not like the engines actually going to start unless i push the starter button... or kick it

still though.. the tail light wiring doesnt make much sense in that diagram, is there a ground for the tail light that the illustrator forgot to draw in?

[bollingball]

He is using the rear fender as ground. It should go back to the frame. You need to put a green wire from the light to the coil mount bolt. Where ever you put the ground make sure it is bare metal. You could put it at the rear engine mount bolt.
Ken

[jason41987]

ok.. i figured it was grounded to the frame via its mounting it to something metal, but wasnt sure... glad someone could verify it