Topic: Optical ignition system from Cycle Exchange

[Bailgang]

hardly anyone here seems to be using them which is enough to make me curious

My guess is price is the reason you don't see too many using them because the Boyers are a bit more expensive than say a basic dyna, pamco or accent system. I haven't heard anyone say anything bad about the Boyers system though at least not yet.

[KayOne]

I run them on my SOHC 750 and my DOHC 750. Completely satisfied with their performance and cost.

[Deltarider]

im surprised their not used as much as the common failing dynas?i guess being English they get associated with lucas rubbish?

You hit the nail spot on, Dave. I remember this bloke that had this sticker on the rear fender of his Bonnie saying: All parts falling of this bike are of the finest British chraftmanship.  And in all honesty I find them bloody expensive too. That's why I built my own transistor module years ago and... my points will celebrate their 60.000 km anniversary soon!

[bjbuchanan]

The advance curve is supposed to hit all in on these bikes at 2500-2800 rpm, dictated by the weights and springs. Slap a 10$ timing light on it and determine where it hits. If it hits after that window, clip the spring just a little and tighten the curve down. You can do one spring at a time to really fine tune it.

Like Dave said, the programmable curves offer little to no advantage other than you being able to say you programmed your ignition curve.

I'm big in to retrofitting and modifying stuff like DIY electronic ignition on cars, EFI using megasquirt, fabbing stuff up but I really can't see the justification on these bikes. The bang for the buck is just not there. The biggest gains are by getting these bikes running properly, so many bikes have all this stuff added on top because they couldn't get it running right to begin with.

[flatlander]

well i never said i wanted to programme my own curve. i have other things to do with my time. so far i have points and have nothing to complain about.

all these computerised things that get rid of the mechanical advancer are expensive, be it american or british. was just wondering why people choose to spend their money on one and not the other but seems like there's not much between them in the end.

you dig?= do you understand?

i do. although now you made me really curious... 

[calj737]

For the record, the only reason I am planning on using the system in question is the 500 motor I'm building is completely non-stock, and after much study, it appears having a programmable ignition might be of value to create the best running motor.

For a stock, or nearly stock motor, absolutely a Hondman ignition would be a great choice. I like electronic, but see all kinds of happy customers running the HM with points. I see no dispute to it/their stability.

I dig.

As for the modern electronics appeal, some techno-weenies just like the stuff (okay, me) but it's not because I feel the stock parts are inadequate or incapable. It's just an opportunity to employ something new as part of a custom build. Their size in some cases, is very crucial to flexible locations. Doesn't make them better, perhaps only better-suited for the project at hand.

Long live points and condensers!

[AJK]

For the record, the only reason I am planning on using the system in question is the 500 motor I'm building is completely non-stock, and after much study, it appears having a programmable ignition might be of value to create the best running motor.

For a stock, or nearly stock motor, absolutely a Hondman ignition would be a great choice. I like electronic, but see all kinds of happy customers running the HM with points. I see no dispute to it/their stability.

There is heaps of merit to digital advance systems if done correctly, and the key words are "non-stock" as CalJ has mentioned. Its all about tuning low end tractibility on a modified motor until it begins to breath properly. Being microcontroller based, it also opens up a myriad of options and features that can be added like multi-spark, flexible dwell & other things that can be dreamt up.

[scottly]

The last time I looked at the Dyna 2000, it had four different timing curves, only one of which was remotely close the the CB curve. The 2000 did have the capability of operating switches for boost retard and such, IIRC, but those features are only required on race bikes. The power arc also has four settings, but I don't recall finding any actual specs for the curves.

[Jerry Rxman Griffin aka MuthaF'er]

I like the idea of laptop programming your 2000 D2K4C-P but apparently that takes away the rev limiter function.

[lucky]

Carbs are not "done" Give them to a forum member that needs them.
Carbs can be rebuilt and cleaned unless they were run over by a truck.

[Mooshie]

Before I get the hondaman box do u guys recommend replacing the old points and condensers?

HM ignition and HM fuse box are both a must.  Put in new points if you need to (use TEC only not the others) but before you hook up HM ignition run the points for about 500 miles to clear off the protective gunk they put on them.  If you don't the bike will back fire and stop running and scare the hell out of you.  I didn't run the new points long enough (I was impatient) and it woke me up very quickly.  HM system is easy to hook and unplug on the side of road if need be (don't ask how I know this) so you are back to points in roughly 5 minutes.

[Retro Rocket]

I'm big in to retrofitting and modifying stuff like DIY electronic ignition on cars, EFI using megasquirt, fabbing stuff up but I really can't see the justification on these bikes. The bang for the buck is just not there.

If "bang for buck" is what you are aiming at, I do it because i want to and i can, is there any other justification that counts...?
I wish you were closer, I'm a noob with injection and will be fitting mega squirt/ GSXR injection to my 1000cc build, need a holiday..? 

[bjbuchanan]

I'm big in to retrofitting and modifying stuff like DIY electronic ignition on cars, EFI using megasquirt, fabbing stuff up but I really can't see the justification on these bikes. The bang for the buck is just not there.

If "bang for buck" is what you are aiming at, I do it because i want to and i can, is there any other justification that counts...?
I wish you were closer, I'm a noob with injection and will be fitting mega squirt/ GSXR injection to my 1000cc build, need a holiday..? 

Get yourself on to those forums and DIY autotune, I bet there is a base map out there for you. They typically have some type of rough running setup you can at least get it to work with. What MS unit are you gonna run? I think you would only need something like the original, the cheap one. Even if you miss a feature you can usually have it added to the board later on

[Retro Rocket]

I'm big in to retrofitting and modifying stuff like DIY electronic ignition on cars, EFI using megasquirt, fabbing stuff up but I really can't see the justification on these bikes. The bang for the buck is just not there.

If "bang for buck" is what you are aiming at, I do it because i want to and i can, is there any other justification that counts...?
I wish you were closer, I'm a noob with injection and will be fitting mega squirt/ GSXR injection to my 1000cc build, need a holiday..? 

Get yourself on to those forums and DIY autotune, I bet there is a base map out there for you. They typically have some type of rough running setup you can at least get it to work with. What MS unit are you gonna run? I think you would only need something like the original, the cheap one. Even if you miss a feature you can usually have it added to the board later on

I'm a little on the retentive side so i'll go the whole hog straight up, any sensors needed i'll run, had a bit of a look at the Mega forums and i'd say it will be a certain stop for a while, there's actually a couple of guys here that have done it as well so baseline settings shouldn't be too hard to find.....

[bjbuchanan]

Last I checked this stuff out I believe at the most you would need just the MS2, with maybe a piggy back. Just not enough systems and crap you can add on lol

The MS2 will support all kinds of ignitions and boost with a small piggy back on it. I think you won't have too hard of a time because you have decent parts to start. Guys get in to trouble because they cheap out on parts and try to stretch duty cycles and can't get good low speed or WOT control.

It makes it a bit easier that it is a motorcycle. Half the headache is tucking stuff without driving yourself crazy on a car or having it look like crap.

[Retro Rocket]

Last I checked this stuff out I believe at the most you would need just the MS2, with maybe a piggy back. Just not enough systems and crap you can add on lol

The MS2 will support all kinds of ignitions and boost with a small piggy back on it. I think you won't have too hard of a time because you have decent parts to start. Guys get in to trouble because they cheap out on parts and try to stretch duty cycles and can't get good low speed or WOT control.

It makes it a bit easier that it is a motorcycle. Half the headache is tucking stuff without driving yourself crazy on a car or having it look like crap.

Haven't settled on a fuel pump yet, one inside the tank would be ideal but the tank shape says otherwise, I may use a smaller battery in the stock position and stick a pump next to it. No cheaping out on parts here so i'll do everything I have to do properly...   Thanks for the advice...

[bjbuchanan]

My buddy's R6 has the fuel pump external and out near the monoshock, near it's reservoir. That is the stock position. Maybe one of those pumps, R6, maybe R1 if it is a better pump that you would actually need to use?

If space allows I would tuck it up under the backbone where the wire harness runs down. You no longer need that vertical clearance as much because you don't have a rack moving up and down anymore. Down near the rubber gas tank mount

[Retro Rocket]

My buddy's R6 has the fuel pump external and out near the monoshock, near it's reservoir. That is the stock position. Maybe one of those pumps, R6, maybe R1 if it is a better pump that you would actually need to use?

If space allows I would tuck it up under the backbone where the wire harness runs down. You no longer need that vertical clearance as much because you don't have a rack moving up and down anymore. Down near the rubber gas tank mount

Didn't know the R's had external pumps, thanks for that...

[bjbuchanan]

Yup, all I can vouch for positively tho is the 99-02 generation. Haven't touched the other bikes

[Retro Rocket]

Yup, all I can vouch for positively tho is the 99-02 generation. Haven't touched the other bikes

Thats cool, i should be able to find one of those here, tons of R6 and R1's here...