Author Topic: Carillo rod bearing clearance for cb750  (Read 2781 times)

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Offline frodef2

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Carillo rod bearing clearance for cb750
« on: December 02, 2014, 10:06:13 PM »
I have just started the preparations for some "light" engine assembly, and i have a question about the bearing clearances for carillo rods.

According to the spec sheet that the rods came with http://cp-carrillo.com/LinkClick.aspx?fileticket=aVLyichF4%2Fs%3D&tabid=76, the target clearance for the bearings are 0.001" pr inch of crankshaft pin. This made my target clearance 0.0014".  After measuring the pin diameter with a micrometer and adding it all up with green bearings, i get these clearances.

Rod 1: 0.00142" Rod 2: 0.00126"  Rod 3: 0.00126"  Rod 4:  0.00150"

These values look like they are right in the middle of the approximate clearance value noted in the installation papers.

The installation note did not say anything about the min/max allowable clearance, should i just use the values listed in the workshop manual?




Frode Johansen

(edit: added engine type to the title)



 
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Offline HondaMan

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Re: Carillo rod bearing clearance for cb750
« Reply #1 on: December 02, 2014, 10:28:26 PM »
I have just started the preparations for some "light" engine assembly, and i have a question about the bearing clearances for carillo rods.

According to the spec sheet that the rods came with http://cp-carrillo.com/LinkClick.aspx?fileticket=aVLyichF4%2Fs%3D&tabid=76, the target clearance for the bearings are 0.001" pr inch of crankshaft pin. This made my target clearance 0.0014".  After measuring the pin diameter with a micrometer and adding it all up with green bearings, i get these clearances.

Rod 1: 0.00142" Rod 2: 0.00126"  Rod 3: 0.00126"  Rod 4:  0.00150"

These values look like they are right in the middle of the approximate clearance value noted in the installation papers.

The installation note did not say anything about the min/max allowable clearance, should i just use the values listed in the workshop manual?




Frode Johansen

(edit: added engine type to the title)



 
If you are heading straight for the racetrack, those numbers will be fine (i.e., .0012"-.0016").
However, if you are heading for the street and would like a longer-lasting, better-performing, smoother, cooler-running engine that will take about 500-1000 miles to settle in those bearings to a much better-balanced machine, consider using a little tighter spec. In my experience, starting new bearings with new rods on a used crank works best in the .0010"-.0012" range, if you can get it.

When the clearance reaches about 0.0022" the oil pressure starts to drop and the rings begin to struggle to hold back the extra oil that flings up to the bottom of the pistons. At .0030" the lower ring cannot hold the oil back and it begins burning oil and damaging the 2nd ring from this 'flood' when run to speeds above 7000 RPM. The oil pressure usually drops a lot, to about 30-35 PSI when hot, too. This causes cam wear problems pretty soon.
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Offline Jim F

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Re: Carillo rod bearing clearance for cb750
« Reply #2 on: December 03, 2014, 06:35:49 AM »
I keep mine as close to .0011/.0012 as posible
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Offline MRieck

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Re: Carillo rod bearing clearance for cb750
« Reply #3 on: December 03, 2014, 08:06:31 AM »
Carrillo's usually have the smallest factory bore. I think .0015 to .0017 is good for rods...mains run tighter. You want to get oil past the bearing to cool it...to tight makes that difficult.
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Offline Don R

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Re: Carillo rod bearing clearance for cb750
« Reply #4 on: March 04, 2026, 09:40:56 PM »
 I asked Google AI for this information and got the above for rod bearing clearance with a Carrillo rod performance build in mind. It referred to SOHC4.com 5 times, Engine Builder mag. and a YouTube video.
 
  It said .0008 to .0018 is normal new rod bearing clearance and .0015 to .0020 is considered usual for a performance build. The difference between each bearing color is around .0004" Race engine builders may use as much as .0020 to .0025.
 Polishing a crank can remove from nothing to .0004" and when smoothing a worn area as much as .001 can be removed.

 It also said optimal main bearing clearance is .0008 to .0018", the mains can be run slightly tighter than the rods unless there are main bearing alignment issues with the case. In that instance, clearance may be opened up to as much as .0020 with a service limit of .0021 to .0032.
 Sounds reasonable, considering it's searching everything out there. It also mentioned using 20W50 oil.
« Last Edit: March 04, 2026, 09:43:59 PM by Don R »
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Offline Don R

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Re: Carillo rod bearing clearance for cb750
« Reply #5 on: March 04, 2026, 10:05:49 PM »
 This story includes dohc information because pink and blue bearing colors are mentioned. This is the first reference I've seen to mixing different color bearing halves.
  We did that on my 383 small block chevy drag engine by going to +.001 bearing halves.

https://www.enginebuildermag.com/2015/10/honda-k-series-engine-bearing-identification-installation/#:~:text=There%20are%20two%20main%20bearing%2Dto%2Djournal%20oil%20clearances:,(22%20lbf/ft)%20*%20Tighten%20an%20additional%2056%C2%B0
« Last Edit: March 04, 2026, 10:11:06 PM by Don R »
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Offline willbird

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Re: Carillo rod bearing clearance for cb750
« Reply #6 on: March 05, 2026, 08:16:26 AM »
This story includes dohc information because pink and blue bearing colors are mentioned. This is the first reference I've seen to mixing different color bearing halves.
  We did that on my 383 small block chevy drag engine by going to +.001 bearing halves.

https://www.enginebuildermag.com/2015/10/honda-k-series-engine-bearing-identification-installation/#:~:text=There%20are%20two%20main%20bearing%2Dto%2Djournal%20oil%20clearances:,(22%20lbf/ft)%20*%20Tighten%20an%20additional%2056%C2%B0

In the mains it makes sense if there is an alignment issue that cannot be corrected. Chevy did it as a design feature in at least the small blocks. Just watched a vid where Cletus Mcfarland toured the Richard Childress racing campus and they were using air gauges to check bearing dia, claimed more accurate than a dial bore gauge which does make sense really. Engine builders can buy "overshize" shells which have a bigger OD as well as "undersize" that have a smaller ID, and they can get sizes other than the standard .01" increments too, they maybe have to buy a decent sized box of them. All of this for engines that get a lot more attention than the engines we are talking about.

Wow those Carillo rods are expensive :-), $1500 a set for a set I just saw on Ebay.




Bill
« Last Edit: March 05, 2026, 08:22:49 AM by willbird »

Offline MRieck

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Re: Carillo rod bearing clearance for cb750
« Reply #7 on: March 05, 2026, 08:29:18 AM »
Bryanj has talked about air gauge measuring of bearings in past posts. I've never seen it or done it myself.....all I have are conventional measuring tools. I imagine it is basically a "leak down" test for bearings?
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Offline willbird

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Re: Carillo rod bearing clearance for cb750
« Reply #8 on: March 05, 2026, 08:50:35 AM »
Bryanj has talked about air gauge measuring of bearings in past posts. I've never seen it or done it myself.....all I have are conventional measuring tools. I imagine it is basically a "leak down" test for bearings?

My exposure to air guaging was for the tooling one past employer made for Federal Mogul spark plug cold forming dies. Federal Mogul bought Champion. The die used to make the hex portion of a spark plug they ram EDM the inner shape then polish it by hand, and the hex portion is polished for size across the flats as well as surface finish.

 In that case the air gauge thing was rectangular and it measured that across the flats dimension. No idea the exact clearance they build into the gauging head but super clean metered air leaks around the gauge "member" and how much leaks is measured somehow, today electronically but that older stuff may have used inches of water or gauge oil ??

From a few vids I get the idea that some bearing shells when  installed by design do not have a round ID ??

My dad worked for a company after high school that would come out to your house and rebuild the engine in your car at your house, an in frame rebuild is term they use for bigger equipment. He said their standard practice for checking bearing clearances for split bearings was 1/2" square pieces of shim stock that had been cut and had the cut edges carefully peened to remove any burrs. One set of shims went in, caps were torqued and engine should still roll over with the shim between the bearing and the crank, then they took it aprt and put the upper limit shims in, and again torqued, and the thicker shims should lock the engine up. If there was an issue I suppose you could go back and do one at a time. Dad was always a but skeptical about Plastigauge, claimed it could lie, of course they were checking bearing clearances under your car in your driveway or garage :-). I see no problem with using shim stock really but have never tried it. Could be a quick double check method if things were not acting as they measure.

Bill


Offline Don R

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Re: Carillo rod bearing clearance for cb750
« Reply #9 on: March 05, 2026, 09:20:42 AM »
 Somewhere there was once a video of the original Honda bearing checkers at work, they could sand the backside of the shells to adjust a bearing to the correct fit then mark them with the correct color.
 That's why there isn't a stamped number that we could use.
« Last Edit: March 05, 2026, 11:35:57 PM by Don R »
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Re: Carillo rod bearing clearance for cb750
« Reply #10 on: March 05, 2026, 12:30:51 PM »
 So after studying all of this information I think the plan is get a set of green bearings, install, and check them.
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Offline MRieck

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Re: Carillo rod bearing clearance for cb750
« Reply #11 on: March 05, 2026, 08:32:24 PM »
So after studying all of this information I think the plan is get a set of green bearings, install, and check them.
That's a great start.👍
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Offline HondaMan

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Re: Carillo rod bearing clearance for cb750
« Reply #12 on: March 06, 2026, 10:04:12 AM »
Somewhere there was once a video of the original Honda bearing checkers at work, they could sand the backside of the shells to adjust a bearing to the correct fit then mark them with the correct color.
 That's why there isn't a stamped number that we could use.

That sure explains a lot on the K0 and Old Factory K1 engines.

I'm working on (yet another) K1 Old Factory engine now, and there's no bearing markings on the case at all. Sandcasts were sometimes that way, too. The crankshaft has odd, undecipherable scribblings on it, too. Someone installed all Yellow bearings in this one, coated on both sides with lithium grease (packed all the way up into the main oil journal, generous!?) and then bolted the cases back together with the old shaft seals still everywhere. Strange 'rebuild'. The rods are packed with the grease, too, can hardly move them.

I need about 100 CFM at 90 PSI to blow all the grease back out of the main oil journal. Some people's kids...
« Last Edit: March 06, 2026, 10:07:48 AM by HondaMan »
See SOHC4shop.com for info about the gadgets I make for these bikes.

The demons are repulsed when a man does good. Use that.
Blood is thicker than water, but motor oil is thicker yet...so, don't mess with my SOHC4, or I might have to hurt you.
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Link to Hondaman Ignition: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=67543.0

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Link to website: https://sohc4shop.com/  (Note: no longer at www.SOHC4shop.com, moved off WWW. in 2024).

Offline Don R

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Re: Carillo rod bearing clearance for cb750
« Reply #13 on: March 08, 2026, 11:48:25 PM »
 I used lithium grease on an engine once after reading that it was a good idea and then it never got started, later, I took it apart and cleaned it all off. UGH. The hydraulic lifters are still swimming in an ATF/oil bath. It might finally get re-assembled next year.
No matter how many times you paint over a shadow, it's still there.
 CEO at the no kill motorcycle shop.
 You don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows.