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Author Topic: What would cause what would seem like a shrinking clutch cable? 77 550  (Read 5913 times)

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Offline Lostboy Steve

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What would cause what would seem like a shrinking clutch cable? 77 550
« on: May 28, 2016, 06:17:39 AM »
I'm on the interstate doing about 80 (wont lie). Had been cruising for probably 20~ miles when all of the sudden tach started to spike. Eventually I lost speed and pulled over. I just did this clutch and was about as thorough as one can be. Its been fine for probably about 100 miles. After pulling over, I loosened the cable adjuster all the way and was able to get friction again. Once I got to my destination I checked everything's adjustment and its been fine ever since. Rode it home another 30 miles or so. Very strange, anyway have a great holiday everyone.
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Offline MoMo

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Re: What would cause what would seem like a shrinking clutch cable? 77 550
« Reply #1 on: May 28, 2016, 06:31:58 AM »
Only thing that comes to me is that is possible the cable was not fully seated at either end. It then slipped into the adjuster causing freeplay.  ...Larry
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Offline Don R

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Re: What would cause what would seem like a shrinking clutch cable? 77 550
« Reply #2 on: May 28, 2016, 07:26:56 AM »
clutch lifter adjustment? It's the screw with the nut on it on the clutch cover. Been there.
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Offline Lostboy Steve

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Re: What would cause what would seem like a shrinking clutch cable? 77 550
« Reply #3 on: May 28, 2016, 03:24:04 PM »
Quote from: Don R on May 28, 2016, 07:26:56 AM
clutch lifter adjustment? It's the screw with the nut on it on the clutch cover. Been there.


Yeah don, but I had it adjusted... So how would it change mid ride? I'm stumped.


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Offline CB650CPastor

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Re: What would cause what would seem like a shrinking clutch cable? 77 550
« Reply #4 on: May 31, 2016, 08:33:17 PM »
Maybe whoever adjusted it forgot to tighten the locknut?
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Offline alacrity

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Re: What would cause what would seem like a shrinking clutch cable? 77 550
« Reply #5 on: May 31, 2016, 11:55:38 PM »
how are the threads (both sides) of the clutch lifter adjustment screw? If they are super worn, under pressure, it coulda been forcibly backed out
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Offline jonda500

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Re: What would cause what would seem like a shrinking clutch cable? 77 550
« Reply #6 on: June 01, 2016, 12:24:16 AM »
Quote from: alacrity on May 31, 2016, 11:55:38 PM
how are the threads (both sides) of the clutch lifter adjustment screw? If they are super worn, under pressure, it coulda been forcibly backed out

If the clutch cable went loose that may explain it, however, in this case the clutch cable went TIGHT not loose and the clutch started to slip...
Couldn't be a not fully seated cable outer either for the same reason...
I honestly can't think what would cause this? John
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A starter clutch thread:
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Offline Lostboy Steve

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Re: What would cause what would seem like a shrinking clutch cable? 77 550
« Reply #7 on: June 01, 2016, 03:19:28 AM »
Quote from: jonda500 on June 01, 2016, 12:24:16 AM
Quote from: alacrity on May 31, 2016, 11:55:38 PM
how are the threads (both sides) of the clutch lifter adjustment screw? If they are super worn, under pressure, it coulda been forcibly backed out

If the clutch cable went loose that may explain it, however, in this case the clutch cable went TIGHT not loose and the clutch started to slip...
Couldn't be a not fully seated cable outer either for the same reason...
I honestly can't think what would cause this? John

Right. It's freaking bizarre. Again, it's fine now. Lol I'm just worried because I have a fairly long trip coming up.


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Offline Lostboy Steve

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Re: What would cause what would seem like a shrinking clutch cable? 77 550
« Reply #8 on: June 18, 2016, 01:55:42 PM »
Well guys, I figured a little update was due. Its been fine for probably about 350 miles or so. Today on the way home, same thing. Now it won't adjust out. I think the whole clutch burned out. There's still plenty of play in the lever, but it's neutral or nothing. Idk what's going on. The bike has been riding better than ever recently.
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Offline flatlander

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Re: What would cause what would seem like a shrinking clutch cable? 77 550
« Reply #9 on: June 18, 2016, 02:04:29 PM »
you said you "just did this clutch" before this first happened. what exactly did you do?
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Offline alacrity

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Re: What would cause what would seem like a shrinking clutch cable? 77 550
« Reply #10 on: June 18, 2016, 06:43:15 PM »
yeah that's a good question... did you replace the shim where it goes next to the basket? etc.  Compare your full parts stack exactly against the fiche for your bike.... make sure it's perfect.  I would get a new cable. I would check very closely to be sure the small angled lever arm that hooks against and presses the pack against the springs is perfect also.  IF its badly worn it can slip off. I buy new ones of these wearable items.
On my 78 cb550, the cheap little part is on the fiche:
   #006   CAM, CLUTCH LIFTER
22821-116-000

IF you need the Adjustable lever arm (because the threads are stripped or it's bent or cracked - that's
discontinued at honda: LEVER, CLUTCH ADJ. 22831-333-020   but maybe avail at DSS or CMNSL?
« Last Edit: June 18, 2016, 06:46:32 PM by alacrity »
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I recently restored and sold a 77 cb750f, and am nearly finished with a (former basket case) cb750k5.  This is a place to share, learn and enjoy.  I am grateful to and for 99+% of this site's membership.

Offline Lostboy Steve

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Re: What would cause what would seem like a shrinking clutch cable? 77 550
« Reply #11 on: June 19, 2016, 05:09:48 AM »
Alright, heres the list.

Clutch Plates (Barnett)
Steels
Springs (Barnett)
Cable (Motion Pro)
I Filed and polished all the tangs on the basket.
I checked everything else and its all in good shape.

I'm loosing my mind here.
I'll pull it apart as soon as my disgust settles and post some pics.
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Offline Lostboy Steve

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Re: What would cause what would seem like a shrinking clutch cable? 77 550
« Reply #12 on: June 19, 2016, 05:11:46 AM »
Quote from: alacrity on June 18, 2016, 06:43:15 PM
yeah that's a good question... did you replace the shim where it goes next to the basket? etc.  Compare your full parts stack exactly against the fiche for your bike.... make sure it's perfect.  I would get a new cable. I would check very closely to be sure the small angled lever arm that hooks against and presses the pack against the springs is perfect also.  IF its badly worn it can slip off. I buy new ones of these wearable items.
On my 78 cb550, the cheap little part is on the fiche:
   #006   CAM, CLUTCH LIFTER
22821-116-000

IF you need the Adjustable lever arm (because the threads are stripped or it's bent or cracked - that's
discontinued at honda: LEVER, CLUTCH ADJ. 22831-333-020   but maybe avail at DSS or CMNSL?

btw, if any of these were worn or off, wouldn't it just not disengage? I have the opposite problem.
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Offline flatlander

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Re: What would cause what would seem like a shrinking clutch cable? 77 550
« Reply #13 on: June 19, 2016, 05:38:16 AM »
did you soak the friction plates before installing?
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Offline Lostboy Steve

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Re: What would cause what would seem like a shrinking clutch cable? 77 550
« Reply #14 on: June 19, 2016, 03:55:19 PM »
Quote from: flatlander on June 19, 2016, 05:38:16 AM
did you soak the friction plates before installing?
Yes sir. In the same oil I normally run. Looks like the wr is going to be getting some use, because I just don't have the time to figure this out right now. So aggravating.
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Offline Lostboy Steve

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Re: What would cause what would seem like a shrinking clutch cable? 77 550
« Reply #15 on: June 19, 2016, 05:10:37 PM »
Something interesting I just noticed here.... On Barnett's site, it says 6 steels and 7 friction, which is what i ordered. 6 of one and the 7th has the larger fingers. On Dynoman's site, it says the +1 kit is 7 steel and 8 friction... Now I'm wondering if I'm short a pair... That would explain A LOT. Maybe I shoudl cut my losses (about 200$ with the oil and all) and just order the Dynoman kit.
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Offline flatlander

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Re: What would cause what would seem like a shrinking clutch cable? 77 550
« Reply #16 on: June 19, 2016, 11:14:56 PM »
before you flush the 200 down the drain, can you post a pic of your stack, as it sits in the basket? now i wonder how much free space you have in it.
7 friction plates and 6 steel disks is the stock amount. some models had a thicker, springed "damper plate". dynoman seems to have a combination with an additional pair of of plates which makes a stronger clutch. either way, you need to end up with the right amount of free space. if it's too much your clutch may be slipping or in extreme cases not want to engage any more.

check this thread - not necessarily for the mods but for the pictures and explanation: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,145565.0.html
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Offline Lostboy Steve

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Re: What would cause what would seem like a shrinking clutch cable? 77 550
« Reply #17 on: June 20, 2016, 06:14:17 AM »
Yeah, I'm going to pull it apart tonight. I can see in the dipstick hole that it seems as though my freespace is that of stock. Of course I cant measure it yet though. If I throw it in gear and push the kickstart lever it easily slips. The adjuster on the cover is maxed out. Either way, I have to replace them all now don't I? I literally limped it 2 miles doing about 10mph the discs must be cooked now...
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Offline Lostboy Steve

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Re: What would cause what would seem like a shrinking clutch cable? 77 550
« Reply #18 on: June 20, 2016, 06:18:07 AM »
Btw, flatlander, I had the same problem as you. I got the bike without the damper plate. When I originally got it running the clutch slipped pretty badly and I thought it was just old clutch plates, but now that I am having this problem I can see that not having that reference could be my problem. Interesting that the bike didnt have that plate with only 8k on it...
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Offline flatlander

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Re: What would cause what would seem like a shrinking clutch cable? 77 550
« Reply #19 on: June 20, 2016, 06:59:00 AM »
my problem was slightly different. when i noticed it, it was when cruising in a high gear then, to get max acceleration, shifting down one or two gears into high revs. it always slipped for a while before it started gripping. so that was only when max power was applied.

the last thing i did, as you can see on that linked thread, solved all slipping completely by combining plates and disks of different thickness to reduce the amount of free space.

it could well be something different as well. you'll need to pull it apart and examine it carefully vs. the parts list and shop manual to make sure everything is put together correctly.
if i were you i wouldn't go and buy all new clutch parts yet. pull it apart, see what you got, and decide what you need to do.
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Offline Lostboy Steve

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Re: What would cause what would seem like a shrinking clutch cable? 77 550
« Reply #20 on: June 20, 2016, 09:43:05 AM »
No I meant same issue as in never saw the original clutch with the damper plate. Anyhow, I know its together correctly, but too much free play could be (most likely is) the problem.
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Offline flatlander

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Re: What would cause what would seem like a shrinking clutch cable? 77 550
« Reply #21 on: June 20, 2016, 10:57:47 AM »
ok makes sense. then it's worth trying with some thicker discs and/or plates to reduce the free space.
if you did not do any performance upgrades then the 7 friction plates are sufficient.
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Offline Lostboy Steve

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Re: What would cause what would seem like a shrinking clutch cable? 77 550
« Reply #22 on: June 20, 2016, 03:52:47 PM »
I have no time to tear into it tonight either, but while passing by to get a nice cold club soda......

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Offline Lostboy Steve

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Re: What would cause what would seem like a shrinking clutch cable? 77 550
« Reply #23 on: June 21, 2016, 06:11:33 AM »
Clearly judging by my picture compared to flatlanders, I have excess space.
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Offline Lostboy Steve

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Re: What would cause what would seem like a shrinking clutch cable? 77 550
« Reply #24 on: June 24, 2016, 06:37:02 PM »
Well this bad boy is smoked. Absolutely 100% gone.

It was a height issue. Probably should have squeezed an extra plate in there. The new pack I have sits at the proper height. Hopefully this residue that's probably in every nook and cranny inside my engine won't cause problems.

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