Author Topic: High Performance PRIMARY Chain tensioner for CB750(MessnerMoto)  (Read 11254 times)

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Offline MessnerMoto

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Re: High Performance PRIMARY Chain tensioner for CB750(MessnerMoto)
« Reply #50 on: March 12, 2019, 01:04:53 am »
.....
They are not any special chains.
.....

What makes them "special" is CCC had IWIS run a batch in the correct 68 link size.
Not saying you cannot buy them here but that eBay seller will not ship to the USA.
I had IWIS US Rep quote some after CCC sold out and you have to have several 100 made to get the price down.
Granted, it's easy enough to remove 4 links.

so they are not specially made like it is stated in brochure that is heavily misguiding cb750 community that they are some specially engineered chains just for cb750.

you can find them locally in US or from other buyer on ebay

If I order locally 100 SWAG-30-93-9962 like a distributor and get them shorten 4 links by specialized company it will not cost me more then 20-25eu per chain.

and shortening the chain is 15min job... if I do it with home made tool

...................

and now back to the topic
« Last Edit: March 12, 2019, 04:08:19 am by MessnerMoto »

Offline MessnerMoto

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Re: High Performance PRIMARY Chain tensioner for CB750(MessnerMoto)
« Reply #51 on: March 18, 2019, 08:36:37 am »
I figured a way to make manual adjuster that does not demand welding to lower case

it will need one 14mm hole drilled without special tools

Offline slikwilli420

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Re: High Performance PRIMARY Chain tensioner for CB750(MessnerMoto)
« Reply #52 on: March 18, 2019, 09:30:06 am »
I figured a way to make manual adjuster that does not demand welding to lower case

it will need one 14mm hole drilled without special tools

So is this part of the system you designed or a change over from using spring pressure on a stock system?
All you gotta do is do what you gotta do.

Vintage Speed Parts Mashup: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=133638.0
Rickman CR Parts Kit Refresh: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,154837.0.html
AHRMA CB750 Racer: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,158461.0.html
AHRMA Superbike Heavyweight Racer: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,173120.0.html
'76F CB750 Patina Redemption: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,174871.0.html

Offline MessnerMoto

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Re: High Performance PRIMARY Chain tensioner for CB750(MessnerMoto)
« Reply #53 on: March 18, 2019, 09:54:18 am »
no this is optional... springs stayes in the game ether way

but the smart thing is that with this you can fine tune how much you want travel in lower tensioner

or completely lock it or even alow full travel
« Last Edit: March 18, 2019, 09:56:00 am by MessnerMoto »

Offline slikwilli420

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Re: High Performance PRIMARY Chain tensioner for CB750(MessnerMoto)
« Reply #54 on: March 18, 2019, 10:05:10 am »
no this is optional... springs stayes in the game ether way

but the smart thing is that with this you can fine tune how much you want travel in lower tensioner

or completely lock it or even alow full travel

I like that better. Not a manual tensioner but a travel limiter. That is a great idea, though I am not sure who would be qualified to determine how much travel is needed?
All you gotta do is do what you gotta do.

Vintage Speed Parts Mashup: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=133638.0
Rickman CR Parts Kit Refresh: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,154837.0.html
AHRMA CB750 Racer: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,158461.0.html
AHRMA Superbike Heavyweight Racer: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,173120.0.html
'76F CB750 Patina Redemption: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,174871.0.html

Offline gschuld

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Re: High Performance PRIMARY Chain tensioner for CB750(MessnerMoto)
« Reply #55 on: March 18, 2019, 10:56:46 am »
no this is optional... springs stayes in the game ether way

but the smart thing is that with this you can fine tune how much you want travel in lower tensioner

or completely lock it or even alow full travel

I like that better. Not a manual tensioner but a travel limiter. That is a great idea, though I am not sure who would be qualified to determine how much travel is needed?

This is how Brent Hyde did his Hyvo chain primary tensioners before finally going to gears a few year ago.  Hinged slider with a top quality slider material and a manual adjuster.👍

George

Offline slikwilli420

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Re: High Performance PRIMARY Chain tensioner for CB750(MessnerMoto)
« Reply #56 on: March 18, 2019, 11:18:55 am »
no this is optional... springs stayes in the game ether way

but the smart thing is that with this you can fine tune how much you want travel in lower tensioner

or completely lock it or even alow full travel

I like that better. Not a manual tensioner but a travel limiter. That is a great idea, though I am not sure who would be qualified to determine how much travel is needed?

This is how Brent Hyde did his Hyvo chain primary tensioners before finally going to gears a few year ago.  Hinged slider with a top quality slider material and a manual adjuster.👍

George

But how tight is just right?
All you gotta do is do what you gotta do.

Vintage Speed Parts Mashup: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=133638.0
Rickman CR Parts Kit Refresh: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,154837.0.html
AHRMA CB750 Racer: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,158461.0.html
AHRMA Superbike Heavyweight Racer: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,173120.0.html
'76F CB750 Patina Redemption: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,174871.0.html

Offline MessnerMoto

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Re: High Performance PRIMARY Chain tensioner for CB750(MessnerMoto)
« Reply #57 on: March 18, 2019, 11:24:54 am »
I would always allow some travel. 5mm for sure. But thats my feeling

Offline turboguzzi

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Re: High Performance PRIMARY Chain tensioner for CB750(MessnerMoto)
« Reply #58 on: March 18, 2019, 12:01:49 pm »
i would leave enough slack so the chain can go "straight" under overrun pull.

Offline MessnerMoto

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Re: High Performance PRIMARY Chain tensioner for CB750(MessnerMoto)
« Reply #59 on: March 18, 2019, 12:14:34 pm »
i would leave enough slack so the chain can go "straight" under overrun pull.

yoss I think that would completely defeat purpose of restrictor.

Main idea here is to eliminate slack when it is created in upper part of the chain.

Offline Captain

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Re: High Performance PRIMARY Chain tensioner for CB750(MessnerMoto)
« Reply #60 on: March 18, 2019, 01:23:40 pm »
 OK, here is something that is very important to the effective use and operation of HyVo chains.....All is based on my seemingly endless efforts to understand and build a better solution to both cam chain problems and primary drive limitations. It would be safe to say that I have succeeded with this as there are so many of my DOHC designed parts out there in the world being used successfully. One of the defining principals in the design of these chain related parts is the following. 
 By nature of the chain design and the action of the "tooth" form adjusting itself on entry into the gear and further as it rotates with it (including centrifugal force), the chain self tightens and so the free length changes.  This means that if an rigid guide and tensioner is used then this event must be allowed for otherwise part of the chain capacity is degraded by an amount equal to this restriction. OEM designs allow for various amounts of deflection and this deflection is one of the two major problems that can lead early failure in certain applications.
 The correct way to allow for this occurrence is to provide an amount of set-up free play and my experience has shown this to be 1.0 thru1.5 mm   Kept within this range and with a lid on high RPM then the tensioner slipper and chain will provide the best capacity and durability you can achieve with this particular chain format.

 Captain
   

Offline turboguzzi

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Re: High Performance PRIMARY Chain tensioner for CB750(MessnerMoto)
« Reply #61 on: March 18, 2019, 01:54:29 pm »
and i thought this tensioner was for normal chains.... not hyvo... is it just me?

hy-vos indeeed self adjust tension by ridign higher on the sprocket teeth

anyway, mirko, at least in the 500s what you want to eliminate is bottom run flop... thats whats happens most of the time you are running with power. and this is the run of the chain that sometimes touches the nearby oil gallery. 750s might be different...


Offline MessnerMoto

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Re: High Performance PRIMARY Chain tensioner for CB750(MessnerMoto)
« Reply #62 on: April 10, 2019, 02:32:28 am »
Final version.

The manual adjuster will be extra/optional.
« Last Edit: April 10, 2019, 02:34:55 am by MessnerMoto »

Offline slikwilli420

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Re: High Performance PRIMARY Chain tensioner for CB750(MessnerMoto)
« Reply #63 on: April 10, 2019, 04:05:14 am »
Awesome!
All you gotta do is do what you gotta do.

Vintage Speed Parts Mashup: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=133638.0
Rickman CR Parts Kit Refresh: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,154837.0.html
AHRMA CB750 Racer: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,158461.0.html
AHRMA Superbike Heavyweight Racer: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,173120.0.html
'76F CB750 Patina Redemption: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,174871.0.html

Offline gschuld

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Re: High Performance PRIMARY Chain tensioner for CB750(MessnerMoto)
« Reply #64 on: April 10, 2019, 07:30:14 am »
OK guys, we have a number of people who have privately said yes to buying one of these so Mirko can go ahead and get the first batch made.

Time to commit... some of us have time constraints and are eager to have them in hand shortly to go in a new engine.

I believe the price is $350 EU for the setup and $65 EU extra for the manual adjuster.  The PA46 Nylatron slider material being used is THE best material available for the job, made in only one factory in the World in Germany.

I’m in for 2, with manual adjuster.

George
« Last Edit: April 10, 2019, 07:55:16 am by gschuld »

Offline RAZZ

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Re: High Performance PRIMARY Chain tensioner for CB750(MessnerMoto)
« Reply #65 on: April 10, 2019, 07:31:54 am »
Can we have a price Mirko


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Offline MessnerMoto

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Re: High Performance PRIMARY Chain tensioner for CB750(MessnerMoto)
« Reply #66 on: April 10, 2019, 08:19:02 am »
George is correct. I am organizing everything as we speak.

Offline slikwilli420

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Re: High Performance PRIMARY Chain tensioner for CB750(MessnerMoto)
« Reply #67 on: April 10, 2019, 09:54:39 am »
Im in for 1, with adjuster.
All you gotta do is do what you gotta do.

Vintage Speed Parts Mashup: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=133638.0
Rickman CR Parts Kit Refresh: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,154837.0.html
AHRMA CB750 Racer: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,158461.0.html
AHRMA Superbike Heavyweight Racer: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,173120.0.html
'76F CB750 Patina Redemption: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,174871.0.html

Offline kmb69

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Re: High Performance PRIMARY Chain tensioner for CB750(MessnerMoto)
« Reply #68 on: April 10, 2019, 01:23:29 pm »
Im in for 1, with adjuster.

Offline Medyo Bastos

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Re: High Performance PRIMARY Chain tensioner for CB750(MessnerMoto)
« Reply #69 on: April 10, 2019, 05:09:09 pm »
Im in for 1, with adjuster.

ako din

Offline gschuld

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Re: High Performance PRIMARY Chain tensioner for CB750(MessnerMoto)
« Reply #70 on: April 10, 2019, 06:10:36 pm »
Im in for 1, with adjuster.

ako din

Though I guessed right, I had to look that one up Medyo🤔....

Offline Medyo Bastos

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Re: High Performance PRIMARY Chain tensioner for CB750(MessnerMoto)
« Reply #71 on: April 10, 2019, 08:21:21 pm »
Im in for 1, with adjuster.

ako din

Though I guessed right, I had to look that one up Medyo....


Lol, angaling mo


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Offline MessnerMoto

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Re: High Performance PRIMARY Chain tensioner for CB750(MessnerMoto)
« Reply #72 on: April 11, 2019, 07:00:10 am »
I am in the process of acquiring PA 46 from Germany. When material arrives machining starts.

Offline Don R

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Re: High Performance PRIMARY Chain tensioner for CB750(MessnerMoto)
« Reply #73 on: April 12, 2019, 09:00:32 pm »
 I'm on the list for one to be supportive of the effort.
No matter how many times you paint over a shadow, it's still there.

Offline Tracksnblades1

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Re: High Performance PRIMARY Chain tensioner for CB750(MessnerMoto)
« Reply #74 on: April 13, 2019, 07:00:00 pm »
I'm on the list for one to be supportive of the effort.

Im in for 1, with adjuster.

ako din

Im in for 1, with adjuster.


Im in for 1, with adjuster.

uno, with manual adjuster option.....😇

Thanks Mirko,  email me for F&F PayPal instructions. Then you can work on my dime.
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