Topic: Static Timing Issue: Blue and Yellow wires never ground.. always stay lit

[Kirin36]

What’s up everyone! I finally got my motor assembled, and in the bike this week. I opted to try out the dyna-s ignition, despite how consistent points have worked.... I know. ”if it ain’t broke don’t fix it”

Already I’ve ran into an issue. After installation both of my coil leads never turn off upon rotating the motor when trying to set static timing!

Things I’ve done: double checked grounds, ensured 12v is going to the dyna system via switched power, swapped blue and yellow wires, took off and re installed ignition rotor making sure magnet has correct placement.

One thing I might add; I don’t have the spark plugs in, or the plug wire caps installed. Will this effect the static timing process?

Thank you all for the input.. I’m very excited to hear this bike run after the couples years it’s been.

[HondaMan]

What’s up everyone! I finally got my motor assembled, and in the bike this week. I opted to try out the dyna-s ignition, despite how consistent points have worked.... I know. ”if it ain’t broke don’t fix it”

Already I’ve ran into an issue. After installation both of my coil leads never turn off upon rotating the motor when trying to set static timing!

Things I’ve done: double checked grounds, ensured 12v is going to the dyna system via switched power, swapped blue and yellow wires, took off and re installed ignition rotor making sure magnet has correct placement.

One thing I might add; I don’t have the spark plugs in, or the plug wire caps installed. Will this effect the static timing process?

Thank you all for the input.. I’m very excited to hear this bike run after the couples years it’s been.

First thing: remove the sparkplugs. Turning the engine via the big nut by the points in the CCW direction with the plugs in WILL bend the shaft that the advancer is bolted to...

If you have another magnet somewhere, try passing it close to the Dyna trigger and then away, to see if you can get it to turn off. It is a polarized Hall Effect switch that is doing the switching, so try both the ends of your other magnet. I think the Dyna uses the N pole to turn them off, IIRC.

[Kirin36]

Thank you Honda Man! I will try this tomorrow.

[Kirin36]

Update, so I tried the magnet. The test light remained lit. This is getting pretty wacky! I’m going to do more research and see if there is anything I could be possibly missing. I want to believe it’s not a faulty unit but, I’m not sure.

Feel free to chime in, anyone! 

[scottly]

How are you connecting the test light? Have you tried cranking the motor over with the starter and checking for spark?

[Kirin36]

Haven’t tried checking for spark yet, because I just assumed there would be none! But I’ll check that. As for the starter, I don’t have it working quite yet- just kick starter.

Test light is grounded to motor, ignition is on, killswitch is on or “run”, test light probe is inside the blue coil lead. Same result happens inside yellow lead too.

[scottly]

Verify you are getting switched 12V on the red dyna wire. Those clamp-on splices don't always cut through the insulation.

[Kirin36]

I have 12.28 V at the red wire to ignition. Just tested it, I opted to not use that crimpy wire thing. Pain in the ass and the connection is usually worse

Made a weird discovery..

When testing for spark with spark plugs like you said, and no test light.. I have spark!!

The moment I hook up the test light (via ground on engine case, and the blue coil lead 1-4) I don't get the test light to turn off (spark).. Can I static time it off just the spark?

[seanbarney41]

If you are going to time it with a strobe with the engine running, just set it in the middle, start the bike and time it.  Not gonna hurt anything.

[Kirin36]

I don't own a strobe quite yet.. But I will get one!

Does anyone have any advice on static timing the engine off just the spark on the plug? I know these dyna's have to be timed with the magnet fully advanced, so I'm also taking that into consideration when i'll try it

[scottly]

Yes, you can static time by the spark, in fact, this was the standard procedure for old air-cooled VWs. You rotate the motor while watching the timing marks and listening for the snap of the spark. The snap should happen when the F mark lines up; if not, rotate the plate and try again.

[Kirin36]

Thanks Scottly!

Do I need to worry about advancing the magnetic rotor whilst doing the timing? I saw a video of someone doing that with an electronic ignition. Should start this tomorrow! First time in... a long time.

[scottly]

No, DO NOT advance the rotor. I don't have any idea where Dyna got that from??!! If the advance mechanism is working properly, you always static time at the F mark. Full advance is best dynamically checked with a strobe, with the engine running above 2500 RPM or so, and should return to the F mark at idle.

[middletons]

You need to rotate the advancer...

http://www.dynaonline.com/skins/downloads/instruct/DS1-1_1-2.pdf

[rotortiller]

DO NOT advance the rotor. I don't have any idea where Dyna got that from??!!

Pretty simple when you stop to think about it. With the rotor advanced you use the advance "ll" timing marks. These are more important that the "f" marks as it is where the engine produces power and where pistons are holed LOL They also know that the geometry is such that it is highly possible both the "f" and "ll"advance marks will not line up. They picked the lesser evil and supplied a static method to achieve the best situation.

[Kirin36]

So, I do need to turn the rotor while timing... got ya.

Thank you all for the replies. I'll be timing it off of the || Mark, waiting for spark there with the rotor advanced. At least thats what I'm understanding

[seanbarney41]

DO NOT advance the rotor. I don't have any idea where Dyna got that from??!!

Pretty simple when you stop to think about it. With the rotor advanced you use the advance "ll" timing marks. These are more important that the "f" marks as it is where the engine produces power and where pistons are holed LOL They also know that the geometry is such that it is highly possible both the "f" and "ll"advance marks will not line up. They picked the lesser evil and supplied a static method to achieve the best situation.

actually, whats even more simple when you think about it is that if static timing is spot on the f, the only way it won't still be spot on when advanced is if your advancer is damaged, worn, or broken.  So make sure your advancer works properly and time it any way you want.  The marks are part of the advancer, after all.

[rotortiller]

the only way it won't still be spot on when advanced is if your advancer is damaged, worn, or broken.

If you install a magnetic rotor to the advance unit which by nature reduces travel then the advance curve is smaller. It isn't worn, damaged, or broken, it is just not designed the same as stock.

[seanbarney41]

ok, I have only set up a couple dyna's before...mostly just thrown them in the trash when they stopped working.  And yes, I certainly agree you should follow the manufacturer instructions when setting it up.  Please explain how the magnetic rotor reduces travel "by nature".  The only thing that I can see that is going to reduce travel is physical modification of the stops built into the advancer.  I'd have to go take a look at how all this is put together as it's been almost a year since I have messed with one and it was a Kawasaki, but does the larger o.d. of the dyna rotor take up a portion of the free space between the advancer's stops?

[Spanner 1]

The fix is to stand by a large body of water and rotate your Dyna by the wire in a fast rotation over your head and release it in to the lake/ ocean Then buy an OEM points plate. ( I'm so against Dyna's , lol . ).

[scottly]

The fix is to stand by a large body of water and rotate your Dyna by the wire in a fast rotation over your head and release it in to the lake/ ocean Then buy an OEM points plate. ( I'm so against Dyna's , lol . ).

LOL! Once a Luddite, always a Luddite. Hope all is well, Ray.

[bryanj]

Sorry, from a confirmed luddite all i see is lots of posts on problems with dyns ignition

[rotortiller]

Please explain how the magnetic rotor reduces travel

The one I had was transplanted years ago on a normally functioning advance unit. Tested as so- when I set the "f" mark accurately and then twisted the advance to full the "ll" were off a tad. I think it may have been the way the  magnetic cam notches fit to the advance arms or how the arms hit the thicker cam in the retracted idle position. Because advance was incapable of supplying enough travel I opted for "ll" alignment. It worked fine for years that way. All I am saying is when you cannot have your cake and eat it too and all looks mechanically sound, use the advance marks.

[seanbarney41]

So, if you even notice slightly under advanced timing, which is unlikely if we are just talking about a few degrees, there is actually less danger of a holed piston than if you set it dead nuts at the middle of the advance marks.  It is over advance that you got to watch out for.

[rotortiller]

It is over advance that you got to watch out for.

Naturally.