Topic: 73 Firebird Formula 400 - Ready for Spring!

[CBJoe]

Thanks...yes, we are very happy we got a 73 and not a 74 or later.  Not that the later years aren't slick...but these earlier second gens have great lines.

Currently I'm preparing for the swap back to the original style carb with the hot air choke.  Been doing a lot of reading because almost all of the emissions have been removed from this machine.  I need to source new choke stove lines and a new fuel line from the pump to carb.

Currently All emissions has been deleted with no EGR or what I believe pontiac called the TCS system. 

[my name is nobody]

Thanks...yes, we are very happy we got a 73 and not a 74 or later.  Not that the later years aren't slick...but these earlier second gens have great lines.

Currently I'm preparing for the swap back to the original style carb with the hot air choke.  Been doing a lot of reading because almost all of the emissions have been removed from this machine.  I need to source new choke stove lines and a new fuel line from the pump to carb.

Currently All emissions has been deleted with no EGR or what I believe pontiac called the TCS system.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Rochester-Carburetors-by-Doug-Roe-1987-Paperback-Book/254626291687?_trkparms=aid%3D111001%26algo%3DREC.SEED%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D225073%26meid%3Df8ef75e6b05e43c5bfee5c56a80886ac%26pid%3D100667%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D8%26mehot%3Dnone%26sd%3D254626291687%26itm%3D254626291687%26pmt%3D0%26noa%3D1%26pg%3D2334524&_trksid=p2334524.c100667.m2042




This will help you. And TCS stands for Transmission Controlled Spark, it prevents vacuum advance from operating until certain conditions are met, (maybe vehicle speed ) by the transmission. Totally by-passable.
Everybody disconnected them and ran straight manifold vacuum from the rear port of the baseplate to the
distributor advance can. The book in the link describes the q- jet very thoroughly.

[dave500]

the doug roe book is good,get cliff ruggles one it has a more modern take on things and slightly more detail,get both!

[Bankerdanny]

Personally, if funds are not an issue, I would replace the carb with a Holley Sniper setup. Mounts like a carb so you keep the original air cleaner assembly and thus it looks basically stock but with superior starting and fuel economy.

[CBJoe]

Personally, if funds are not an issue, I would replace the carb with a Holley Sniper setup. Mounts like a carb so you keep the original air cleaner assembly and thus it looks basically stock but with superior starting and fuel economy.

For now we are replacing with a correct model quadrajet.....we found a rebuilt one for a great price.  Hopefully will have it in a few days.  Holly Sniper or other EFI is a thought for the future for sure.

[Stev-o]

Personally, if funds are not an issue, I would replace the carb with a Holley Sniper setup.

My friend has the Holley Sniper on his ol' Chevy.   Starting is immediate, dont know about fuel economy.  The throttle is very hard to put the "petal to the metal" maybe a different spring could be used?



Personally, I havent had any issues with the carb on my Corvette, it is staying.

[CBJoe]

Nice find. Oddly, I think they called that color carousel red.

Hey Don...you were correct that this was not navajo orange....but its not carousel red.  When we pulled the door panels off, its clear its a darker and more red/orange than the original.  But to be honest we like it better than the Navajo Orange.  Its more of a crayola tangerine orange.  Got lots of nice comments on our shakedown drive from random folks. 

 

[Stev-o]

Nice find. Oddly, I think they called that color carousel red.

Hey Don...you were correct that this was not navajo orange....but its not carousel red. 

Hey Joe,

It could of originally been Florentine or Buccaneer Red


   1973   Pontiac   Firebird   Florentine Red      
        1973   Pontiac   Firebird   Buccaneer Red                  
   1973   Pontiac   Firebird   Navajo Orange

https://paintref.com/cgi-bin/colorcodedisplay.cgi?model=Firebird&year=1973&con=oy&rows=50

[Don R]

 I put a sniper on my race car. It's impressive. The Quadrajet is an awesome piece when working properly,  I'd go with that myself. I also carry the carb and plumbing in the trailer because an injector failure would put an early end to racing. 

[CBJoe]

Got the new Quadrajet in the mail today and got it all installed.  I'm pulling a nice 20" of vacuum at idle. 

Few things needed to finish up that bit of it:
- I have a quadrajet specific plumbing manifold on order now that attaches at the rear to give full vacuum to the Transmission, Brake Booster and AC Control.
- Choke tubes for the hot-air choke on order
- Going to replace the fuel line between pump and carb with a full stainless bent line. 

Currently idling really nice around 700RPM




Now onto the next bit....Digging into the dash wiring.  Started noticing some funky stuff associated with the Tach not working.  Currently have all the gauges pulled.  Some chucklhead did a shyte job of wiring and grounding everything.  Going to really dig into the Dash wiring and correct what needs done.  Tach Circuit board is totally blown....Once I get it out I'll see what components are toast and look to repair/replace.




All good though...learning a lot   We pretty much knew it would be an adventure...at least we're getting this stuff all out of the way now so we can enjoy rest of summer.

Cheers, Joe

[dave500]

hows the qjet when gunned wide open under load?no flat spots?some of the accel pumps can have a 1/16"taken off the top of the rod,this raises the pump a little giving more stroke,the secondary air flap has a spring tension you can adjust,its a tiny grub screw under the dashpot rod,if they open too fast theyll bog down,it doesnt hurt to use richer rods and higher rod hanger as you never cruise with the secodaries open,good job,dash board work is always a pain in the arse.

check all those top cover screws for tightness once its been through a few heat n cool cycles,dont winch down hard on those two long bolts at the front youll warp the top cover.

[CBJoe]

hows the qjet when gunned wide open under load?no flat spots?some of the accel pumps can have a 1/16"taken off the top of the rod,this raises the pump a little giving more stroke,the secondary air flap has a spring tension you can adjust,its a tiny grub screw under the dashpot rod,if they open too fast theyll bog down,it doesnt hurt to use richer rods and higher rod hanger as you never cruise with the secodaries open,good job,dash board work is always a pain in the arse.

Dont know yet Dave    Got it running today and did a lot of checking, but I need to get the vac distro block in order to get the Transmission line connected along with the Booster and the AC.  Things were a bit wonky with the old Buick Carb on there so didn't realize what I was missing.  Amazingly all those years of motorcycle wrenching and carb building is transferring to old cars ok 

Here's an idle vid....

Gonna go do shop time with Ron (McRider) tomorrow but may have some time to work on bits in the afternoon.  Hoping to get most of the dash wiring and gauges assessed and tested so I know what needs reworked/replaced.

BTW...did I ever admit that this was the first V8 Id ever driven?  My wife was cracking up because we started talking about it and I realized I've only ever had 1,2,3,4 and 6 cylinder vehicles 

Joe

[Stev-o]

New carb looks and sounds good, Joe.   Vintage American cars are relatively easy to work on just like Vintage Japanese motorcycles!

A little disappointed you didnt address the cosmetics of the intake manifold while you had the carb off.
IS the paint peeling off it?

[CBJoe]

New carb looks and sounds good, Joe.   Vintage American cars are relatively easy to work on just like Vintage Japanese motorcycles!

A little disappointed you didnt address the cosmetics of the intake manifold while you had the carb off.
IS the paint peeling off it?

Hey Steve...you have to give me a little bit of a break on the paint....I have manifold gaskets on order, but they aren't here yet.  Also, Its so easy to take this carb off....once I know that a lot of the other bits are working and running well I'll pull it and paint it. 

Between the Carb, the door weatherstripping/panels, and the dash electrics fix I'm a little ADD at the moment and trying to not get carried away and piss the missus off.  Its her car and she's afraid i'm gonna go all mechanic on it and tear it too far apart.

Yes...the manifold paint looks awful.  I promise you it will be painted before winter....If I dont you can come to the next SOHC4 Reunion and slap me 

[Stev-o]

New carb looks and sounds good, Joe.   Vintage American cars are relatively easy to work on just like Vintage Japanese motorcycles!

A little disappointed you didnt address the cosmetics of the intake manifold while you had the carb off.
IS the paint peeling off it?

Hey Steve...you have to give me a little bit of a break on the paint....I have manifold gaskets on order, but they aren't here yet.

Ha....ok, break given!

[Don R]

 Very nice.

[bill440cars]

 

      I might be a Mopar guy at heart, BUT, Got all kinds of respect, for the other brands. Far as the Firebirds, they made some   
  pretty cool ones. Nothing against the earlier generatios or later ones, but I would like to have had an an ealry Blue ones, with
  the 455 SD  V8, 4spd & T Tops or a 1978 model. Poniac made some really nice ones & though I wasn't as much for the 1st
  Generation, I'd like to have been able to check out one, with the OHC 6 (knew a guy years ago, who dropped the OHC 6 & 4spd
  into an Austin Healy 1000 (I THINK it was a 1000, I know it wasn't the little Sprite) best I can remember, it was back in the late
  1960's, that I met this guy & was blown away, by his build. It WAS pretty impressive. Cool, to see this post.     

[Bailgang]

 

      I might be a Mopar guy at heart, BUT, Got all kinds of respect, for the other brands. Far as the Firebirds, they made some   
  pretty cool ones. Nothing against the earlier generatios or later ones, but I would like to have had an an ealry Blue ones, with
  the 455 SD  V8, 4spd & T Tops or a 1978 model.   

You have to be careful when looking at 455 SD's because Pontiac made a bunch of so called 455 SD T/A's that would say "455 SD" on its shaker hood scoop but actually had a regular 455 with standard D port heads. Genuine 455 SD's were and still are rare but if you know what to look for you can tell just by looking at the cyl heads if it's the real deal or not.

[bill440cars]

 

      I might be a Mopar guy at heart, BUT, Got all kinds of respect, for the other brands. Far as the Firebirds, they made some   
  pretty cool ones. Nothing against the earlier generatios or later ones, but I would like to have had an an ealry Blue ones, with
  the 455 SD  V8, 4spd & T Tops or a 1978 model.   

You have to be careful when looking at 455 SD's because Pontiac made a bunch of so called 455 SD T/A's that would say "455 SD" on its shaker hood scoop but actually had a regular 455 with standard D port heads. Genuine 455 SD's were and still are rare but if you know what to look for you can tell just by looking at the cyl heads if it's the real deal or not.

      Well, I won't be looking to buy one,  money's kinda snug, for now,  But, your input is a good heads-up, for anyone who might be looking & didn't realize. Appreciate the input.   

[Bankerdanny]

 one of my childhood friend bought a 1966 Firebird from his older sister's boyfriend. It had a 400ci V8 with headers and glass packs, a 4 speed with a Hurst shifter, Cragar SS wheels and giant wide tires on the back. You could hear it from literally a mile away.

[Stev-o]

one of my childhood friend bought a 1966 Firebird....

'67?    There was no 1966 'bird.

I had a '68 Firebird in high school, had a 350.  Bought it from a buddy, his Dad was the Gen Manager at a Pontiac dealer, he took it in on a trade.

[Bankerdanny]

one of my childhood friend bought a 1966 Firebird....

'67?    There was no 1966 'bird.

I had a '68 Firebird in high school, had a 350.  Bought it from a buddy, his Dad was the Gen Manager at a Pontiac dealer, he took it in on a trade.

Yes, '67. Round rear wheel wells.

[CBJoe]

New carb looks and sounds good, Joe.   Vintage American cars are relatively easy to work on just like Vintage Japanese motorcycles!

A little disappointed you didnt address the cosmetics of the intake manifold while you had the carb off.
IS the paint peeling off it?

Cursed me Steve....been doing a lot of work on the Firebird lately and yesterday I went to change pcv valve and it’s rubber grommet.

The damn pcv valve had been painted over previously and the grommet was hard as a rock.  It literally broke in half when I tried to remove and fell down into the valley

Just finished pulling intake and valley pan. I’ll blast and paint them and the valve covers and do some general cleanup.

Need to order some gaskets and paint.

To my eyes, the cam and lifters and pushrods look in good shape.









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[CBJoe]

So I'm scratching my head on the drum brakes.  New Master Cylinder, Booster, proportioning valve and brake lines.  Rear drums were rebuilt with new Shoes, Drums and Wheel Cylinders.

ON the first drive around the brakes overheated because the pedal return spring was missing and was dragging.  I have since fixed that and we've put about 60 miles on the car...no issues...mostly.

After the long drive, when we got home I walked around and found that all of the wheel hubs/lugs were a nice normal temperature except for the rear passenger....It was pretty damn hot. MUCH hotter than the other 3.

I also have noticed that under slightly heavy braking that wheel wants to lock up and squeal the tire before all the others.

Question....I dont think I turned out the self adjusters to where the shoes are lightly dragging.  I will do this tonight.  Is there any chance not having them adjusted would cause the shoes to not return properly and therefore catch or drag sometimes?

Joe

[Don R]

 Make sure the long and short shoes are in the proper places. I learned it on a 72 GTO. We had the short shoes on one side and long shoes on the other. I had to look it up in a manual to see which should be in front.
  That adjuster might be tight but I would think you would notice when the drum went back on.

  Also check for a leaky wheel cyl, if anyone touched the brake pedal before the drum was on it could pop the seal apart.