Author Topic: Young Mechanics (working on your vehicle)  (Read 2303 times)

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Offline Kevin D

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Re: Young Mechanics (working on your vehicle)
« Reply #25 on: December 20, 2023, 06:04:52 AM »
"Modern" engines have so much that can and will fail.
Fuel injection should not work if crank sensor give no signal. Engine will not even turn when trying to start it.
Same with cam pos sensor.

On top of this plenty of other sensors and crappy plastic valves that will brake and make engine to run like sh!t.
Air mass flow sensor common failer.

Ign coils have short life too, individually sitting on each plug in cavities getting hot in valve cover. Last setup branded Hitachi thanks to my CB750 experiences.
There are multiple brands making them.

Lambda sensors before and after the cat will become dirty and send wrong signals. Cheap version usually not correct.
Bosch is preferred.

Risk that a wrong AFR can ruin the catalytic converter too.

I have fixed my Audi 1.8T engine this year where mentioned sensors (+both lambda), coils(again), breather valve (1 of several, finally cracked wide open causing horrible idle).

Rear engine coolant temp sensor on the list when it give intermittent off in the logs.
Ordered and will be replaced a warmer day outside my garage.

I was worried that the catalytic converter with downpipe had failed due to wrong fuel mix. Sport cat with thicker downpipe from Milltek not cheap to get today. Car has a complete Milltek system from UK.
Car passed the annual test so OK.

Software VCDS and correct cable between OBD2 connector in car to PC collect all alarms.
Search some on Internet to verify the root cause.
Youtube videos show how to replace.

There are several forums with step by step descriptions how to fix common errors.

A carburetor car without ECU have not much that can fail.

The VCDS with cable have saved me lots of money.
I bought it initially to measure turbo charge while driving to verify the ECU software upgrade and crappy collapsing stock turbo inlet pipe, replaced by an alu pipe from USA.

Get all engine alarms within a minute. Car shops take lots of money for that!!


Wow!       
71 CB750 K1
104,000 miles
Original Owner
———past———
70 SL100/125/150
70 Candy BlueGreen CB 750 K0
————————————————-
Former Honda parts kid/counter kid/do all
—————————————————————-
Whether you think you can or think you can’t, you’re right
Genius is 99% perspiration, 1% inspiration

Offline PeWe

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Re: Young Mechanics (working on your vehicle)
« Reply #26 on: December 20, 2023, 10:17:43 AM »
"Modern" engines have so much that can and will fail.
Fuel injection should not work if crank sensor give no signal. Engine will not even turn when trying to start it.
Same with cam pos sensor.

On top of this plenty of other sensors and crappy plastic valves that will brake and make engine to run like sh!t.
Air mass flow sensor common failer.

Ign coils have short life too, individually sitting on each plug in cavities getting hot in valve cover. Last setup branded Hitachi thanks to my CB750 experiences.
There are multiple brands making them.

Lambda sensors before and after the cat will become dirty and send wrong signals. Cheap version usually not correct.
Bosch is preferred.

Risk that a wrong AFR can ruin the catalytic converter too.

I have fixed my Audi 1.8T engine this year where mentioned sensors (+both lambda), coils(again), breather valve (1 of several, finally cracked wide open causing horrible idle).

Rear engine coolant temp sensor on the list when it give intermittent off in the logs.
Ordered and will be replaced a warmer day outside my garage.

I was worried that the catalytic converter with downpipe had failed due to wrong fuel mix. Sport cat with thicker downpipe from Milltek not cheap to get today. Car has a complete Milltek system from UK.
Car passed the annual test so OK.

Software VCDS and correct cable between OBD2 connector in car to PC collect all alarms.
Search some on Internet to verify the root cause.
Youtube videos show how to replace.

There are several forums with step by step descriptions how to fix common errors.

A carburetor car without ECU have not much that can fail.

The VCDS with cable have saved me lots of money.
I bought it initially to measure turbo charge while driving to verify the ECU software upgrade and crappy collapsing stock turbo inlet pipe, replaced by an alu pipe from USA.

Get all engine alarms within a minute. Car shops take lots of money for that!!


Wow!     
Edit: Engine will turn when cam pos sensor fail, but not ignite. My engine started at 2nd longer attempt. Car was home so no problem.
Same with crank sensor, needed a few attempt to start.
Those do not cost much, but can cause issues when far away from home.
CB750 K6-76  970cc (Earlier 1005cc JMR Billet block on the shelf waiting for a comeback)
CB750 K2-75 Parts assembled to a stock K2

Updates of the CB750 K6 -1976
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,180468.msg2092136.html#msg2092136
The billet block build thread
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,49438.msg1863571.html#msg1863571
CB750 K2 -1975  build thread
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,168243.msg1948381.html#msg1948381
K2 engine build thread. For a complete CB750 -75
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,180088.msg2088008.html#msg2088008
Carb jetting, a long story Mikuni TMR32
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,179479.msg2104967.html#msg2104967

Offline jgger

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Re: Young Mechanics (working on your vehicle)
« Reply #27 on: December 20, 2023, 12:12:46 PM »
Modern computerized/fuel injected cars do not like it when you press the gas pedal while attempting to start them. The start process is a program built into the computer. Also most don't require you to hold the key in the start position. Holding the gas pedal to the floor shuts off the injectors to keep from flooding the engine. This is weird for us old guys that came from carb and points motors.
"The SOHC4 uses a computer located about 2-3 ft above the seat.  Those sometimes need additional programming." -stolen from  Two Tired

The difference between an ass kisser and brown noser is merely depth perception.  Stolen from RAFster122s

Offline BenelliSEI

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Re: Young Mechanics (working on your vehicle)
« Reply #28 on: December 20, 2023, 05:29:25 PM »
Modern computerized/fuel injected cars do not like it when you press the gas pedal while attempting to start them. The start process is a program built into the computer. Also most don't require you to hold the key in the start position. Holding the gas pedal to the floor shuts off the injectors to keep from flooding the engine. This is weird for us old guys that came from carb and points motors.

Weird is right! The instructions for starting my fuel injected Honda Varadero are simple; DON’T touch anything but the starter button!

Offline jgger

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Re: Young Mechanics (working on your vehicle)
« Reply #29 on: December 20, 2023, 06:03:31 PM »
My F 150 has a time or revolutions count. It will crank on its own after you let go of the key, and it hasn't fired yet. I burned a fuse for the fuel pump, so it got no gas to start. It freaked me out when it just kept cranking. Made me feel really stupid by pulling the starter on the side of the road when all it needed was a fuse!

It is throttle by wire too.
« Last Edit: December 20, 2023, 06:05:04 PM by jgger »
"The SOHC4 uses a computer located about 2-3 ft above the seat.  Those sometimes need additional programming." -stolen from  Two Tired

The difference between an ass kisser and brown noser is merely depth perception.  Stolen from RAFster122s

Offline HondaMan

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Re: Young Mechanics (working on your vehicle)
« Reply #30 on: December 20, 2023, 06:25:39 PM »
This is weird for us old guys that came from carb and points motors.
AMEN!
 >:(

I do have to say that my wife likes the new ones better, though.
I still have trouble remembering, as my motorhome is still old-school....then I get into the JEEP, which is halfway between: gotta hold the pedal open a bit, turn the key, then wiggle the tranny's shifter a little because the Neutral Safety Start switch is worn...always makes me smile. ;)
See SOHC4shop@gmail.com for info about the gadgets I make for these bikes.

The demons are repulsed when a man does good. Use that.
Blood is thicker than water, but motor oil is thicker yet...so, don't mess with my SOHC4, or I might have to hurt you.
Hondaman's creed: "Bikers are family. Treat them accordingly."

Link to Hondaman Ignition: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=67543.0

Link to My CB750 Book: https://www.lulu.com/search?adult_audience_rating=00&page=1&pageSize=10&q=my+cb750+book

Link to website: www.SOHC4shop.com

Offline dave500

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Re: Young Mechanics (working on your vehicle)
« Reply #31 on: December 22, 2023, 02:09:17 AM »
gimme a qjet or stromberg any day!i like cars where if you drop a spanner it ends up under the car on the ground,i like to be able to see the ground from above looking down past the engine!i care less for fickle engine light on so computer says no go,then it turns out to be like a sensor is caput but the actual engine is fine?old days tin foil wrapped around a fuse got you home,you need a laptop now if the glove box wont open?

Offline Stev-o

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Offline jgger

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Re: Young Mechanics (working on your vehicle)
« Reply #33 on: December 22, 2023, 08:05:58 AM »
FYI I bought the one from Harbor Frieght which was not Innova brand, and all the paper work inside the box said Innova. So for the same money as Innova I was able to get a better unit. I was also looking at the Innova readers before the Harbor Frieght purchase. 

To answer your question, Innova is a solid company with good reviews/products.
"The SOHC4 uses a computer located about 2-3 ft above the seat.  Those sometimes need additional programming." -stolen from  Two Tired

The difference between an ass kisser and brown noser is merely depth perception.  Stolen from RAFster122s

Offline Stev-o

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Re: Young Mechanics (working on your vehicle)
« Reply #34 on: December 22, 2023, 08:24:40 AM »
FYI I bought the one from Harbor Frieght which was not Innova brand, and all the paper work inside the box said Innova. So for the same money as Innova I was able to get a better unit. I was also looking at the Innova readers before the Harbor Frieght purchase. 

To answer your question, Innova is a solid company with good reviews/products.

Thx, good info.  There are at least 10 Innova units, won't buy the cheapest model.  I'm a firm believer in buying quality tools.

https://www.bestreviews.guide/innova-obd2-scanners?origin=google&google_params[matchtype]=&google_params[network]=g&google_params[device]=c&google_params[creative]=679662670956&google_params[keyword]=&google_params[adposition]=&google_params[adgroupid]=161770232348&google_params[campaignid]=20525732582&bs=&google_params[feeditemid]=99228397166&google_params[targetid]=dsa-2197066061652&google_params[loc_interest_ms]=&google_params[loc_physical_ms]=9028253&google_params[devicemodel]=&google_params[target]=&dest=0&sys_id=0|254&gclsrc=aw.ds&gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAiAhJWsBhAaEiwAmrNyq--8ADsVx5Em8ZpXabCIbioMZ1WPdu2HXysouaq43r2KRy7OZWfu7xoCKtQQAvD_BwE
'74 "Big Bang" Honda 750K [836].....'76 Honda 550F.....K3 Park Racer!......and a Bomber!............plus plus plus.........

Offline CycleRanger

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Re: Young Mechanics (working on your vehicle)
« Reply #35 on: December 22, 2023, 08:29:37 AM »
I have a USB-to-ODBII adapter and the Toyota Techstream software I use with an old Windows XP laptop.
 
It will read everything on my '02 Tundra and other Toyota vehicles.
It can do real-time monitoring and graphing of discreet sensors.

It will also work as a generic ODBII coder reader for any vehicle.
The USB adapter and software was about ~$35 from an ebay seller.

I've only needed it once on my Tundra to diagnose a failed O2 sensor.
I've used it many times on other peoples cars of various makes.
« Last Edit: December 22, 2023, 08:36:28 AM by CycleRanger »
Do you have a copy of the Honda Shop Manual or Parts List for your bike? Get one here:
https://www.honda4fun.com/materiale/documentazione-tecnica
CB750K5        '79 XL250s     CL350K3
CB750K3        '76 XS650      '76 CJ360T

Offline simon#42

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Re: Young Mechanics (working on your vehicle)
« Reply #36 on: December 22, 2023, 10:07:25 AM »
as its my job i have loads of them , the best ones i have found for the price are autel .

Online jlh3rd

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Re: Young Mechanics (working on your vehicle)
« Reply #37 on: December 22, 2023, 11:15:41 AM »
FYI I bought the one from Harbor Frieght which was not Innova brand, and all the paper work inside the box said Innova. So for the same money as Innova I was able to get a better unit. I was also looking at the Innova readers before the Harbor Frieght purchase. 

To answer your question, Innova is a solid company with good reviews/products.

Thx, good info.  There are at least 10 Innova units, won't buy the cheapest model.  I'm a firm believer in buying quality tools.

https://www.bestreviews.guide/innova-obd2-scanners?origin=google&google_params[matchtype]=&google_params[network]=g&google_params[device]=c&google_params[creative]=679662670956&google_params[keyword]=&google_params[adposition]=&google_params[adgroupid]=161770232348&google_params[campaignid]=20525732582&bs=&google_params[feeditemid]=99228397166&google_params[targetid]=dsa-2197066061652&google_params[loc_interest_ms]=&google_params[loc_physical_ms]=9028253&google_params[devicemodel]=&google_params[target]=&dest=0&sys_id=0|254&gclsrc=aw.ds&gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAiAhJWsBhAaEiwAmrNyq--8ADsVx5Em8ZpXabCIbioMZ1WPdu2HXysouaq43r2KRy7OZWfu7xoCKtQQAvD_BwE

 Was gonna get a zurich from harbor freight a few years ago but they were out. I have a foxwell. It's. fine.
Autel has a good reputation.
And look up bidirectional capability. You might want that.
« Last Edit: December 22, 2023, 05:31:41 PM by jlh3rd »

Offline PeWe

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Re: Young Mechanics (working on your vehicle)
« Reply #38 on: December 22, 2023, 11:27:03 AM »
gimme a qjet or stromberg any day!.....
My old Volvo 142 1969 B20 engine had one Stromberg. Horrible in winter getting ice plugs despite extra ethanol added in fuel that was the common additive wintertime. Starter spray a must have to start it, rev it since it had no idle due to the ice. If stopped, starter spray the only way.

Tricky when stopped in a traffic queue, open hood, spray lots of starter spray inside airfilter box, start it and keep it going.
Smell of ether mmmm ;D

The rubber diafragm cracked and reduced speed a lot. Good to be not far from home when that happened.
Gas stations had those parts when these cars were new and not that old. Since the late 80's no car parts.

Needle and needle jet had to be replaced. Special tool for needle jet. Vehicle inspection complained about the CO otherwise.

I finally replaced carb by a Weber 36/36. No iceplugs anymore and better response.

But I understand the feeling, old tech with no electronics that can stop you except for point when not serviced in time, finally not open at all.
Easy fix with a screwdriver. ;)

That car could hit things with real rubber covered bumpers and good ground clearance.
Reversed until stop, hitting thick wooden fence normal while parking ;D

My car today is 20 years old on the road tomorrow, but much newer tech than the old Volvo. Climate control is standard in most cars since mid 90's which help against condense in winter.

I can feel when summer arrive, cool air in ventilation. Other seasons warm air when colder than the temp setting of 20*C I very seldom change.

No rust yet as the old cars got after 10 years or earlier.

Bumpers covered by painted plastic covers as part of the car. Expensive to hit things or when getting hit by others.

Low "sport chassie" not always good.  I had problems with my back some years ago. Real pain to enter the car and leave it.
I promised myself next car will be a step (up) into the car.

I have not bought one since the later Audi's  and BMW's have expensive sucking quality with bad engines.
Stretching, jumping cam chains too common and other things.
My choice had been 4WD and 250-300hp.

Todays climate fraud that want to forbid petrol and diesel vehicles  keep me to use my old car.

Next car might be a survival vehicle, diesel that can run on any kind of oil and grease for long distances. Old tech might be the future thing.... ;D
Keep tool box in car with extra fuel...
« Last Edit: December 22, 2023, 12:40:57 PM by PeWe »
CB750 K6-76  970cc (Earlier 1005cc JMR Billet block on the shelf waiting for a comeback)
CB750 K2-75 Parts assembled to a stock K2

Updates of the CB750 K6 -1976
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,180468.msg2092136.html#msg2092136
The billet block build thread
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,49438.msg1863571.html#msg1863571
CB750 K2 -1975  build thread
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,168243.msg1948381.html#msg1948381
K2 engine build thread. For a complete CB750 -75
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,180088.msg2088008.html#msg2088008
Carb jetting, a long story Mikuni TMR32
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,179479.msg2104967.html#msg2104967

Offline Kelly E

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Re: Young Mechanics (working on your vehicle)
« Reply #39 on: December 22, 2023, 11:51:31 AM »
My wife drove a Volvo 164 for years. I have my 72' MGB/GT with no electronics at all, still running points. That car is dirt simple, dual SU carbs, 4 fuses and no power assist on anything. I can buy anything I need for it, even repair panels stamped on the original tooling. It will survive an EMP if it is shut off. 8)
I also have an old school mechanical injected V8 diesel truck for when it gets ugly. ;D
Never Give Up - Never Surrender

The Rust Bros. Garage Collection
1974 Honda CB 550 K0                                            1971 MGB/GT
1975 Honda CB 400F Super Sport                          1972 MGB/GT
1977 Kawasaki KZ 1000 LTD                                   1985 GMC S15
1978 Kawasaki KL 250
1980 Suzuki GS 1100E
1982 Honda CB 900F Super Sport
1983 Honda CB 1100F
1984 Honda VF 700S Sabre
1984 Honda VF 1000F Interceptor
1990 Moto Guzzi 1000 Le Mans
1994 Kawasaki Concours ZG 1000A9
2005 Harley Davidson Fat Boy

Offline PeWe

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Re: Young Mechanics (working on your vehicle)
« Reply #40 on: December 22, 2023, 12:22:24 PM »
Volvo 164,  straight 6cyl called B30. Like a 4cyl B20 + 2 cyl.
160hp something was much over here early 70's.
« Last Edit: December 22, 2023, 12:37:35 PM by PeWe »
CB750 K6-76  970cc (Earlier 1005cc JMR Billet block on the shelf waiting for a comeback)
CB750 K2-75 Parts assembled to a stock K2

Updates of the CB750 K6 -1976
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,180468.msg2092136.html#msg2092136
The billet block build thread
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,49438.msg1863571.html#msg1863571
CB750 K2 -1975  build thread
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,168243.msg1948381.html#msg1948381
K2 engine build thread. For a complete CB750 -75
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,180088.msg2088008.html#msg2088008
Carb jetting, a long story Mikuni TMR32
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,179479.msg2104967.html#msg2104967

Offline jgger

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Re: Young Mechanics (working on your vehicle)
« Reply #41 on: December 22, 2023, 12:33:03 PM »
Here is the one I got from Harbor Frieght.
"The SOHC4 uses a computer located about 2-3 ft above the seat.  Those sometimes need additional programming." -stolen from  Two Tired

The difference between an ass kisser and brown noser is merely depth perception.  Stolen from RAFster122s

Offline Stev-o

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'74 "Big Bang" Honda 750K [836].....'76 Honda 550F.....K3 Park Racer!......and a Bomber!............plus plus plus.........

Offline Stev-o

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Re: Young Mechanics (working on your vehicle)
« Reply #43 on: December 22, 2023, 01:03:37 PM »
I have a USB-to-ODBII adapter and the Toyota Techstream software I use with an old Windows XP laptop.
 

Hey Ranger...you are like the young dudes that need a laptop to work on it!!!
'74 "Big Bang" Honda 750K [836].....'76 Honda 550F.....K3 Park Racer!......and a Bomber!............plus plus plus.........

Offline CycleRanger

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Re: Young Mechanics (working on your vehicle)
« Reply #44 on: December 22, 2023, 05:31:32 PM »
I have a USB-to-ODBII adapter and the Toyota Techstream software I use with an old Windows XP laptop.
 

Hey Ranger...you are like the young dudes that need a laptop to work on it!!!

A hand held would be more convenient but I like having the Toyota software with all the bells and whistles.
Do you have a copy of the Honda Shop Manual or Parts List for your bike? Get one here:
https://www.honda4fun.com/materiale/documentazione-tecnica
CB750K5        '79 XL250s     CL350K3
CB750K3        '76 XS650      '76 CJ360T

Offline HondaMan

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Re: Young Mechanics (working on your vehicle)
« Reply #45 on: December 22, 2023, 07:28:30 PM »
I have my 72' MGB/GT with no electronics at all, still running points.

I make Transistor Ignitions for those points, which stops their wear and makes them last forever. They work great in old Ford and Chevy engines, too!
I started out making them for 'show cars' where the cars had to have the points & condensor in the distributor to win top "all original" awards in the shows, but those parts are really hard to find now. So, I added a switch on them where it can run normally with the points (this also helps with the old dwell meters) for setting timing or running in shows, then they throw the switch to 'Electronic' to stop the wear. The cars get better gas mileage with the box, too. The switch also has an "OFF" position that kills the ignition completely by disconnecting the points, a nice way to prevent quick-thieves from 'hotwiring' an old ignition.
See SOHC4shop@gmail.com for info about the gadgets I make for these bikes.

The demons are repulsed when a man does good. Use that.
Blood is thicker than water, but motor oil is thicker yet...so, don't mess with my SOHC4, or I might have to hurt you.
Hondaman's creed: "Bikers are family. Treat them accordingly."

Link to Hondaman Ignition: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=67543.0

Link to My CB750 Book: https://www.lulu.com/search?adult_audience_rating=00&page=1&pageSize=10&q=my+cb750+book

Link to website: www.SOHC4shop.com

Offline simon#42

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Re: Young Mechanics (working on your vehicle)
« Reply #46 on: December 23, 2023, 03:48:59 AM »
as its my job i have loads of them , the best ones i have found for the price are autel .

Like this?

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07M66RH77?SubscriptionId=AKIAIBX4MGJBG42TO3NQ&tag=productsbestrv210637-20&asc_source=google&asc_campaign=99800&asc_refurl=https%3A%2F%2Fbestreviews.com%2Fbest-autel-scanners&cid=99

the ones i have are a bit more advanced but that one would be good . a simple code reader is very limited you really need one that allows you to look at live data , fuel trims , air flow etc . some codes are not what they seem!