Topic: CB500/550 Rear Retainer Ring Removal - GOT IT!!

[Little_Phil]

Glad you got it done and careful screwing back into those threads when you re-assemble.
Check the sprocket carrier for wear on the inside surface where it moves against the hub. There are four channels for extra grease to be laid down and wear here will be obvious.
If you were using a drift into one of the holes then that is hard. The tool, when located in all four holes and held on place so it doesn't slip out gives four time the turning moment and I have found it MUCH easier with that

[Dr. Frankenstein]

I'm sure the tool does help getting the retainer out, but after all my efforts to get it to move the holes were pretty chewed up and the tool kept slipping out. I'm sure that the tool is probably quite effective with a retainer that has not been tampered with and still has its pristine holes in it, but of course I had to resort to more brutal methods so that was not my experience.

"You fit the bearing on the screwed retainer side first, dont forget the short spacer, screw in the retainer temporarily then fit the eared centre sleeve, frequently you will need to reshap the "ears" to centre the sleeve then fit the other side bearing tapping only on the outer race."

Bryan, you mentioned you have to re-center the sleeve on the spacer and reshape the 'ears' of the spacer...where do those go? Do they go around the bearing's inner race, or...?  How is the spacer 'centered'?  I want to make a video of this whole procedure because none exists on the Internet for the 500 or 550, but I want to make sure I get it right, and there is no help in the manuals that I have. 

[Dr. Frankenstein]

For all us visual learners out there, here's another shot of the inner spacer with what I think is the right way they go - since those little tabs are used to center the spacer, I assume that's what they're doing here, with the big side (left in the pic) going around that spacer extension, and the little side with the tabs going into that little edge on the inner side of the bearing (the pic is a little out of focus, but you can see where those little teeth grab it).

And yes, I had to re-shape the tabs to get them to fit in that little channel, but they're there. Putting in the big bearing first should present no problem, but making sure those little teeth go back into their groove might be a pita...

[CycleRanger]

This is what an unmolested spacer looks like.
The tabs are there only to center the spacer.
The tabs are not supposed to be bent or curved.
You need to straighten the tabs on your spacer to make it resemble the example in the image.

[bryanj]

As the last pic shows, no bends or curves and they roughly centre the spacer on the hub not bearings

[Dr. Frankenstein]

Okay, so those teeth rest on the bearing seal? Or do they rest on the bearing race?

[bryanj]

Neither, they should locate on inside of hub

[Dr. Frankenstein]

Right; the bearings go back IN the hub, the spacers go between the bearings in the hub and the axle goes through the bearings and spacers...so inside the hub, with the spacer installed between the bearings, do the teeth of the spacer contact the bearings when it/they are in place?

[bryanj]

No, if they did they would damage the rubbers seal of the 2rs bearings you need to use

[Dr. Frankenstein]

Okay, so help me visualize this - as per CR's assertion the tabs are straight, as seen in his attached pic -the spacer goes between the bearings, inside the hub. According to CR, the tabs are only there to 'center the bearing.' Those tabs are supposed to be straight, as in the pic that CR attached. So - and here's where it gets fuzzy - my pic is a mock-up of how the spacers look inside the hub, large to the left, and the smaller one to the right (obviously). In this pic I have straightened the tabs out to where they should be.

My question is, How do those tabs work?? If they are used to center the bearing, there's an awful lot of slop in there that doesn't seem to center it much; and if the tabs are supposed to be straight - like in CR's pic - they would seem to land on the surface of the bearing. I noticed when I was taking the hub apart, looking down into the hub, there was a very small portion of the outer bearing race that was visible around the circumference of the bearing hole; I thought perhaps those tabs sat on that very fine exposed edge of the inner bearing race, which is 1, maybe 2 mm wide, but probably not - I don't know. Are they there to just keep the spacer 'kind of' centered to keep the spacer from falling into the hub when the wheel is returned to an upright position so you can get the axle through? How do these tabs help 'center' the spacer without interfering with the bearing itself?? Does anybody know?

[MauiK3]

The tabs keep the spacer floating roughly in the middle

[CycleRanger]

Are they there to just keep the spacer 'kind of' centered to keep the spacer from falling into the hub when the wheel is returned to an upright position so you can get the axle through?

Yes, the tabs exist just to hold the spacer approximately in position and ease axle installation.

[Dr. Frankenstein]

Thank you! Okay, so they do NOT touch the surface of the bearing...I was wondering what kept them from falling off when the wheel is turned vertically before the axle goes through - any other tips for the installation? My new bearings have been in the freezer for two weeks now.

[denward17]

Using your mocked up picture, I highlighted the spacer shaft tabs in blue. there should be three on each end.

One end is a smaller diameter than the other.  Forget about the bearings.

If you look inside the hub, these three tabs touch the inside of the hub, and rest there, on each end.  They should be a little snug as not to wobble back and forth against the hub.  If they bounce around inside the hub, you may get a tap tap tap noise when the wheel is turning once installed.

Hope this makes sense.

[Dr. Frankenstein]

Yes! That's the info I was looking for...! "these three tabs touch the inside of the hub, and rest there, on each end. They should be a little snug as not to wobble back and forth against the hub.  If they bounce around inside the hub, you may get a tap tap tap noise when the wheel is turning once installed."

Okay, so the tabs go inside the HUB LIP flush with the bearing seat and that's what keeps them place, right? And that makes sense because that way they can align the spacer and keep it in place while not interfering with the bearing and bearing seat, right?  I was going nuts trying to figure out HOW the spacer kept the alignment w/o falling out! Denward, you Rock!

Bear in mind (no pun intended) this is the first time I've done a bearing change-out with the spacers et al, and I like to know how and why things go together; sometimes the manual is vague on that stuff. "The More You Know..." 

Armed with this info, I will attempt to put it back together and report back. Don't wait up... 

[bryanj]

The tabs get bent as most times you have to knock the spacer sideways in order to drift the old bearing out, usually by drifting on the centre race which is why i never reuse bearings.
When waiting for my answers remember i am the other side of the atlantic many time zones away

[Dr. Frankenstein]

I understand; The UK is what - six hours ahead of us? (And I do have my 2 new RS bearings, btw... )

[Dr. Frankenstein]

A little bit of an update: Those parts in the above pics were from my 'practice' wheel - now that I know what I'm doing, I went back out and took out the bearings and spacer from the wheel I'm using on the bike - took me all of 15 minutes! Life is Good!

SO - old bearings are OUT, getting ready to put the new bearings IN - I'm going to reheat the hub, get that good and hot/ expanded, and drop in the new bearings that have been in the freezer since this whole debacle began. Do I place the spacer in first/get it snugged up in the hub itself and then put the bigger bearing in first, or put the bearing in and then line it up...? What's the best way to go about this?

I guess it shouldn't matter, because after the bearing is seated, the spacer stubs should just go into place *behind it, on the inside lip of the hub, yes? (Technically coming to rest on the flat edge of the bearing race that protrudes around the bearing seat by that 1 or 2 mm I mentioned earlier).

Then flip the wheel over, position the smaller end spacer stubs on the inside of the smaller hub ring/edge to keep it in place, but not sitting proud of the bearing seat, and then drive down the other bearing into its seat. I figure with the spacer stubs snugly in place on the inner lip of the hub, that allows the bearing to seat without interfering with the position of the spacer stubs.

EXCEPT!! I forgot about the little secondary spacer that goes into the large bearing - - how does it go in?? If you put the bearing in, flip the wheel over and then fit that little secondary axle spacer/bushing into the bearing inside the hub, you can't get the long spacer with the stubs to fit in the opposite way to fit IT into the hub lip...

What I did was to put the long spacer in the hub, followed by the shorter axle bearing/spacer that fits into the larger bearing. Flipped the tire over so I could pound in the larger bearing. The longer spacer loose in the hub will prevent the shorter axle spacer (bushing??) from falling out the smaller bearing hole on the other side.

Turning the wheel back over with the new larger bearing installed, I looked into the hub with a flashlight and fished the short axle bearing into the hole in the larger bearing and then was able to center the longer spacer tabs into the inner hub rim. It was pretty easy to do.

Once I knew I had that seated and knew I could re-seat it, I pulled up on the longer spacer to adjust the little tabs on it to fit snugly on the inner rim of the smaller hub, re-seated the long spacer into its opposite/larger end and could clearly see that the tabs for the smaller bearing seat were right where I wanted them, riding the inner edge of the smaller bearing seat rim and not obstructing the smaller bearing's seat. I then heated up the smaller hub, got my bearing out of the freezer and drove it home.

Or is there an easier way??