Author Topic: If you don't know it for a fact, don't presume it to be true  (Read 4073 times)

0 Members and 3 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline Hope

  • How did I become an
  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,042
  • SOHC member since '01
If you don't know it for a fact, don't presume it to be true
« on: April 18, 2008, 01:45:19 PM »
Some people will say anything...

Quote
   very nice original 550 four

Really?

Honda didn't put that pin stripe on that side cover
Honda didn't put that pin stripe on that tank
Tank & side cover color: black.... hmm, I don't remember Honda making any 74's black
Those front blinkers are not original
Petcock does not look original


Quote
Rear blinkers, not on the bike but included.

Huh?  I thought everything would be on the bike if it were original

Close, but no cigar.  Not original.







item # 230242057891


Offline kghost

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 6,855
  • www.facebook.com/RetroMecanicaAustralia
Re: If you don't know it for a fact, don't presume it to be true
« Reply #1 on: April 18, 2008, 01:48:36 PM »
I'd sure take paint unoriginal over I'm a complete moron and messed with the wiring..


I know what you mean tho....


I see SOHC's all the time as "orgininal", "restored", etc....Then it has a crappy set of 4-2 mac's on it
Stranger in a strange land

Offline MrZxp

  • Hot Shot
  • ***
  • Posts: 368
Re: If you don't know it for a fact, don't presume it to be true
« Reply #2 on: April 18, 2008, 01:55:17 PM »
Apart from the paint job, it looks standard OEM to me.... same petcock as my 74 as well as the indicators - can see why the rear indicators aren't on it, it's missing the grab rail is all to attach them to...

Wish mine was as original as that...   :(

Quite liking that pinstriping too.



Cheers, Phil
« Last Edit: April 18, 2008, 01:59:43 PM by MrZxp »
09 Boulevard M90
SOHC4 Member #3336

Offline TwoTired

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 21,805
Re: If you don't know it for a fact, don't presume it to be true
« Reply #3 on: April 18, 2008, 02:06:17 PM »
True, the paint's not original.
The front turn sigs are, though. That petcock is original 74 style, too, with the sediment bowl.  Both these changed for the 75 models

It is missing the rear grab bar and turn signals, though.

Other than that, it looks like all the remaining bits are original.
Pity about the muffler dents.

Cheers,
Lloyd... (SOHC4 #11 Original Mail List)
72 500, 74 550, 75 550K, 75 550F, 76 550F, 77 550F X2, 78 550K, 77 750F X2, 78 750F, 79CX500, 85 700SC, GL1100

Those that learn from history are doomed to repeat it by those that don't learn from history.

Offline Hope

  • How did I become an
  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,042
  • SOHC member since '01
Re: If you don't know it for a fact, don't presume it to be true
« Reply #4 on: April 18, 2008, 02:45:31 PM »
The front turn sigs are, though. That petcock is original 74 style, too, with the sediment bowl.  Both these changed for the 75 models

I stand corrected.  I thought they were the same for 74 & 75.

Offline 754

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 29,058
Re: If you don't know it for a fact, don't presume it to be true
« Reply #5 on: April 18, 2008, 08:24:05 PM »
75 & later signals.. are FUGLY... safer ..but fugly..

Got a Q.. did 550 after 75 have shift pattern in the cover...

I dont have a problen with that called original.. has the 4 hardest pieces,

Stock sheet metal (although repainted)

Pipes

Seat

Guages..
Maker of the WELDLESS 750 Frame Kit
dodogas99@gmail.com
Kelowna B.C.       Canada

My next bike will be a ..ANFOB.....

It's All part of the ADVENTURE...

73 836cc.. Green, had it for 3 decades!!
Lost quite a few CB 750's along the way

Offline Hope

  • How did I become an
  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,042
  • SOHC member since '01
Re: If you don't know it for a fact, don't presume it to be true
« Reply #6 on: April 19, 2008, 11:49:01 PM »


Got a Q.. did 550 after 75 have shift pattern in the cover...

I dont have a problen with that called original.. has the 4 hardest pieces,

Stock sheet metal (although repainted)

Pipes

Seat

Guages..

I have gears on my cover.  Its a 75.

Offline Terry in Australia

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 33,363
  • So, what do ya wanna talk about today?
Re: If you don't know it for a fact, don't presume it to be true
« Reply #7 on: April 20, 2008, 01:53:12 AM »
The front turn sigs are, though. That petcock is original 74 style, too, with the sediment bowl.  Both these changed for the 75 models

I stand corrected.  I thought they were the same for 74 & 75.

So I guess it's safe to say that "if you don't know it for a fact, don't presume to to be true", Hope?  ;D
I was feeling sorry for myself because I couldn't afford new bike boots, until I met a man with no legs.

So I said, "Hey mate, you haven't got any bike boots you don't need, do you?"

"Crazy is a very misunderstood term, it's a fine line that some of us can lean over and still keep our balance" (thanks RB550Four)

Offline Hope

  • How did I become an
  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,042
  • SOHC member since '01
Re: If you don't know it for a fact, don't presume it to be true
« Reply #8 on: April 23, 2008, 07:16:18 PM »
The front turn sigs are, though. That petcock is original 74 style, too, with the sediment bowl.  Both these changed for the 75 models



I stand corrected.  I thought they were the same for 74 & 75.

So I guess it's safe to say that "if you don't know it for a fact, don't presume to to be true", Hope?  ;D

At least I am big enough to say I was wrong.  I have contacted many ebay sellers to tell them that their bikes are not all original as they state they are, and I have NEVER seen any ebay seller correct their auction listing.  All the sellers I have ever contacted, they all continue to intentionally misrepresent their auction item....  which is why I posted this thread.

Offline kghost

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 6,855
  • www.facebook.com/RetroMecanicaAustralia
Re: If you don't know it for a fact, don't presume it to be true
« Reply #9 on: April 23, 2008, 07:47:12 PM »
Ebay is like fish stories, armchair drag racing, bucks that got away....

Who am I kidding guys are just liars  ;D
Stranger in a strange land

Offline Terry in Australia

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 33,363
  • So, what do ya wanna talk about today?
Re: If you don't know it for a fact, don't presume it to be true
« Reply #10 on: April 23, 2008, 08:00:37 PM »
Yeah, and then there are just people who are pains in the ahhhh.....

Anyway, as an occasional EBay seller, I've had self appointed "experts" contact me to tell me that my listing is wrong when in fact they're incorrect.

I do, however, take the time to tell them that they're wrong, but they're rarely "Big enough" to pm me back, I guess they're too busy looking for other EBay sellers to harrass. Cheers, Terry. ;D
I was feeling sorry for myself because I couldn't afford new bike boots, until I met a man with no legs.

So I said, "Hey mate, you haven't got any bike boots you don't need, do you?"

"Crazy is a very misunderstood term, it's a fine line that some of us can lean over and still keep our balance" (thanks RB550Four)

Offline kghost

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 6,855
  • www.facebook.com/RetroMecanicaAustralia
Re: If you don't know it for a fact, don't presume it to be true
« Reply #11 on: April 23, 2008, 08:08:00 PM »
Yeah there was a guy today that wanted to know why the wiring had been "messed with" on my auction.

Guess he's never had the headlight off an old honda  ::)

Maybe the rats nest scared him.... ;D

Hey Terry...I like being a pain in your ahhhhh.... :D ;D
Stranger in a strange land

Offline Terry in Australia

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 33,363
  • So, what do ya wanna talk about today?
Re: If you don't know it for a fact, don't presume it to be true
« Reply #12 on: April 23, 2008, 08:19:58 PM »
Yeah there was a guy today that wanted to know why the wiring had been "messed with" on my auction.

Guess he's never had the headlight off an old honda  ::)

Maybe the rats nest scared him.... ;D

Hey Terry...I like being a pain in your ahhhhh.... :D ;D

Well Tim, I'm flattered, butt it's probably better if we stick to the females..............  ;D
I was feeling sorry for myself because I couldn't afford new bike boots, until I met a man with no legs.

So I said, "Hey mate, you haven't got any bike boots you don't need, do you?"

"Crazy is a very misunderstood term, it's a fine line that some of us can lean over and still keep our balance" (thanks RB550Four)

Offline kghost

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 6,855
  • www.facebook.com/RetroMecanicaAustralia
Re: If you don't know it for a fact, don't presume it to be true
« Reply #13 on: April 23, 2008, 08:30:43 PM »
Yeah there was a guy today that wanted to know why the wiring had been "messed with" on my auction.

Guess he's never had the headlight off an old honda  ::)

Maybe the rats nest scared him.... ;D

Hey Terry...I like being a pain in your ahhhhh.... :D ;D


Insert sheep comment here: _____________

 ;D ;D ;D :D ;)

All in good fun Terry.


Well Tim, I'm flattered, butt it's probably better if we stick to the females..............  ;D
Stranger in a strange land

Offline 754

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 29,058
Re: If you don't know it for a fact, don't presume it to be true
« Reply #14 on: April 23, 2008, 09:05:29 PM »
So what would you call it Hope?


I cant call it a cafe

I cant call it a mild custom

Its not a race bike

Its not a chopper, hill climber, dirt bike, touring bike etc..

 So I would call it an original with non stock repaint.

 Its not real far from original.. now if they described it as Totally Stock original, then I would say it is inaccurate..
Maker of the WELDLESS 750 Frame Kit
dodogas99@gmail.com
Kelowna B.C.       Canada

My next bike will be a ..ANFOB.....

It's All part of the ADVENTURE...

73 836cc.. Green, had it for 3 decades!!
Lost quite a few CB 750's along the way

Offline Raul CB750K1

  • Old Timer
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,881
Re: If you don't know it for a fact, don't presume it to be true
« Reply #15 on: April 24, 2008, 03:58:30 AM »
Sometimes sellers hide information to catch the unwary, sometimes sellers are simply uninformed and don't like to stand corrected. I remember an auction of a GZ250, a modern Suzuki with two exhausts pipes from the head -one per valve- but just one cylinder. The guy listed it as a "twin". I have the very same bike and sent him a message just in case he wanted to correct the description. I promise I was very polite but he replied angrily saying I was wrong and etc etc. I just searched in the Suzuki webpage and sent him a link to the oficial specs page. He finally modified the description but didn't admit he was wrong. Not that I expected it, but it was a clear case of "I'm stupid and damn proud of it".

The other day I emailed another seller to ask him in which shape were the theads on an oil pan he was selling. He replied that when checking them he noticed a crack in the pan and that he didn't think the pan was reusable, so he was withdrawing the auction and throwing it away. He indeed removed the auction, so I guess he also got rid of the pan.

If the subject is "If you don't know it for a fact, don't presume it to be true", I'm guilty. I talk about short chainguards, non-ribbed fenders and wrinkle tanks as peculiarities of the sandcast models. But I don't know that information for a fact. I got than information from popular knowledge and by reading in books, which I presume to be correct. Well, if popular information came from the same "authoritative" sources, and the author was wrong, then we have a false statement widely accepted as an universal truth. Like "my neighbour have a friend whose cousin was stolen a kidney and he woke up in a bath full of ice". We don't have the time to check every single statement we are told so we just give them the "benefit of doubt" unless proved wrong, specially if our money or wellbeing is not depending on them.


I recently bought a book autographed by Soichiro Honda himself. From what I asked the seller I got reasons to believe the autograph is genuine, but the seller didn't even got to meet Mr. Honda. So there was no witness of Mr. Honda signing the book. Some day I will give the book to my kids and will tell them from whom the autograph is. They trust their father so they won't ask how do I know: I say so and for them that's enough. If in 50 years time a calligrapher certifies that the signature doesn't belong to Mr. Honda, there will be nobody in the world to convince my kids that they have been wrong for such a long time. They assume it as a fact, in the same way that we assume that Benjamin Franklin flew a kite, that General Custer died heroically in Little Big Horn, that King Arthur's round table was actually round, or that it was Nero and nobody else who set Rome up in flames.


Offline Terry in Australia

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 33,363
  • So, what do ya wanna talk about today?
Re: If you don't know it for a fact, don't presume it to be true
« Reply #16 on: April 24, 2008, 04:57:40 AM »
Hey Raul, have you ever thought about a career writing political speeches? That one could have come straight from the mouth of George W Bush! ;D
I was feeling sorry for myself because I couldn't afford new bike boots, until I met a man with no legs.

So I said, "Hey mate, you haven't got any bike boots you don't need, do you?"

"Crazy is a very misunderstood term, it's a fine line that some of us can lean over and still keep our balance" (thanks RB550Four)

Offline Raul CB750K1

  • Old Timer
  • ******
  • Posts: 3,881
Re: If you don't know it for a fact, don't presume it to be true
« Reply #17 on: April 24, 2008, 05:36:12 AM »
Hey Raul, have you ever thought about a career writing political speeches? That one could have come straight from the mouth of George W Bush! ;D

For some reason I think that's not suppoused to be a compliment....  ;D

Offline Hope

  • How did I become an
  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,042
  • SOHC member since '01
Re: If you don't know it for a fact, don't presume it to be true
« Reply #18 on: April 24, 2008, 08:02:47 AM »
So what would you call it Hope?


I cant call it a cafe

I cant call it a mild custom

Its not a race bike

Its not a chopper, hill climber, dirt bike, touring bike etc..

 So I would call it an original with non stock repaint.

 Its not real far from original.. now if they described it as Totally Stock original, then I would say it is inaccurate..

On the old forums, when you had to email a picture to Glen in order to get it put on the website, I the pic of my bike to Glen for my 550 to be put in the gallery.

When I first working on my 550, the only item that wasn't stock was the pipes.  EVERYTHING ELSE was original stock parts.

So, when you would submit the picture of your bike to Glen, he would put it in "STOCK CB550" or "CAFE CB550" OR "CHOPPER CB550" or "CUSTOM CB550".

When my bike was all stock with aftermarket pipes, Glen put my 550 in the CUSTOM CB550 section of the old picture gallery.

Guess this bike should be a custom CB550.

Bottom line -->  I believe sellers intentionally misstate the fact in hopes of getting more money.

Offline Hope

  • How did I become an
  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,042
  • SOHC member since '01
Re: If you don't know it for a fact, don't presume it to be true
« Reply #19 on: April 24, 2008, 08:11:33 AM »
oh, by the way, here are some more ALL STOCK ALL ORIGINAL CB550s on ebay right now....

Quote
                      I HAVE TWO 550 HONDAS FOR SALE, 1.CB550 ALL ORIGINAL A COMPLETE BIKE  WITH RC HEADER , 17,000 MILES , HAS BEEN SITTING SOME TIME MOTOR IS GOOD NEED CARBS GONE THRU AND A TUNE UP NICE BIKE ( GOOD TITLE ) 2. 1975 HONDA SS 550 NEEDS SIDECOVER AND MUFFER AND SOME TLC MOTOR IS GOOD HAS 15,000 MILES,  ( HAS NO TITLE ) PARTS BIKE, BUY THEM BOTH AT ONE PRICE, MUST BE PICKED UP AND CASH ONLY.    THANKS T.J.





Item 150238950040

Enjoy!

Offline 754

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 29,058
Re: If you don't know it for a fact, don't presume it to be true
« Reply #20 on: April 24, 2008, 08:36:03 AM »
Original can also mean unmolested..

 As in the parts are all original to this bike.. as oppposed to, When I got his bike it was in a field, missing tank, sidecovers, seat and pipes, but I brought it back to original.

Well the last one in not an original bike anymore to some folks, it is considered a pieced together bike.. like is happening a lot to 69/70 750s.. but they can be brought back to 98% original.

I hope you see what I meant. Most bikes are used, some get painted, but still have all the oroginal parts that it left the factory with..
Maker of the WELDLESS 750 Frame Kit
dodogas99@gmail.com
Kelowna B.C.       Canada

My next bike will be a ..ANFOB.....

It's All part of the ADVENTURE...

73 836cc.. Green, had it for 3 decades!!
Lost quite a few CB 750's along the way

Offline mystic_1

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 6,071
  • 1970 CB750K
Re: If you don't know it for a fact, don't presume it to be true
« Reply #21 on: April 24, 2008, 09:59:38 AM »
Bottom line -->  I believe sellers intentionally misstate the fact in hopes of getting more money.


Shocking!   :o 


Do believe there's a pretty old Latin phrase that covers this situation :)

mystic_1
"A ship in harbor is safe, but that is not what ships are built for."
- John Augustus Shedd

My build thread:  http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=68952.0

Offline Gordon

  • Global Moderator
  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *****
  • Posts: 12,114
  • 750K1, 550K2
Re: If you don't know it for a fact, don't presume it to be true
« Reply #22 on: April 24, 2008, 10:07:28 AM »

Shocking!   :o 


Do believe there's a pretty old Latin phrase that covers this situation :)

mystic_1

Yep!  "Coitus Interruptus" ;D

Oh wait, you're probably talking about "Caveat Emptor", huh?

Offline 754

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 29,058
Re: If you don't know it for a fact, don't presume it to be true
« Reply #23 on: April 24, 2008, 07:53:16 PM »
If I had to vote for the member most likely to hang around with a group of people that are chronic embellishers, I know who I would vote for...

 At some point you got to realize people fluff up descriptions, and arent always completely forthcoming...

 I didnt do it Your Honour, someone framed me.... ::) :o


 ;D  ;D
Maker of the WELDLESS 750 Frame Kit
dodogas99@gmail.com
Kelowna B.C.       Canada

My next bike will be a ..ANFOB.....

It's All part of the ADVENTURE...

73 836cc.. Green, had it for 3 decades!!
Lost quite a few CB 750's along the way

Offline malcolmgb

  • What am I not? an
  • Expert
  • ****
  • Posts: 1,402
  • The BEST 400 four by far
    • malcnet
Re: If you don't know it for a fact, don't presume it to be true
« Reply #24 on: April 25, 2008, 12:04:49 PM »
I like original...with non-standard paint job...but then I am biased  ;D

I would think someone buying a bike like that would buy it because they like the look of it, not as an investment because the seller says it is original. Isn't the first rule of buying off Ebay do your research first.
Malcolm

Artificial intelligence is no match for natural stupidity.

1977 CB400F
1973 CL175 K7
1976 XL175 - Sold
1964 CL72
1966 CA78
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?action=gallery;su=user;u=1988