Author Topic: Help! Fuse rack only getting power to main! (CB400F)  (Read 1695 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Javier

  • Guest
Help! Fuse rack only getting power to main! (CB400F)
« on: April 29, 2008, 07:24:52 PM »

Man, the frustration! I must have taken apart half the bike trying to find out why my coils are getting no power. Well, I discovered the wiring diagram is a must have, wich I downloaded for free at this link : http://www.oldmanhonda.com/MC/WiringDiagrams/MCwiring.php.
   Anyhoo, the only way my Headlight, and anything other that what's hooked up to the "main" fuse, is if you touch one or both of the head and tail fuses with a screwdriver or anything metal and touch the "main" fuse at the same time, therefor making the other fuse connections hot again. I cannot figure this out. Any help would be appreciated before I drop 'er off at some $2 an hour mechanic so he may then charge me $600.

Offline kghost

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 6,855
  • www.facebook.com/RetroMecanicaAustralia
Re: Help! Fuse rack only getting power to main! (CB400F)
« Reply #1 on: April 29, 2008, 07:41:20 PM »
I just redid my 400F harness and sorted out a bunch of problems....

I'll try and help but I don't really understand where your jumping to or from....

Ya have a better description or a picture?
Stranger in a strange land

Offline burmashave

  • Forum Immoderator
  • Old Timer
  • ******
  • Posts: 2,876
    • burmashave.net
Re: Help! Fuse rack only getting power to main! (CB400F)
« Reply #2 on: April 29, 2008, 08:04:04 PM »
I'm a bit confused by the description as well. It doesn't sound a good plan to jump power between the fuse connectors. There are some good electrical troubleshooting guides in the Electrics FAQ.
Quote from: SOHC Digger, RIP
'Ere's whatcha do, Guvna', just throw a couple dookie logs in the hearth and bob's your uncle!
'77 CB750k

Javier

  • Guest
Re: Help! Fuse rack only getting power to main! (CB400F)
« Reply #3 on: April 30, 2008, 06:51:16 AM »
I'll try and see if I can load some pics tonight for a better description. You'll have to excuse my electrical lingo as this is my first time fidgiting with a wire harness -  ???. My problem is that my fuses aren't hot for the coils, headlight, start button, gauge light, etc/ etc. The only thing that seems to have power are the neutral light, neutral switch, oil pressure light and switch, and my tail light when I hit the hand brake, not the foot. I tried trying to trace my fuse power with a test light and tried to "ohm" the lines out to where they say 0.00, telling me the line is open somewhere, but I'm not quite sure if the wire I'm touching at the fuse box, is the same wire or link that I'm making contact with under the gas tank, where the blue and the yellow wires come out of the coils and are joined to 1 black with white stripe wire that supplies the power to both the left and right coils. If I "bridge", or join the main fuse with two wired "roach clips" it gives power to the bike. Another thing I did was stick a bolt in between the main fuse at the bottom of the rack, and the one on top of it, and that gave me power. I just know that's not the proper way, or probably could burn something out, or offset something. I was pissed off for two hours like I do when I can't figure something out, so I def. appreciate the help, even if I don't end up getting it. Thanks in advance - Javi

Offline bender01

  • Master
  • *****
  • Posts: 1,859
  • "Follow the leader.He's on a Honda"
Re: Help! Fuse rack only getting power to main! (CB400F)
« Reply #4 on: April 30, 2008, 07:01:57 AM »
are your fuses bad?
75 550 K1
74 750 K4
1968 450 K1 Super Sport
74 750k 836 project
http://www.bikepics.com/members/bender01/
So, the strategy is to lie to people you are asking for help?

I think I'll be busy going for a ride.

Good luck!
Two Tired Quote !

Offline Bodi

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 5,697
Re: Help! Fuse rack only getting power to main! (CB400F)
« Reply #5 on: April 30, 2008, 07:23:18 AM »
The MAIN fuse is the only one that actually connects to the battery. The fused power from the MAIN fuse goes only to the ignition switch. The HEAD and TAIL fuses are powered from the ignition switch, only when the switch is in "ON". If you carefully follow the wiring diagram you'll see how this works, don't get too bothered by the switch terminals TL1 and TL2 and all the silliness with the "PARK" switch setting.
You can certainly jumper from MAIN to HEAD or TAIL and get the head or tail lights working (and ignition too if you jumper to the HEAD fuse) but you are just bypassing the ignition switch.
What you describe means either the ignition switch is OFF or it's broken - or there's a wiring problem between the fuse block and ignition switch.

Offline Bodi

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 5,697
Re: Help! Fuse rack only getting power to main! (CB400F)
« Reply #6 on: April 30, 2008, 07:37:13 AM »
OK, hold on. You're using the diagram from odlmanhonda... this is the clymer colorized and simplified drawing. No wonder you can't figure out your electrical problem, this drawing is TOTAL GARBAGE. In case you missed it, I don't like ithe clymer electrical drawings. Working from one is worse than working with no drawing. (I didn't say "garbage" the first try but the forum replaced my original F*cking SH*TE with cartoon swearing)
Use the Honda shop manual electrical drawing. Then suddenly the electrical system should make sense, because the wiring will be the same as what's shown on the schematic!. This concept of having your schematic show what the wiring actually does has clearly escaped clymer (and haynes for that matter).

Javier

  • Guest
Re: Help! Fuse rack only getting power to main! (CB400F)
« Reply #7 on: April 30, 2008, 08:02:02 AM »
sweet. let me try another ignition switch then. this should mean that if wiring is ok, I should be able to put a test light on the ignition switch wire (at least one of them) and get my light to go off right? And if I turn my key ignition to on, and my lights come on at the instrument lights (neutral, oil pressure), I should be getting direct power to my ignition switch when it is in the "run" position then huh. With that said, shouldn't my start button work if that was the case? And my blinkers? even when if the ignition switch was trashed, would I be able to see my blinkers on or flashing. Yeah, the wiring might be the problem the more I think about it, referring to
Quote
The MAIN fuse is the only one that actually connects to the battery. The fused power from the MAIN fuse goes only to the ignition switch. The HEAD and TAIL fuses are powered from the ignition switch, only when the switch is in "ON".
, My headlight should turn on with the key, right, 'cause it doesn't. Should the headlight turn on when you turn the key even if the ignition switch was no bueno? Thanks in advance - Javi

Offline burmashave

  • Forum Immoderator
  • Old Timer
  • ******
  • Posts: 2,876
    • burmashave.net
Re: Help! Fuse rack only getting power to main! (CB400F)
« Reply #8 on: April 30, 2008, 08:22:06 AM »
Drat again! Bodi, this is the second time since last night that I came up with an answer after someone else. ;-) On the other hand, I didn't know *how* bad the Clymer diagrams are. I couldn't figure out why I could only find one fuse on the diagram.

To extend what Bodi said, one of the fuse terminals should be hot with the power off (If I understand my own shop diagram correctly). On my 750k, it's the 15A main. The other fuses become hot with the ignition and stop/start switches.
Quote from: SOHC Digger, RIP
'Ere's whatcha do, Guvna', just throw a couple dookie logs in the hearth and bob's your uncle!
'77 CB750k

Offline Bodi

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 5,697
Re: Help! Fuse rack only getting power to main! (CB400F)
« Reply #9 on: April 30, 2008, 12:33:30 PM »
That's a lot of questions all at once.
If your 15A MAIN fuse is good you should have~12VDC  battery power (all measurements are to ground - the frame or engine metal) at the ignition switch, on the RED wire to the BAT terminal.
With the igntion switch ON you should get this battery voltage at the BLACK wire on the IG terminal. This black wire runs all over the bike, and the rest of your questions will need to be sorted out from further testing.
The lighting situation depends on where in the world your bike was originally sold (or, if the handlebar switch pods have been replaced, which market's version was used) as some places have headlight on/off switches and some have always-on headlights - the differences are considerable. However, you should have a bunch of black wires in the connection ratsnest under the tank behind the steering stem on the left side - this is where the switch pods connect to the main harness. These black wires should all have that +12V with ignition ON. The lighting switching is too messed up to try and describe, there are too many versions. Basically the power goes back and forth between the switch pods and the fuse box a few times before ending up at the actual lights.
The power for the spark coils is switched through the right pod by the kill switch, a black +12V power wire going in from the ignition switch and a black/white wire coming out to the coils.
The wires in the headlight shell are for the headlight and marker lights, the instrument illumination lamps and "idiot" light indicators, and the front brake and clutch switches.
The starter switch has a safety circuit that disables it if the bike is in gear and the clutch is engaged. Try the starter with the clutch lever pulled in: if it only works that way look for a problem with the neutral switch or safety blocking diode. If it never works, well... there are many possiblities.

Javier

  • Guest
Re: Help! Fuse rack only getting power to main! (CB400F)
« Reply #10 on: April 30, 2008, 03:04:10 PM »
Bodi thanks for sharing what may seem to be a boat ton of knowledge with my little issue here. I will certainly repay you with my knowledge of baring children, or commercial fireproofing, as that is about all I'm good for. I'm gonna try a couple of different things tonight based on the feedback I got and will hopefully be in the North Georgia/Tennessee Mountains trying to see how fast I can go and at what angle before: a) my exhaust gets completely scraped off, b) it makes me slide off the side of a mountain, or c) I park the bike 'cause my exhaust scraped too much and made me come close to sliding off of the side of a mountain and it scared the sh*t out of me. Take care - Javi

p.s. Thanks to you also Burmashave

Offline Bodi

  • Really Old Timer ...
  • *******
  • Posts: 5,697
Re: Help! Fuse rack only getting power to main! (CB400F)
« Reply #11 on: May 01, 2008, 08:27:04 AM »
Jeez, I don't have any trouble baring my kids... getting them to put clothes on is usually the problem!