Author Topic: Question on keys & numbers  (Read 2682 times)

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brockj

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Question on keys & numbers
« on: November 15, 2005, 06:10:48 AM »
On my 72 CB500 project the key that came with it T6729, but the numbers on the ignition and seat are T4546.  Now if it did not work in either it would make sense, however it will work for the ignition, but not for the seat!  I guess it is possible that the lock on the seat is frozen, but I thought I would check with you to see what you guys and gals thought.

Thanks
Joe

Offline SteveD CB500F

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Re: Question on keys & numbers
« Reply #1 on: November 15, 2005, 06:12:24 AM »
Are the seat and ignition locks original?

My '72 500 has a different key for each as the seat lock was replaced at some time.
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Offline Raul CB750K1

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Re: Question on keys & numbers
« Reply #2 on: November 15, 2005, 06:16:39 AM »
Any locksmith can fit a lock to the key you provide. Probably somebody did it with the ignition switch. I have a lock set with only one key and have been unable to find a second key, so probably I will just buy a two key set and have the locks refurbished.


Raul

brockj

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Re: Question on keys & numbers
« Reply #3 on: November 15, 2005, 06:32:47 AM »
Are the seat and ignition locks original?

My '72 500 has a different key for each as the seat lock was replaced at some time.

To my understanding they are original.  It is possible that they were replaced, but I have no way of knowing that.  The same key also unlocks the gas cap, although there is no number that I can see on that.

Offline Raul CB750K1

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Re: Question on keys & numbers
« Reply #4 on: November 15, 2005, 06:48:23 AM »
The standard Honda gas cap lock can be opened with anything flat that fits inside the hole. There is a post about it, seems that Honda had only 7 different models of keys...

Raul

brockj

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Re: Question on keys & numbers
« Reply #5 on: November 15, 2005, 06:50:31 AM »
The standard Honda gas cap lock can be opened with anything flat that fits inside the hole. There is a post about it, seems that Honda had only 7 different models of keys...

Raul

Hmmm...very interesting, if you look at the key it is obvious that it is not overly complicated.  If this is true I wonderif anyone has any linking of what keys would be interchangeable?

Offline SteveD CB500F

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Re: Question on keys & numbers
« Reply #6 on: November 15, 2005, 06:53:12 AM »
Yes.  Bryan Jones has mentioned this a few times.  I've tried it on my 550K3 and it works, but I wouldn't like to do it all the time for fear of damaging something.
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brockj

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Re: Question on keys & numbers
« Reply #7 on: November 15, 2005, 06:54:48 AM »
Yes.  Bryan Jones has mentioned this a few times.  I've tried it on my 550K3 and it works, but I wouldn't like to do it all the time for fear of damaging something.

I have a 78 550 and the key is completely different for that, in fact the 72 is only cut on one side while the 78 is on both sides...

Offline SteveD CB500F

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Re: Question on keys & numbers
« Reply #8 on: November 15, 2005, 07:20:07 AM »
Yep. Mine too.  The 500 has a "T" key and the 550 has a plastic top double sided key.

But I did open my 550 fuel tank cover with a screwdriver (very gently and in the cause of science)
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Offline Raul CB750K1

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Re: Question on keys & numbers
« Reply #9 on: November 15, 2005, 01:18:19 PM »
Maybe some of you remember I broke my gas cap latch and had to buy the Honda lockable latch. I installed it myself, and when looking from below, it's clear that anything will open it. There is no spring, no pin, no nothing. Sometimes, in the gas station, I open it with my home keys. You won't damage anything.

Raul

Offline clarkjh

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Re: Question on keys & numbers
« Reply #10 on: November 15, 2005, 03:26:03 PM »
Rauls right about the gas cap, pulled mine to paint the tank, theres nothing in the lock but a plastic slide that pops the latch.  I gos prices go up again like they where I'll have to put a padlock on the tank. ;D

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Offline bryanj

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Re: Question on keys & numbers
« Reply #11 on: November 19, 2005, 03:07:19 AM »
Raul, and others My local Honda dealer has large bags of new keys with numbers if you email me direct with the numbers i will see what i can find for you as to the incorrect number fitting the ignition lock its a fair shout that the lock is worn as its the one used most---who opens the seat more than rides?
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Jim Shea

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Re: Question on keys & numbers
« Reply #12 on: November 19, 2005, 03:10:26 AM »
If the tank can be opened with a screw driver or similar, does that mean that the seat lock is the same?

Offline Raul CB750K1

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Re: Question on keys & numbers
« Reply #13 on: November 19, 2005, 05:46:57 AM »
If the tank can be opened with a screw driver or similar, does that mean that the seat lock is the same?

No. The seat lock is an actual lock. The gascap is not, I guess because there was no way to make a flat lock back then...

Raul


Offline bryanj

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Re: Question on keys & numbers
« Reply #14 on: November 20, 2005, 03:03:38 AM »
Bifta, you have an original NOS tank. The catch (ALWAYS remember to push down on the cap BEFORE pushing the catch!!) was originally on all the tanks but the US  fixation with safety, courtesy of Mr Nader i believe, made Honda put on a "locking" catch that should not fly open in an accident, original fitment on 400F2,  and this became the only supplied part and was also fitted to new tanks made after a  certain date
Semi Geriatric ex-Honda mechanic and MOT tester (UK version of annual inspection). Garage full of "projects" mostly 500/4 from pre 73 (no road tax in UK).

Remember "Its always in the last place you look" COURSE IT IS YOU STOP LOOKIN THEN!

CharlieVT

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Re: Question on keys & numbers
« Reply #15 on: November 20, 2005, 04:28:31 AM »
It isn't that hard to take a lock apart and rekey it. I did this for the seat lock on my CB550. 
There are 3 sets of pins in there. You can take them all out or rearrange them so the work with your existing ingition key.
The easiest thing to do is just take out the pins. With the pins removed any key or a screwdriver will open the lock. If you want me to describe how I did it just ask.

I'm sorry I didn't take pictures when I did mine.

Jim Shea

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Re: Question on keys & numbers
« Reply #16 on: November 20, 2005, 04:32:17 AM »
Charlie,
I may need to do that, so I would be interested.
Jim.

CharlieVT

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Re: Question on keys & numbers
« Reply #17 on: November 20, 2005, 09:16:30 AM »
Jim,

Take the seat lock assembly apart as much as possible removing all the obvious screws. If I recall correctly, two philips head screws hold on a plate which when removed allows access the latch and spring that engage the seat plunger.  After removing the spring and latch mechanism there is an arm/cam which pulls the latch back when the key is turned. Behind  this cam is a little cir-clip that is tucked in and a little hard to see; this is what holds the lock mechanism in place. It is a good idea to clean everything up first and use good lighting. A small jewler's type screwdriver or similar tool can be used to remove this cir-clip. Once this cir-clip is removed the lock assembly can be removed from its housing.
Once the lock is out it will look something like the picture of a disassembled seat lock on the following website.
http://home.earthlink.net/~cmiddleton01/removingabmwairheadforklock
There is a thin metal (brass or copper colored I think) that is pressed into place. Under this plate are the pins and springs which are the heart of the lock. There are two pins and one spring in each of the three holes. Removing and discarding these pins and springs will allow the lock to operate with any key or a screwdriver.
If you want to re-key the lock to fit you existing ignition key you can experiment with replacing a different combination of pins in different holes until you find a combination that allows the lock to turn only when the key is inserted. Sometimes you can take out one or two of the three sets of pins and create a lock that will work with your key. A lock with only one pin will still work like a lock, it is just likely to be opened with a variety of different keys and is very easy to pick.

Some of the above description is done from memory and might be in error. Questions or problems send me a message. If you really want help, sent me the seat lock with a key you would like to work in it and I'll fix you up. (You get to pay the postage.)
« Last Edit: November 20, 2005, 09:18:52 AM by CharlieVT »

Jim Shea

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Re: Question on keys & numbers
« Reply #18 on: November 20, 2005, 09:26:54 AM »
Charlie,
Thanks, I will let you know if I run in to problems.
Cheers,
Jim.