Author Topic: guitar advise  (Read 1635 times)

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Offline Don R

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guitar advise
« on: January 22, 2010, 03:53:57 PM »
I got a fender accoustic starter guitar for christmas, I'm 57 and never played an instrument before. I've been going through some of the lessons on U tube, learning a lot about the frets, notes and chords. at what point would I be ahead to get lessons?
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Offline bucky katt

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Re: guitar advise
« Reply #1 on: January 22, 2010, 04:03:34 PM »
well, i've been playing for 30+ years with no lessons but i'll be the first to admit i'm not the greatest guitarist in the world. i've thought about lessons lately if for no other reason than to learn to read music.
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Offline BlindJoe

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Re: guitar advise
« Reply #2 on: January 22, 2010, 04:15:07 PM »
If you go to a qualified teacher they should have no problem instructing you at this point. I'd say its best to start with a blank slate so you learn the right techniques the first time around and not have to correct bad habits. Do you have a specific style in mind that you'd like to learn?

Offline Fritz

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Re: guitar advise
« Reply #3 on: January 22, 2010, 04:28:43 PM »
I've been playing for 25 years without any lessons now.

My advise is:
Get a beginner's book and forget about Youtube until you've gone through it. First things first.
It might sound trivial but it's very important that you start with learning the correct position of your left hand (if you are right-handed) and how to hold the instrument. Don't make any shortcuts. If it gets too difficult, put the guitar away and try again tomorrow. And don't practice too much. 15 minutes a day should be enough for the beginning.

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Offline 333

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Re: guitar advise
« Reply #4 on: January 22, 2010, 04:29:38 PM »
The answer to that question depends on what natural ability you may have.  One thing I'd suggest is one of those electronic tuners.  I don't know if age is a factor, but I'm 52.  And back in the day, I was able to tune by ear.  Maybe not exactly on pitch, but certainly to itself.  Now, I need one of those damn things.
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Offline bucky katt

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Re: guitar advise
« Reply #5 on: January 22, 2010, 04:42:20 PM »
The answer to that question depends on what natural ability you may have.  One thing I'd suggest is one of those electronic tuners.  I don't know if age is a factor, but I'm 52.  And back in the day, I was able to tune by ear.  Maybe not exactly on pitch, but certainly to itself.  Now, I need one of those damn things.

me too, i used to be able to tune by ear as well. i use either an electronic tuner OR an online guitar tuner.
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Offline simon#42

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Re: guitar advise
« Reply #6 on: January 23, 2010, 01:15:02 AM »
have a look here

http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/

loads of stuff all different levels , its much easier to learn songs you know well and like so see what you can find .   buy a tuner , and remember you are never to old to learn !
     good luck    simon

Offline Kevin D

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Re: guitar advise
« Reply #7 on: January 23, 2010, 06:34:22 AM »
 You could take a lesson at any time but if you are starting from level zero you are probably right to get acquainted first. Strengthening your hand muscles, increase your dexterity, build your finger calluses, learn a few chords and changing smoothly between them: G, C, D, Am, Em..... that will get you about a million songs.
 
Quote
starter guitar
 I have a $300 guitar that was "set up" by a friend and it improved the playability of the guitar tremendously, and extends the time before my fingertips are turned into raw meat.

 I'm just a 3 chord hacker. I had a few lessons when I was a teen and picked it up again a while back when one of my kids wanted to learn. I've had exactly one lesson in the last 40 years, from Jason Dennie: http://www.myspace.com/jasondennie1 . Now, I cant play anything like he does, but I aspire to. I'm limited by my meager talent, and the amount of effort I'm willing to spend.
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Offline tramp

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Re: guitar advise
« Reply #8 on: January 23, 2010, 09:52:22 AM »
if you can find someone who plays and learn from them
ya learn pretty fast and all kinds of different ways to play
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Offline Don R

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Re: guitar advise
« Reply #9 on: January 23, 2010, 02:53:14 PM »
    I throw and write left but I do everything else right handed. Handgun and throw left, long gun and bat right. So I just started out right handed to make it easier to learn.
  I know a good teacher, he's a 50 minute drive away, the local shops are all booked up right now. Might be worth the trip. My kids are mostly playing bluegrass and my wife is learning banjo but I find myself wanting to play things with hammer ons, pull offs and stretching strings. Like blues. I spend a little time every day on the DVD that came with it, working on chords but I like to pick a little to keep it interesting.
 My wifes banjo instructor set up her banjo so the strings were a little closer to the fretboard, makes it a little easier to get the strings down on the frets.
 thanks for the link too.
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Offline azuredesign

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Re: guitar advise
« Reply #10 on: January 23, 2010, 05:47:48 PM »
One thing you might think about trying is to go to a local jam session and see if any of the players inspire you. If so, ask the guy or gal if they might show you a couple of things. To me, Blues is a really great way to start in music, it can be simple to start and you can make it more complex if and when you want to.

After playing for 50 years, I'd have to say that developing the facility to play what you hear is the most satisfying part of making sounds. I've always liked to start with kids and beginners by playing a note and having them try to match it. You can embellish the note by bending it or wiggling it, and you can demonstrate fun things concerning rhythm with one note as well. Once they get the hang of that, I like to have them sing part of a simple song that they know, like Old Suzannah, or Pop Goes the Weasel and help them to play what they sing. The beauty of guitar is you can play a melody, a harmonic or chordal part to support a melody, or both at the same time. The Blues is great for learning harmony because it can be very simple that way.  Getting your hands connected up with what you hear, and developing what you can hear accurately are really the magical essence of what music is, at least in my opinion. Playing with other folks is right up there as well. The theory, reading, exercises etc, are all just accessories.  
« Last Edit: January 23, 2010, 06:05:58 PM by azuredesign »

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Re: guitar advise
« Reply #11 on: January 23, 2010, 06:47:52 PM »
Immediately, getting a good teacher will prevent you from developing bad habits, and other traits that may well turn out to restrict you in the future. A qualified teacher with good credentials will not mind you asking to see them either. In the UK we would be looking at RCM (Royal college of music) Or academy , and would expect to see for example that the teacher does indeed hold at least a "fellowship" of the royal college.
Like most things in life, you get what you pay for. That does not stop you from watching other guitarists with intent, nor from jamming along to your favourite music, or with other musicians, what it does do is give you a grounding in the essential foundations of theory and practise.
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Offline Don R

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Re: guitar advise
« Reply #12 on: January 25, 2010, 08:57:52 AM »
The teacher I'm thinking about was at the track with us one evening, the races were done for the day and we were around the campfire. Two guitars came out but the other player was playing everything wrong, the teacher instinct came out in my buddy, he tried to help to no avail and I could tell it was driving him nuts listening to the way the other guy was playing. He was polite but had to go for a walk.
 That may have been caused by being self taught. Point taken, thanks.
 I have been invited to jam with a local band sometime, I also have friends who have jam sessions at their home in the summer and the musicians come out of the woodwork, I hear some old timers that show up are amazing. A local teacher who is booked solid right now takes his students to open mike night when he feels they are ready. I think it would be helpful to have a goal like that.
 My new plan is to learn the chords in the fender DVD and get my fingers to stretch out a little then go for the lessons. Thanks.
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Offline azuredesign

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Re: guitar advise
« Reply #13 on: January 25, 2010, 09:36:35 AM »
I can't comment on the anecdote concerning the campfire session, but I question blaming that situation on self teaching especially without having had any training yourself. Consider what folks with relatively little formal training like Django Reinhardt, Charlie Christian, BB King, or Stevie Vaughan did. I do think the amount and quality of educational tools that are available now will make this generation of players coming up that much better than their predecessors, because it helps folks realize their musical potential. But I don't think it's obligatory, and I do think that homogenous training inhibits the emergence of new forms of musical expression.

It might be a good idea if you're looking for a teacher to ask around for someone who's comfortable and successful with teaching adults.

Offline TwoTired

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Re: guitar advise
« Reply #14 on: January 25, 2010, 02:05:25 PM »
"around the campfire" is "performance mode" or "or maybe relaxation mode".   Teachers can teach only when the student wishes to learn.  A good teacher knows this.  When teachers try to force, the student often ignores.

It is as important to find a teacher that fits your learning style as it is to find a teacher that know what to teach.
This applies to music instruction, driving instruction, flying instruction, etc.

An example would be a teacher that is very good with teaching children to play, beginning with children's songs.   This is fine for children.  But, some adults find this insulting and would rather stop playing or practicing than learn and repeatedly play children's songs.  Some teachers are unable to adapt to client's desires/needs, and have to be properly matched to the student.

Of course, the best teachers can adapt to nearly any student.  But, it is not necessary to find the best teacher.  It is most beneficial to find the best teacher for >you<.

You will advance much quicker with the right teacher and appropriate practice, at a rate faster than what you can achieve independently.
Being mostly self taught myself, this was a hard concept to realize.  However, it did allow me to create my own style, which can be suppressed with formal instruction.  I avoided it, because I saw so many people trained with high formal and technical skill, who could only play from a piece of sheet music.  Originality and creative improv music was impossible for them.  And, while they did play beautifully, there was a certain sterility in it that I found somewhat lacking.   

Having said that.  I learned a lot from instructional books; Mel Bay, Mickey Baker, in the late 60's, and, of course, every other guitar player I played/performed along.

Just to keep things in perspective.  No one asks me anymore to perform publicly.  But, my wife still likes how I play!  And, I can entertain myself quite well!

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Offline bucky katt

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Re: guitar advise
« Reply #15 on: January 25, 2010, 03:00:50 PM »
some of my favorites ARE childrens songs, off of Jerry Garcias and David Grismans not for kids only http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Not_for_kids_only
Of all God's creatures there is only one that cannot be made the slave of the lash. That one is the cat. If man could be crossed with the cat it would improve man, but it would deteriorate the cat.
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Re: guitar advise
« Reply #16 on: January 25, 2010, 04:22:42 PM »
as said a teacher may be good to get technique right, but having said that, here's my take.

I took about a 1/4" of my middle finger off 21 years ago on a ships jointer that the guard would
stick open on. So, now I'm am finally back on the guitar regular with the flat top finger and learning
to play chords and such different because of it. It does give an advantage in some ways.
I can hold 4 strings (on the 12 string) down with it for an E chord for example, so the biggest
challenge is to keep it off strings I don't want to deaden or buzz.  ;D

Good luck with your guitar picking and just have fun!

Offline Don R

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Re: guitar advise
« Reply #17 on: February 09, 2010, 10:16:18 PM »
My wife missed her banjo lesson today so I filled in for a guitar lesson. I'm glad I did, I got a lot from it and a half hour goes pretty fast. He is thinking about something we can play together and I offered to be a fill-in for other cancelled lessons in the future. He is booked full time right now. Way cheap at 12 dollars.
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Offline Retro Rocket

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Re: guitar advise
« Reply #18 on: February 09, 2010, 10:49:21 PM »
Quote
After playing for 50 years, I'd have to say that developing the facility to play what you hear is the most satisfying part of making sounds. I've always liked to start with kids and beginners by playing a note and having them try to match it. You can embellish the note by bending it or wiggling it, and you can demonstrate fun things concerning rhythm with one note as well. Once they get the hang of that, I like to have them sing part of a simple song that they know, like Old Suzannah, or Pop Goes the Weasel and help them to play what they sing. The beauty of guitar is you can play a melody, a harmonic or chordal part to support a melody, or both at the same time. The Blues is great for learning harmony because it can be very simple that way.  Getting your hands connected up with what you hear, and developing what you can hear accurately are really the magical essence of what music is, at least in my opinion. Playing with other folks is right up there as well. The theory, reading, exercises etc, are all just accessories.

+1 Azure, I am self taught as well and i play multiple instruments, i can't read a bar of music but can listen to anything and play it,i also can tune my guitars faster by ear than with a tuner. Most people focus on building chords and chord shapes and this will obviously help you play but the most important thing is to develop your picking hand as this is where all the rhythm comes from. Also you will sound better on a well set up guitar, it is amazing what a difference it makes learning to play on a well set up instrument..

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Offline Don R

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Re: guitar advise
« Reply #19 on: February 10, 2010, 09:51:22 PM »
I went to an open mike night tonight and was able to pick out some of the chords being played by watching. It's also fun to find a sound that's familiar and then track it down on the strings and frets. My middle daughter plays bluegrass fiddle and I've already been able to show her the names of the strings on a guitar and how to learn the notes. Her old casio keyboard makes it easier to see the sharps and flats by looking at the white and black keys. This willl be fun for us. Another journey of learning. I am looking for a guitar-banjo song that my wife and I can learn. Not ready for dueling banjos yet though.
No matter how many times you paint over a shadow, it's still there.
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