Author Topic: 75 cb750 ignition wiring meltdown...  (Read 6022 times)

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Offline ben-zehner

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75 cb750 ignition wiring meltdown...
« on: May 28, 2010, 10:36:31 AM »
just had my wiring gone over by a experienced friend.

the bike worked great for a night.

last night fired it up....lights got dim....dash light went out

the four wires that run from the key switch to the quick connect (main harness) under the tank got toasty.

really just the red and black not the two browns......they actually melted together and smoked.

but quick check in the headlight....nothing bare or touching...or warm and smokey

same with the bundle at the quich connect...cool to the touch and not smokin....

is it possible that i just need a new (key) ignition switch?

Offline JS550

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Re: 75 cb750 ignition wiring meltdown...
« Reply #1 on: May 28, 2010, 11:52:38 AM »
Sounds like something is crossed up or a bad ground maybe. I wouldnt think, other then the melted wires, that you would need a new switch.
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Offline TwoTired

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Re: 75 cb750 ignition wiring meltdown...
« Reply #2 on: May 28, 2010, 12:32:47 PM »
Fuses (if used) should protect most wiring from faults.

However, the charging system rectifier is NOT fused faults there routinely smoke up the wiring.
Lloyd... (SOHC4 #11 Original Mail List)
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Offline Mdub

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Re: 75 cb750 ignition wiring meltdown...
« Reply #3 on: May 29, 2010, 12:57:51 PM »
Sounds like your switch accumulated enough resistance to overheat the wires, but not enough to blow the fuse. Check and note the resistance of the key switch. Then, take the switch apart, clean it and reassemble with silicone/dielectric grease.
Then recheck it's resistance to verify any improvement.
Should do the trick.
X= an unknown quantity
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Offline TwoTired

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Re: 75 cb750 ignition wiring meltdown...
« Reply #4 on: May 29, 2010, 01:54:16 PM »
Sounds like your switch accumulated enough resistance to overheat the wires, but not enough to blow the fuse.
I'm sorry if this offends you.   But, electrically speaking, this makes no sense, as resistance impedes current flow, reducing it in the entire circuit.  Current flow is inversely proportional to circuit resistance.  If the switch contacts have increased resistance it will generate heat right at the site of the resistance, not infer it elsewhere in the current loop.

I do agree about your actual procedure for switch overhaul.  But, the switch itself is unlikely to cause a wiring meltdown, unless internal bits have made contact with frame ground, and in that case bits are broken and not likely repairable.  However, even in that scenario, the fuse between the keyswitch and the battery should part to protect the wiring from damage (assuming the main fuse hasn't been bridged and defeated from doing its function).

There is quite a lot the OP is not telling us about the malady.  And, I predict he will get the equivalent value in return.

Lloyd... (SOHC4 #11 Original Mail List)
72 500, 74 550, 75 550K, 75 550F, 76 550F, 77 550F X2, 78 550K, 77 750F X2, 78 750F, 79CX500, 85 700SC, GL1100

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Offline HondaMan

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Re: 75 cb750 ignition wiring meltdown...
« Reply #5 on: May 29, 2010, 02:05:54 PM »
just had my wiring gone over by a experienced friend.

the bike worked great for a night.

last night fired it up....lights got dim....dash light went out

the four wires that run from the key switch to the quick connect (main harness) under the tank got toasty.

really just the red and black not the two browns......they actually melted together and smoked.

but quick check in the headlight....nothing bare or touching...or warm and smokey

same with the bundle at the quich connect...cool to the touch and not smokin....

is it possible that i just need a new (key) ignition switch?

If the Brown wires are OK, the lighting circuit probably is, too. The rectifier is always connected, so that's probably not involved. Check the circuits connected to the BLACK junctions: start by pulling off the BLACK at the voltagfe regulator, turn on the key, see if it gets hot. If so, go into the headlight and unplug all BLACK that you see, turn on the key, and plug in one at a time until you find the "bad" circuit. Then track it down by following that wire.  ;)
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Offline Mdub

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Re: 75 cb750 ignition wiring meltdown...
« Reply #6 on: May 30, 2010, 01:40:40 AM »
Sounds like your switch accumulated enough resistance to overheat the wires, but not enough to blow the fuse.
I'm sorry if this offends you.   But, electrically speaking, this makes no sense, as resistance impedes current flow, reducing it in the entire circuit.  Current flow is inversely proportional to circuit resistance.  If the switch contacts have increased resistance it will generate heat right at the site of the resistance, not infer it elsewhere in the current loop.

I do agree about your actual procedure for switch overhaul.  But, the switch itself is unlikely to cause a wiring meltdown, unless internal bits have made contact with frame ground, and in that case bits are broken and not likely repairable.  However, even in that scenario, the fuse between the keyswitch and the battery should part to protect the wiring from damage (assuming the main fuse hasn't been bridged and defeated from doing its function).

There is quite a lot the OP is not telling us about the malady.  And, I predict he will get the equivalent value in return.



Hi TT, no offense taken.
He did say that the wires got toasty, under the tank.
Maybe I inferred at the switch.
It is a fact that a dirty overheating switch can/does melt wire insulation near/at the switch (source of heat) before blowing the fuse.
(determined by wire guage and length, fuse size, amp capacity and voltage of battery and resistance of switch or other offending load, as well as the melting point of the wire insulation).
Which makes perfect sense, electrically speaking, because heat is a result of resistance. Heat also accelerates corrosion which causes more resistance that causes more heat. We have all replaced melted, burnt,
toasted connectors on these old corroded machines.
« Last Edit: May 30, 2010, 03:43:39 AM by Mdub »
X= an unknown quantity
Spurt= a drip under pressure!

Offline dave500

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Re: 75 cb750 ignition wiring meltdown...
« Reply #7 on: May 30, 2010, 01:56:30 AM »
pull the tank off,open the seat and dissemble the head light bucket,your looking for rubbed through wires around the head stem,and under the tank against the frame and else where,through grommet holes etc,you might have to unwrap parts of the loom,these are old bikes now and dirt and grease can hide these things,make sure you find the fault and fix it,it could be a total loom rewire if it gets worse.

Offline Spanner 1

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Re: 75 cb750 ignition wiring meltdown...
« Reply #8 on: May 30, 2010, 06:42:45 PM »
No way the red/black can ' melt together' if there is a 15A Main Fuse on the red wire, like it's supposed to be..... so it's not stock or there is a 'nail' in place of the fuse!! Plus you have a dead short on the black wire to ground..... remember; black is always +12V on our bikes, never connects to ground( green ) or frame.......
« Last Edit: May 30, 2010, 06:45:00 PM by Spanner 1 »
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Offline Mdub

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Re: 75 cb750 ignition wiring meltdown...
« Reply #9 on: May 31, 2010, 12:49:04 PM »
No way the red/black can ' melt together' if there is a 15A Main Fuse on the red wire,

No offense, but you are wrong.
A corroded switch or connector can over heat wire
insulation and melt the insulation together without blowing the fuse.

It's when the copper in the wires makes contact, creating a dead short, that the fuse blows.
X= an unknown quantity
Spurt= a drip under pressure!

Offline Spanner 1

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Re: 75 cb750 ignition wiring meltdown...
« Reply #10 on: May 31, 2010, 01:19:41 PM »
We'll agree to disagree!!!.... and the OP has not revealed anything about a fuse or lack of fuse !
If your sure it's a carb problem; it's ignition,
If your sure it's an ignition problem; it's carbs....

Offline sandcastcb750

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Re: 75 cb750 ignition wiring meltdown...
« Reply #11 on: May 31, 2010, 01:51:43 PM »
True. Corroded wires increase resistance and thus more amps are needed to get the same wattage. Get some new connectors at http://www.vintageconnections.com/.

Offline Spanner 1

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Re: 75 cb750 ignition wiring meltdown...
« Reply #12 on: May 31, 2010, 08:14:35 PM »
True... so if ya have a fuse it will 'melt' before your wire will , or fuses are useless and should be done away with.....
If your sure it's a carb problem; it's ignition,
If your sure it's an ignition problem; it's carbs....

Offline TwoTired

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Re: 75 cb750 ignition wiring meltdown...
« Reply #13 on: May 31, 2010, 09:56:11 PM »
True. Corroded wires increase resistance and thus more amps are needed to get the same wattage.

Where do you people get your electrical education?

Ohm's law as applied to DC circuits is E/R = I
Watts law is P = IxE

Given the voltage won't get much over 13 V,  what permutation of the equation allows higher watts with higher resistance?

Higher resistance causes lower current.  Lower current results in LESS watts.

Personally, I think the OP is having a good chuckle about us and his bogus post.  And, is far too embarrassed to tell us the fuse was bypassed and his "experienced friend" was far more adept at blowing smoke rather than bike electrics.



Lloyd... (SOHC4 #11 Original Mail List)
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Offline scottly

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Re: 75 cb750 ignition wiring meltdown...
« Reply #14 on: May 31, 2010, 10:06:10 PM »

Personally, I think the OP is having a good chuckle about us and his bogus post. 

Hmm, zehner? You may be right. This may just be a bogus post....
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Offline Spanner 1

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Re: 75 cb750 ignition wiring meltdown...
« Reply #15 on: May 31, 2010, 10:12:59 PM »
What?.... A bogus post? :(, Here :o, , I'm sure I've replied to plenty >:(
If your sure it's a carb problem; it's ignition,
If your sure it's an ignition problem; it's carbs....

Offline scottly

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Re: 75 cb750 ignition wiring meltdown...
« Reply #16 on: May 31, 2010, 10:17:27 PM »
Yeah, I suspect I have fallen to a few of these, myself. One can only wonder what type of person would pull a prank like this? :(
Don't fix it if it ain't broke!
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Offline Spanner 1

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Re: 75 cb750 ignition wiring meltdown...
« Reply #17 on: May 31, 2010, 10:23:14 PM »
Incarcerated Trolls with I'net access un-monitored by their corrections staff........
If your sure it's a carb problem; it's ignition,
If your sure it's an ignition problem; it's carbs....

Offline scottly

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Re: 75 cb750 ignition wiring meltdown...
« Reply #18 on: May 31, 2010, 10:26:41 PM »
Well, let's just hope they stay incarcerated!!!!
Don't fix it if it ain't broke!
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Offline Grnrngr

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Re: 75 cb750 ignition wiring meltdown...
« Reply #19 on: June 01, 2010, 12:34:15 AM »
I think you should make a chopper out of it.
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Offline Bodi

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Re: 75 cb750 ignition wiring meltdown...
« Reply #20 on: June 01, 2010, 06:02:01 AM »
TT is right as usual. A high resistance switch will overheat - at the high resistance contact. The result would be a melted switch. The ignition switches have the terminals either soldered or crimped on, solder connection would melt and fall off where a crimped connection will get loose and intermittent if overheated. The very end or maybe 1/2 inch of the wire at a switch terminal may get overheated and melt its insulation if there's enough heat - usually from a corroded connector providing the heat.
No way the black and red wire will "melt together" with a proper fuse in the circuit.
HM is right (again, as usual) about the rectifier. This is the only unfused connection in the wiring harness (excepting the big cable to the solenoid and starter motor, and the unfused wire leading to the fuses). If a diode fails "short" you can have melted wires but they wouldn't be near the ignition switch.