Topic: cam chain adjuster - on or off?

[vistirus]

I read the manual about adjusting the cam chain tension and it says the engine should be running.  I read some posts on this and other sites that say no, one of the plus features of the 750 is you do this with the engine off.  Some advice, please. Which is it?

Bike is a '78 cb750k with no modifications at all.

Thanks.

[shorty24]

I would like some clarification on this issue as well, actually.  I'm running a 550F and the Honda manual says to do it with the engine off, at TDC, while the Clymer manual says to do it with the engine on, and others here are saying it should be done 15 degrees past TDC.  Which is right?

[lucky]

Each motorcycle design is different!!!!

IF you loosen the cam chain tensioner WHILE the engine is running, then you run the risk if the cam chain jumping over the teeth of the cam chain or crankshaft sprocket and ruining the entire valve train and pistons. INSTANTLY!!!

Its your bike.

My Clymer's workshop manual describes how to adjust the cam chain and
I am going to do it the way the book tells me.

[CycleRanger]

while the Clymer manual says to do it with the engine on,

Each motorcycle design is different!!!!

IF you loosen the cam chain tensioner WHILE the engine is running, then you run the risk if the cam chain jumping over the teeth of the cam chain or crankshaft sprocket and ruining the entire valve train and pistons. INSTANTLY!!!

My Clymer's workshop manual describes how to adjust the cam chain and
I am going to do it the way the book tells me.

 

[lucky]

while the Clymer manual says to do it with the engine on,

Each motorcycle design is different!!!!

IF you loosen the cam chain tensioner WHILE the engine is running, then you run the risk if the cam chain jumping over the teeth of the cam chain or crankshaft sprocket and ruining the entire valve train and pistons. INSTANTLY!!!

My Clymer's workshop manual describes how to adjust the cam chain and
I am going to do it the way the book tells me.

 

Check the manual for your year and model. Thats all I am saying.

CB550F could be different than a CB750K. Not all Hondas have the same cam chain tensioner adjustment instructions.

[TwoTired]

I would like some clarification on this issue as well, actually.  I'm running a 550F and the Honda manual says to do it with the engine off, at TDC, while the Clymer manual says to do it with the engine on, and others here are saying it should be done 15 degrees past TDC.  Which is right?

Honda made the engine, not Clymer, or anyone here.  Follow the Honda manual  (read it again, it's NOT at TDC for the 550).
If, afterwards, you think it didn't work for you, tell us why, and we might be able to teach you how to do it while the engine is running, but it takes some finesse and skill to do it that way without increasing tensioner shoe wear.
We've had threads about this in the past, FYI.

Cheers,

[MCRider]

I was raised with the engine off. CB750. However, I've since been educated that Honda switched their method in priint, in their manual, to engine running, later in the series. Since the design of the CB750 tensioner never changed, it is my position that both work. MANY here were never exposed to the prior engine off instructions and adjusted it engine on and never had any problems.

It is my position that a CB750 chain cannot jump a tooth even at maximum slack on the adjuster.

I still prefer engine off.

No comments on other models.

[vistirus]

I went back and checked my Clymer manual and it had a combination of the two methods. Says to set it at 15 degrees from
TDC and then do the adjustment with the engine off.  That's what I did. I'll try that for now and see what happens.

[Hinomaru]

I read the manual about adjusting the cam chain tension and it says the engine should be running.  I read some posts on this and other sites that say no, one of the plus features of the 750 is you do this with the engine off.  Some advice, please. Which is it?
Bike is a '78 cb750k with no modifications at all.

Thanks.

I would like to see the engine running procedure that Honda published for adjusting the CB750 K cam chain. Anybody have a copy they can post up?

For vistirus, this is the non-running procedure taken from my Honda published shop manual for 1969-78 CB750 K:

(click on image for a larger view)

[MCRider]

Hinonaru: I may have mispoke, implying it was a Honda manual.

It was a thread on this subject about a year ago or so. Someone indicated they had it in print that it was a dynamic tension procedure. There were several others that confirmed it and I had to back down from my position that it should be a static procedure only.

Several indicated they did it running with no problems and adequate results.  Maybe they will return.

I still don't see that it could yield adequate results. But many said yes.

[shorty24]

Honda made the engine, not Clymer, or anyone here.  Follow the Honda manual  (read it again, it's NOT at TDC for the 550).


Cheers,

"1. Set the crankshaft to T.D.C. (top dead center) of the compression stroke with the kickstarter pedal"

Quoted directly from the 1977 Honda CB550 owners manual.

[Hinomaru]

MC, no worries.
 
I checked my Clymer manual (pictured below) dated 1977 and it’s the 6th printing. It shows a non-running cam chain adjustment procedure. Perhaps I’m behind the times here as I’m not aware of an engine running procedure. Was this something new for 1978 or later? Anyhow, I would love to have a copy for my shop notes. In the meantime, think I’ll still adjust my cam chain the old school way. 
 

[TwoTired]

Honda made the engine, not Clymer, or anyone here.  Follow the Honda manual  (read it again, it's NOT at TDC for the 550).


Cheers,

"1. Set the crankshaft to T.D.C. (top dead center) of the compression stroke with the kickstarter pedal"

Quoted directly from the 1977 Honda CB550 owners manual.

You are right about that.  I hadn't checked that one.  But, I'd still recommend you follow what the shop manual shows, in order to get proper chain slack against the tensioner shoe (15 degrees after TDC).

Cheers,

[crazypj]

I would like some clarification on this issue as well, actually.  I'm running a 550F and the Honda manual says to do it with the engine off, at TDC, while the Clymer manual says to do it with the engine on, and others here are saying it should be done 15 degrees past TDC.  Which is right?

 On 550 turn until the advancer post lines up with mark on case (about 15 deg ATDC)

[bollingball]

I read the manual about adjusting the cam chain tension and it says the engine should be running.  I read some posts on this and other sites that say no, one of the plus features of the 750 is you do this with the engine off.  Some advice, please. Which is it?
Bike is a '78 cb750k with no modifications at all.

Thanks.

I would like to see the engine running procedure that Honda published for adjusting the CB750 K cam chain. Anybody have a copy they can post up?

For vistirus, this is the non-running procedure taken from my Honda published shop manual for 1969-78 CB750 K:

(click on image for a larger view)

This is the way I do my 78 750K with one little twist. I have found with the plugs out the motor might roll back a little and not keep the chain snug in the front so I do this. That yellow fishing magnet has caught a lot of guns thrown over the bridge on Fri. night.

Ken

[CycleRanger]

I would like to see the engine running procedure that Honda published for adjusting the CB750 K cam chain. Anybody have a copy they can post up?

Ask and ye shall receive! 
From the 77K Owners Manual. 
My assumption would be that Honda may have determined that many owners found the original procedure too complicated or troublesome so Honda tried to make it as simple as they could to encourage more people to adjust the tensioner, even if the technique was less than optimum.
Notice how they frame it as "Your engine will lose power if you do not do this!"  No one wants that!

[MCRider]

I would like to see the engine running procedure that Honda published for adjusting the CB750 K cam chain. Anybody have a copy they can post up?

Ask and ye shall receive! 
From the 77K Owners Manual. 
My assumption would be that Honda may have determined that many owners found the original procedure too complicated or troublesome so Honda tried to make it as simple as they could to encourage more people to adjust the tensioner, even if the technique was less than optimum.

Thanks, I was pretty sure i wasn't dreaming.

[Imago]

Each motorcycle design is different!!!!

Here's what my Official Honda Shop Manual says for the 1978 CB750F:

[Hinomaru]

CycleRanger and Imago,

Thanks for posting up the Honda published running procedure!    

[shorty24]

You are right about that.  I hadn't checked that one.  But, I'd still recommend you follow what the shop manual shows, in order to get proper chain slack against the tensioner shoe (15 degrees before TDC).

Cheers,

Excellent, thank you!  By the way, the guy in the post just after the one I quoted here said it was 15 deg after TDC...is it before like you said, or after, like he said?  I'm sorry, I don't have the actual shop manual.

[CycleRanger]

  I'm sorry, I don't have the actual shop manual.

You can download the shop manual here: http://honda4fun.com/materiale-documentazione-tecnica/shop-manual
 

[750K]

On the 750 iirc it's 15deg past TDC on cylinder 1, thats when you hit the point that the cam chain has the most slack. I usually warm the motor up first and adjust with the engine off.

[MCRider]

On the 750 iirc it's 15deg past TDC on cylinder 1, thats when you hit the point that the cam chain has the most slack. I usually warm the motor up first and adjust with the engine off.

That's correct, IIRC  , on the CB750 its ATDC. No comment on the 500/550 though.

[TwoTired]

You are right about that.  I hadn't checked that one.  But, I'd still recommend you follow what the shop manual shows, in order to get proper chain slack against the tensioner shoe (15 degrees before TDC).

Cheers,

Excellent, thank you!  By the way, the guy in the post just after the one I quoted here said it was 15 deg after TDC...is it before like you said, or after, like he said?  I'm sorry, I don't have the actual shop manual.

Dooh!

Yes, it is AFTER, not before.  
I never really thought about it before, I just used picture memory for doing the adjustment.

 I'll fix my post. 

 Um.... Why don't you have the shop manual?

[flybox1]

Ask and ye shall receive! 
From the 77K Owners Manual. 
My assumption would be that Honda may have determined that many owners found the original procedure too complicated or troublesome so Honda tried to make it as simple as they could to encourage more people to adjust the tensioner, even if the technique was less than optimum.
Notice how they frame it as "Your engine will lose power if you do not do this!"  No one wants that!

i've got big mitts    id rather do this than wrestle plugs 2&3 out