Topic: Franklin Epedition

[demon78]

Looks like they have discovered one of the Franklin expedition ships on the sea floor after 166 years in reasonably good condition they are not sure whether it's the Erebus or the Terror, be fascinating to be a marine archaeologist up there now.
Be a #$%* to dive on it at those temps.
Bill the demon.

[Killer Canary]

I figured that something would have to be found sooner or later.

[Prospect]

I'm excited that they found it.  I can only imagine the agony those men went through.  On a similar not here is a link to shackeltons wanted ad.  I don't think I have what it takes to accept a challenge like that.  Certainly not now that I have kids.

[ekpent]

Be pretty hard up for a job to answer that add 

[demon78]

Adventure, adventure, remember it was before the first world war ( which kind of settled the lust for adventure ) pit your strength against the unknown and all that.
Bill th demon.

[Prospect]

I like the "safe return doubtful" part.

[Killer Canary]

Still some mystery surrounding this. For example, why were the two skeletons sitting in the beached supply boat, facing each other? Could any survivors have made it to the Territories and lived out their days with the Inuit?

[BeSeeingYou]

Still some mystery surrounding this. For example, why were the two skeletons sitting in the beached supply boat, facing each other? Could any survivors have made it to the Territories and lived out their days with the Inuit?

Unlikely.  Some expedition members where trying to get to the Great Fish River (Backs River) so they equipped the small boats with runners to act as sledges with the hope of using the boats to ascend the river.  Even so the boats with supplies where around 800 lbs and would have to be manhauled across the frozen water of the Arctic Sea and snowbound landscape to get to the river to be floated.  Most probably died somewhere on King William Island where many artifacts have been found.  There are some reports of artifacts and Inuit stories of some making it to the mouth of Backs River and some ways inland but no credible reports of survivors living with the Inuit.  There are Inuit stories about encountering a large group of starving white men but for self preservation the Inuit would flee as they had only enough food to feed themselves and the landscape could not provide enough for that many people in that season.  Another story is about two Inuit hunters encountering expedition members who offered all sorts of rewards for bringing in some game.  The hunters gave what they had and at night when everyone was asleep they slipped away as fast as they could...again for self preservation.  Some stayed with the ships and died aboard as the ships where locked in the ice.  These stories again come for Inuit sources who boarded the ships to find dead men frozen in the bunks.  Part of the blame can be given over to the hubris of the early British explorers who refused to adopt Inuit ways.  They had lived in that environment for hundreds of years but where seen as primitive and having little to offer.  Just as Robert Scott failed at the South Pole while Roald Amundsen succeeded in part because he had adopted and adapted methods of travel and clothing learned from the Inuit on previous journeys in the North.

The interesting thing about the Shackleton ad is though the expedition failed they endured one of the most incredible survival stories ever due to the leadership of Earnest Shackleton without loss of life among the crew and expedition members from the Endurance.  A little known story is the other half of the expedition known as the Ross Sea Party who were to lay out supply depots starting from the other side of the continent from the ship Aurora.  Shackleton could only carry enough supplies to make it halfway across the continent.  They completed their mission but where also were left stranded and where not rescued until 1917 a full year after Shackleton returned.  Shackleton led that rescue mission also.  The Ross Sea Party did lose three men.  The days of iron men and wooden ships.

[demon78]

Oh God yes, indeed, wooden ships and Iron Men, can't imagine the suffering and as a kid having read all the stories about the explorers you dream about how you would have done but even as a kid you wondered why they couldn't have found warmer spots to explore. Not too long ago the Ceeb ran a series about voyageurs  that took York boats to the north and it was recreated so that the participants did it the way it had been done and the show advertised for people to be on the show the first thing that crossed my mind was wow that would be a blast the second was what do you mean period, no bug spray, no modern conveniences nothing, #$%* that, they are crazy, expose my bod to the trillions of biting bugs not for 10 time the coin being offered. So I guess I would have made a piss poor explorer.
Bill the demon.

[70CB750]

Maybe this could be of some interest to you.  This guy lived on New Siberia island for 30 years:

http://www.eskymo-welzl.cz/

he walked there from Krasnojarsk 1895 - 1898.

[Killer Canary]

Unlikely.  Some expedition members where trying to get to the Great Fish River (Backs River) so they equipped the small boats with runners to act as sledges with the hope of using the boats to ascend the river.  Even so the boats with supplies where around 800 lbs and would have to be manhauled across the frozen water of the Arctic Sea and snowbound landscape to get to the river to be floated.  Most probably died somewhere on King William Island where many artifacts have been found.  There are some reports of artifacts and Inuit stories of some making it to the mouth of Backs River and some ways inland but no credible reports of survivors living with the Inuit.  There are Inuit stories about encountering a large group of starving white men but for self preservation the Inuit would flee as they had only enough food to feed themselves and the landscape could not provide enough for that many people in that season.  Another story is about two Inuit hunters encountering expedition members who offered all sorts of rewards for bring in some game.  The hunters gave what they had and at night when everyone was asleep they slipped away as fast as they could...again for self preservation.  Some stayed with the ships and died aboard as the ships where locked in the ice.  These stories again come for Inuit sources who boarded the ships to find dead men frozen in the bunks.  Part of the blame can be given over to the hubris of the early British explorers who refused to adopt Inuit ways.  They had lived in that environment for hundreds of years but where seen as primitive and having little to offer.  Just as Robert Scott failed at the South Pole while Roald Amundsen succeeded in part because he had adopted and adapted methods of travel and clothing learned from the Inuit on previous journeys in the North.

Oh.

[BeSeeingYou]

Oh God yes, indeed, wooden ships and Iron Men, can't imagine the suffering and as a kid having read all the stories about the explorers you dream about how you would have done but even as a kid you wondered why they couldn't have found warmer spots to explore. Not too long ago the Ceeb ran a series about voyageurs  that took York boats to the north and it was recreated so that the participants did it the way it had been done and the show advertised for people to be on the show the first thing that crossed my mind was wow that would be a blast the second was what do you mean period, no bug spray, no modern conveniences nothing, #$%* that, they are crazy, expose my bod to the trillions of biting bugs not for 10 time the coin being offered. So I guess I would have made a piss poor explorer.
Bill the demon.

I saw a similar if not the same documentary where they took York boats down one of the rivers to Hudson Bay...maybe the Churchill or the Hayes, I don't remember.  I just returned from a canoe trip in "Voyageur Country" and even though we did not have to portage huge packs full of beaver pelts or travel in leaky birch bark canoes it is still a physically challenging environment.  Our canoes have changed only in the use of modern materials making them stronger and lighter but the landscape is the same.  We were on a well known Voyageur route and camped at places that you just knew were used by those who came before.  We saw 300-400 year old Indian pictographs and climbed and explored many prominent natural landmarks that were prominent landmarks for them too.....traveling in their footsteps and paddle strokes.

[demon78]

That would have been a great trip did you have bug spray I suppose the reason I'm fixated on bugs is, if I was with a group of people I would chum for all the biting critters for at least 300'.They'd be fine, I'd be covered.
Bill the demon.

[BeSeeingYou]

That would have been a great trip did you have bug spray I suppose the reason I'm fixated on bugs is, if I was with a group of people I would chum for all the biting critters for at least 300'.They'd be fine, I'd be covered.
Bill the demon.

   We always go sometime in September....the 1st week is usually the best time of the whole summer.  Bugs are minor to non existent by that time.  Even more people visit in June, July, and August when the bugs are most active so you can survive it.  I don't like bug spray so I never use it and if we encounter any I just suck it up and endure it.  The better plan that we follow is to visit after they have faded away for the season.  We always stay up late with a campfire every evening, watching the stars, Northern Lights, and listening to the Loons calling....it's a big part of our experience.  We had a full moon this trip and went out for a late nite paddle.  More reason to avoid the bug season.
   We got involved in a little search and rescue operation on this trip.  We were camped on a small island in a bay and two canoes came in at sunset asking if we had seen a young lady.  They were part of a large group occupying
 a few campsites on the other side of a large peninsula that formed the bay we were in.   An 18 year old girl had gone for a hike and not returned (there are no hiking trails).  We spent a few hours coasting the shoreline calling out to no avail...then it started to rain hard.  It cleared up by morning and we searched again and about 10:30am another search team found her off to the south in an unexpected place...cold, wet, and frightened but ok.  Looking at the terrain maps nobody expected her to be able to go that way...most of us were looking to the north.  She was lucky it was September and not July, she would have been chewed up something fierce.
   I actually think the bugs are worse now in modern times than back in the day.  It has to do with the original white pine forest that covered the area.  The island we were on was all white pine and they drop such a mass of needles that they carpet the floor and keep undergrowth to a minimum.  It's easy to walk through such a forest, it's almost park like, and it must have been a magnificent sight to see the whole area in it's original state.  Where the white pines have been removed through logging, fire, or wind, aspen, maple, and birch take their place and you get a tangle of undergrowth and a home for the bugs.  These are relatively short lived species and over time the white pines become dominant again.  There were two islands a ways down the lake that were close together but had different forest cover.  One was white pine the other aspen, birch, and maple.....it had obviously been completely burned over about 50-60 years ago.  The occasional white pines poked through here and there...slowly plotting a comeback.

[BeSeeingYou]

Still some mystery surrounding this. For example, why were the two skeletons sitting in the beached supply boat, facing each other? Could any survivors have made it to the Territories and lived out their days with the Inuit?

I didn't mention it earlier as it's a bit grisly but if I recall the story of the two men in the boat.  One was eating his dead companion.  The story of the two Inuit hunters I mentioned earlier also left out the main reason they fled after dark.  They saw that Franklin's men were carrying body parts and other signs of cannibalism.  They feared they would be next on the menu.  It should be pretty easy for anyone in a hunter/gatherer society to tell the difference between animal remains and those of "long pig". 

Massive search efforts were eventually launched for the Franklin Expedition but they were all dead by that point.  Much of the  Canadian Arctic was a blank space on the map at that time and these search parties did map and explore it though the Northwest Passage would elude them for another 30+ years or so.