Topic: Bucket Products (this time for a 1984 XR500R mud guard) trashes into what works.

[Redline it]

Slightly self diagnosed mental evals came in positive. My first cure using a cat litter bucket (handle) for an in-tank complete fuel filter was only a few weeks ago, works awesome. Couple days ago noticed the swing arm mounted mud guard that shields the lower shock mount on a 1984 XR500R was nearly sawed in half, maybe from being loose? So I could of spent $100.00+ in getting a replacement, but pulled out the spare parts "bucket" again. Same thickness and has a 90' (degree) top to add strength, I ended up cutting out a mold then riveted it on with a little RV silicone that has to be 15 yrs old. And it works great.

You'll find the first invention modification in "Proven Tips and Tricks," Some might think it's lame, I could've purchased an after market cheap junk part for 10 bucks or 1 dollar, but I saved my petcock and put a filter in the tank after 30 years of not having one. Now I'm stylin like the big dogs!

[Terry in Australia]

That's a fine job mate, I've got a 1983 XR500RE, I'll have to have a look at mine and see if I can benefit from your McGyver-ing. Cheers, Terry.

   

[Redline it]

That's a beautiful bike there. Likin those tires you run. I gotta look for some! Big knobbies are a little too much, most of the time. Good day mate! 

[Terry in Australia]

That's a beautiful bike there. Likin those tires you run. I gotta look for some! Big knobbies are a little too much, most of the time. Good day mate! 

Thanks mate, the tires are Pirelli Scorpions with emphasis on good road manners with some dirt ability, which suit my needs, my Enduro days are long gone, but I do like the idea of some occasional dirt road touring. Cheers, Terry.    

[Redline it]

We're like ridin the same story. My enduro days I stopped at 18 after picking up a class 21 SCORE International Championship for the series win in 1978, it's looked at as a World Championship, I could've had a career easily. Layin flat on the tank, chin resting on my left thumb...at those speeds, I walked away.  At 55 I'm only 1/3 the way through, I plan on another 100, at least. Doing crazy things still. If those Scorpions could talk, in our language, they'd be saying to me, "hey, you're chances of another 100, are better if ridin me!" And they know, they're right!

Thanks for sending the brand. They remind me of the Dunlop K70 back in the Hodaka days.

Oh and the championship wins Parker 400, Mexicali 250, Baja 500 were the first 3 in a series of 5, sewed up the title, by June 1978 (Score International Off Road World Championships I got 11th, and Baja 1000 I didn't know enough kids in the neighborhood to make 18 pits, so I didn't ride that one.) But our wins all came on running the Stock IRC 400 or 450x18 rear tire!! The bike was from a Yamaha International Support Ride- an IT250F, in baby blue. Compared to the factory teams Husqvarna, KTM, Honda, our bike looked about as competitive as if it had been strapped to the front fender of a Winnabego heading to a Good Sams Campground for the summer, seriously. It looked and sounded a lot better crossing the finish line in front of those teams though! My co-rider, I chose "BAD" Brad Henson not by accident. I'd let him start, he had no fear in solid dust, he'd crash at high speeds at least 2 and 3 times (each event,) before handing me the bike not only leading our class in time but with in mere minutes of physically over all, behind 1 or 2 class 20 (500cc.) And how I delt with that, was #1 at the rider exchange, I had a pipe bender on an extension to straighten the bars back from twisted. He'd be bleeding and ripped up clothes, with an ear to ear grin. My job was to hang on to that position, for the rest of 250 miles and less, wide open all the time, under massive pressure. We had a blast. The cash pay for them were $1800.00, $1200.00. $1300.00 in order, the series overall I think was about the same. Brad and I, got 50% to split, the other 50% went to a Construction Company who paid the pre-running bills. It was the same company that I went to work for instead of racing. The difference, making way more money hauling dirt daily, and not really as happy as the low pay racing. (I hope I don't get kicked off this site for ramblin on, but hey!)

I still have that bike as it was back then!

I'll bet Australia has some nice riding!

[Terry in Australia]

Ha ha, no worries mate, I never had your skills, but I loved playing in the dirt until I was old enough to buy a new CB750 (in 1978, I'm the same age as you) and that was just about the end of my dirt riding years, apart from a flirtation with an XT500 Yamaha for a couple of years in the 80's.

And no, there's not much chance of you getting kicked off this site for rambling mate, I've been doing it here for years! Hey post a pic of that IT250 if you get a chance, they were a great bike, I always wanted an IT465, I might still find one if I'm lucky! Cheers, Terry.

[Redline it]

I had to dig her out some, and unhang what's left of broken hangers. She's not idolized or enshrined, more like neglected, her time for a stand is coming up, until then, grips melt away, while being careful of things building up on the fenders. I had a couple of the E models, then 2 or 3 of F models. At the time they were priced at $1200.00 out the door, and Yamaha didn't have any factory support in Desert racing nor SCORE events, they were too busy in moto cross pushing the YZ, Bob HURRICANE Hannah lived about 6 miles from home. Yamaha gave me 2 bikes a year plus $500.00 of parts at dealers cost every 6 months (you could've bought a whole bike in parts for that.) I wasn't too much into fashion or high tech anything. I was part of culture of renegades. In a time of Superbowl of Motocross that opened up to SuperCross, Speedway races, Ascot, European Motocross, Evil Knievel and no backflip of anythings yet, I just got a chance to be in it. Not all that skillful but doing it a lot. So with Yamaha's help, a Championship was on the table, that was my offer to them. Ruben Portillo. And the pictures you see is a 1979 IT250F with 1979 YZ250 suspension components Forks, Swing Arm and shock. TerryCable fitted us with a Fork Damper Rod tuned for high speed functions, plus cables. Benny Padilla worked the Mono Shock to his Desert standards of tuning. The IT was kind of bulky and squirrelly in the corners, but had consistent power band that was the key to handling, if you could hold it on the gas wide open. I was lucky to get the chance. I gave yamaha a title, they dropped the program at the end of the year. LOL! The last image is the 450x18 IRC, I liked it because of it's sidewall. In the old days leaders had time to change a piston and still be in the lead. The time I was in it, a flat tire would put you out. I ran 20 to 25psi. It was rough but no flats.

I have big problems with the 84 XR500R, I never washed it since 88. And it ran and ran. I think the pulse generator is toast or loose in the case. Resistance of it's 2 unconnected wires are less than 1 ohm,  I gotta figure out how to repair that or bypass it. You have any ideas?

[Terry in Australia]

Hey thanks for that pics mate, that bike is something special, it's good that you've still got it! I've not had any problems with the ignition on my XR, but I did a search in the Thumpertalk.com forums, and I've linked the threads below, I hope they help! What size main jets are you running on yours? Mine is on the standard jets (#138 and #108) and with the K&N air filter, runs way too lean? Cheers, Terry.

http://www.thumpertalk.com/index.php?app=core&module=search&do=search&fromMainBar=1

[MoMo]

 thanks for the  storyand pics  redline, ramble on...Larry

[Redline it]

thank you for the link! I have been checking that thumpertalk forums, funny thing is, 2 or 3 weeks ago I pulled those carbs off the XR, thinking my last ride a year ago was getting bad gas gumming up. I cleaned them in Super Clean, then I read the warning not to use on aluminim, so I gave them 2 more Super Clean treatments, but washed them in water real well. It's always had a tendency to not idle well, and on choke it sounds way nice. I didn't note the jet sizes but blew the congestion out of them. Thought it would fix it, it didn't. And now it's loosing it's idle by backfiring and stops. Fuel is ok now. Ignition parts are  wearing out from sitting. I'm hoping it's a loose wire! cheers I gotta get some shut eye!

[Redline it]

MoMo! that's a nice collection you got! i was gonna let Terry know I keep all my bikes and broken parts, only I figured it'd be better later. but the best deal I ever got was I went to a junk yard in search of a center stand for a cb400f, it's all i was lookin for. The guy says I just got a trailer load in, if you want it, $75 and it's yours. The next morning they dumped on my driveway a pile of cb750, 450s 305s, one of the earliest honda step throughs, about 15 bikes that had been crashed. Late 80s to early 90s my back yard was like heaven if there is one, Pick a Part, Projects waiting to be worked on. I made 2 nice 750s out of them and got some good parts. I got a job out of town for a couple months, came back they were gone! And there wasn't a center stand on any of them!!

[Terry in Australia]

Thanks mate, I was a good boy and did my chores today, so I might pull the carbs off the XR tomorrow and give them a good clean.

This bike hadn't run for many years until a week or two ago, and I was surprised that it started so easily considering, but all I did was drop the mains out and checked that they weren't blocked, and flushed some fresh gas thru them. For all I know the carb's circuits are full of crud, and/or the mains have sucked some poop up into them.

Of course I haven't done a plug check either, so I need to do some more research, it could also be a bad coil. Anyway, I've got plenty of time to sort it out, and it'll be good to see how fast it goes once I've solved this issue. Cheers, Terry.  

[MoMo]

MoMo! that's a nice collection you got! i was gonna let Terry know I keep all my bikes and broken parts, only I figured it'd be better later. but the best deal I ever got was I went to a junk yard in search of a center stand for a cb400f, it's all i was lookin for. The guy says I just got a trailer load in, if you want it, $75 and it's yours. The next morning they dumped on my driveway a pile of cb750, 450s 305s, one of the earliest honda step throughs, about 15 bikes that had been crashed. Late 80s to early 90s my back yard was like heaven if there is one, Pick a Part, Projects waiting to be worked on. I made 2 nice 750s out of them and got some good parts. I got a job out of town for a couple months, came back they were gone! And there wasn't a center stand on any of them!!

so you're saying the local yard police gave you a citation and since you weren't there to respond they came and cleared you out?   Happened to a friend that way- he lost three cars including a rare Huisa Espana(spelling?).. Loved to ride enduros back in the day, trail riding is the one motorcycle love I really miss, used to ride every weekend either trail or enduro but most all trails have been closed by the environmental do-gooder police...Larry

[Terry in Australia]

And now you're riding a golf cart.........................

[MoMo]

And now you're riding a golf cart.........................

somebody has to do it Terry.

[Redline it]

Thanks mate, I was a good boy and did my chores today, so I might pull the carbs off the XR tomorrow and give them a good clean.

This bike hadn't run for many years until a week or two ago, and I was surprised that it started so easily considering, but all I did was drop the mains out and checked that they weren't blocked, and flushed some fresh gas thru them. For all I know the carb's circuits are full of crud, and/or the mains have sucked some poop up into them.

Of course I haven't done a plug check either, so I need to do some more research, it could also be a bad coil. Anyway, I've got plenty of time to sort it out, and it'll be good to see how fast it goes once I've solved this issue. Cheers, Terry.

Terry what I've been finding out is that the certain signs and symptoms around "starting ok, running on choke, heats fast, but won't idle well w/out choke backfiring and stalling, hard to restart" is coming up with totally different causes. Fuel would seem to be where that problem is, some have tank filter plugged, then some mysteriously (like me) have strange ignition problems with it. My carbs were'nt that dirty, jets were partially clogged and blew out with just a breath, I didn't check the air cut off diaphragm (whoops,) and secondary throttle bushing is worn pretty good. I've never washed this bike since buying it late 80s and rode it a lot, changed oil, filters, lubed chain, gas and tires. While running now briefly the headlight, tail light is excessively bright (charge side?) Spark isn't the brightest. Tested up to the CDI with good results. CDI test says it needs electrical meter or it may get inaccurate  readings. My CDI has a slight crack (Dangit) and with an ok dig mastech multi meter it's giving not good readings. Used ones are 85 bucks, so I started to look for any carb problems. Having only the pull throttle cable shouldn't be the idle problems, but the secondary slide returns slow as if its vacuum is slowing it, took off the top and it then works quick return, primary carb top also taken off they look very good, both slided hitting the bottom. Took the choke rod out and polished it. And changed the 10 year old gas that I've been adding good gas to it to boost the flamability, to new gas. Starts first kick, runs, sound real good, will not idle, I can get the choke off with high revs, soon as it gets close to idle it starts missing. The pulse generator has 402 resistance night before and 399 today it's a little low.   I have a megaphone pipe i run on occasion, but never change jets. Right now i have stock muffler. It has to be fuel problems, tomorrow I'm taking the bowls off and checking the jets again. Or taking the carbs off again. Then I'll check the air cut off valve. What's that thing do?

Gday in the outback!

I seen your bike today on another post. Do you have the chain slider guard that wraps around the pivot shaft or a piece of teflon? The picture doesn't look like it does. I know mine is worn out and the chain is hammering the swing arm. It's original chain, the sprockets are wearing thin wise, i've never seen that before!

[Terry in Australia]

G'Day Mate, thanks for that, the swingarm chain slider rubber thingy has all but worn off, but I've got a new one on the way. The chain is still running over a wafer thin piece of the original, which I initially couldn't distinguish from the hardened chain grease that covered the swingarm pivot.

I dopped the float bowl plugs again today, I wondered if the secondary carb's main jet was blocked, (hence no power past 1/2 throttle) and it did look like there was a little crud in it, so I used an oxy/acetylene tip cleaner to hone it out, and I'm hoping that has sorted the problem. I pulled the (hotter) D7EA sparkplug and it looked so clean I decided to leave it in, and I'll take it for a ride tomorrow and see if the problem is solved.

Your "Overly bright headlight and taillight" reference is interesting, I thought my lights were a bit bright too, but never having owned an XR500 before, I had nothing to compare it to, but when it was missing and farting on the freeway, it "seemed" to go a little better when I switched the lights off? Maybe the spark was a bit weak with the lights on?

I tested my speedo today because it didn't work at all last ride after I changed out the seized cable, the speedo works fine using the electric drill method, but I discovered that the inner cable of the CB750 cable I'm using doesn't protrude as far as the original cable, which is about 1/4" longer. I've ordered a new XR500 cable, but I'll modify the CB750 cable to work while I'm waiting for the new one to arrive from the US.

OK, time to hit the sack, have a good one mate, Cheers, Terry.    

[scottly]

The air cut off valve is apparently an anti-backfire/emissions device. From what I've gathered, it disables the fuel flow through the idle circuit when manifold vacuum is over a certain point, like when the throttle is fully closed while compression braking. Fuel injected cars have a similar feature in the computer software, but it is referred to as fuel cut RPM; if the RPM is above the set threshold with the throttle fully closed, the injectors are shut off.
I played with it on my FT, and found that with a weaker spring, the motor wouldn't idle well, and with no spring it wouldn't idle at all, but still ran well at wider throttle openings once above 3000 RPM. A guy on the FT forum reported sluggish behavior on the bottom end, and the bike idled fine, but no lower than 1500 RPM, and found pin sized holes in the diaphragm. 

[Redline it]

Thank you Scottly! That's a subject I've been looking for and answer on the air cut off. Compression braking can, do a degree, be happening at a stand still by revving.? That is a difficult loop of info to try an analyze by me!! Pretty high degree of physics going on. I'll take the carbs back off if the jets aren't plugged from the bowl removal access.

Terry, the headlight thing, you might be right about the brightness. My other bike the 400ss honda the battery is over 20 years old and it's sad deader than a door nail for 2 lengthy periods. It is no good. but I keep charging it. It works fine as long as the bike is getting rode. So the light on it is very dim. Yellow. A dinner light. I'm gonna get anther one.

Thanks for posting that about the valve. Come to think of it, while on the gas and then shutting off the throttle it would back fire some.

[scottly]

On the earlier versions, the lighting/charging systems and ignition systems were separate. The ignition was a self-energized type, requiring no battery.
 

[Terry in Australia]

Yep, mine doesn't have a battery, or even an ignition key, and that's how it came from the factory. I don't think it was supposed to be "road registerable", but I might be wrong, I really haven't done that much research, the XL500 was a dual purpose "Road/Trail" bike, and was in a lower state of tune than the XR, whereas the XR was more of a competition weapon. Does your FT have an electric start Scott? Cheers, Terry.  

[scottly]

The XR's were not "street legal" over here, but Henry (RIP ) managed to get his '79 he bought brand new registered in AZ by adding some tiny trailer marking lights for turn signals and mirrors. When he moved back to CA, he got pulled over, and the cop told him the headlight was too small, the signals were too small and too close together, etc, so he never tried to apply for a CA reg. If I'm not mistaken, the '79-82 year XR's have an AC lighting system?
The FT has an electric starter, but it's certainly not one of Honda's best designs; in fact, it's piss poor. Still, it works about 3 times out of 5 when the button is pressed, and I've gotten a bit spoiled.  

[Redline it]

You guys aren't going to believe this stuff I've been going through, maybe you will! So I pulled the bowls off the carbs to see if I got jets plugged. So what do I find? A little curly cue white plastic piece that came from my last invention of a fuel filter made out of a bucket handle in the primary main jet. I've since notified everyone in the world that's visited the post (tips and tricks, not for questions threads,) to maybe melt the holes instead of drill them. I knew it wasn't my problem though. The curly cue. Then I find sand, fine sand in the bowls, I'm like wtf? Might of been from the last outing I went on. A Prospectors MC Memorial Enduro race in honor of past Prospectors Club President, Rex Hopkins, my ex father in law. The XR500R...he sold to me back in the 80s. Well on that particular event, the memorial,  I met with some friends out there and had an idea, that we could ride up to every campfire and do a couple loops around the fire then park and pull up a seat at the fire like we know them (with intentions of offered cocktails of course!) The idea worked so well, that by 2am we were 2 miles out of main camps at the Hosiers' camp and those guys are serious consumptioneers, leaving thinking we were heading back, I knew the place well, we got lost and rode the first 50 mile loop. I fell over like 40 times and looped the 500 on a rock hill climb that was a lot steeper than I thought. So I had to go get stitches after we waited for the sun to come up to see where camp was. Sand might of got in the tank then.

Wash the tank out. Put some more old gas in it because I didnt' have enough to be on the on instead of the reserve tank position. Started the beast on first kick, and for the first time in ages, this bike ran beautiful, 15 seconds after it was running I shut the choke off, (btw, my 500 doesn't have a battery, no key, not street legal yet,) and it ran so smooth. It idled!! So I shut it off. Had some dinner. Went back out and started it, it wouldn't rev, backfired a few times and died. Started right up and would not run w/out the full choke, wouldn't rev, then died. Wont run no more!!! LOL!! I don't even think the anti back fire air diaphragm valve could be a reason for that much chaotic symptoms. It has to be a CDI or Pulse Generator.

I just finished taking a bank of 4 carbs off of the 400 four ss 2 or 3 times but that aint nothing, I had to bench test the fuel levels over 20 times, that means I took them apart that many times. To fix the old fuel needle jet float sticking stock thing!! That almost put me into lock down psychotic ward. Took a month.Fun times working on these relics!

[Terry in Australia]

The XR's were not "street legal" over here, but Henry (RIP ) managed to get his '79 he bought brand new registered in AZ by adding some tiny trailer marking lights for turn signals and mirrors. When he moved back to CA, he got pulled over, and the cop told him the headlight was too small, the signals were too small and too close together, etc, so he never tried to apply for a CA reg. If I'm not mistaken, the '79-82 year XR's have an AC lighting system?
The FT has an electric starter, but it's certainly not one of Honda's best designs; in fact, it's piss poor. Still, it works about 3 times out of 5 when the button is pressed, and I've gotten a bit spoiled.  

Yeah, I was surprised that my XR had apparently previously been registered Scott, there was an old number plate on it, but when I did an online search of that registration mumber, nothing came up, so it may have been registered, or a PO may have just put a number plate on it which is pretty common, I used to take the number plate off my registered bike and put it on whatever I wanted to ride, assuming that most cops wouldn't know a Honda from a Harley.........

I don't know much about the 79-82 XR's, maybe redline knows? Mine's a 1983 model and I think his is a 1984 model, but I don't think there was much difference between them, if any? I know that the 83/84 models were totally different from the earlier models. That's a pity about the FT's electric starter design, it's a pretty common with big singles and big twins, especially if they don't run a big battery. Cheers, Terry.

[Redline it]

I understand the XR500R 84' has the go ahead or option to convert to street legal in CA, adding brake lights and turn signals. And not to short cut any safety resources but in a pinch at a DMV visual inspection when things aren't working as planned and time is pressing to get it licensed..from experience, usually an elderly lady will come out to verify the safety features, if you have to, a toggle swith on the bars activating a  D or Double A Battery flashlight bulb AKA brake, or turn light works great, the say "ok, hit the brakes." And just toggle the on button when your pressing the brakes, "are they on?"  "Yes, they're looking good!"