Topic: Tapered Steering Bearings Thread

[bill440cars]

Damn scary eh, it's also probably in the archives here somewhere too but I always believe that more information is better than less.

         Nice job on the bearing install instructions. I've seen some writeups on them before, but don't recall the info given. You seem to come across quite well with how it should be done and should prove very helpful.

                             Take care, Bill

[flyin_]

Nice detailed write up.  I just did this job last winter.  Somthing else to consider is how much hot and cold effect this job.  If you put the races in the freezer and heat the stem (even with a hair dryer)  the job is much easier. 

[dagersh]

Great Write Up Hush!

Worthy of an FAQ Sticky!

Gersh

[Hush]

Damn I should have thought about putting the stem in the freezer and warming the race up, ah well something new every day eh.

[bill440cars]

Damn I should have thought about putting the stem in the freezer and warming the race up, ah well something new every day eh.

           Oh well, at last you got the ideas in. And, if you do another, you could add that to the instructions at that time.  

[Hush]

Yup but how do I stop this getting burried?

[manjisann]

Thanks a ton!!! Like you said, the instructions were practically nill. Instead of going to the manufacturers website, I decided to try here first just knowing someone would answer my questions  This forum rules, and so do you!!

Thanks,
Brandon

[JerryRice]

What's up people!
I am changing my top tripple tree. While I got everything apart.. I was thinking.

Should I change my steering bearing to the teppered kind?
Do I even need to bother? Whats the point?

Would you do it while you have everything apart..or it is not even needed. My steering feels fine.

Please let me know your opinion.

Thanks!

[Steve F]

If your upper and lower ball races aren't dimpled (not likely) you should be fine with re-lubricating everything and reassembling.  Otherwise you could try to find original ball bearing races or replace them with far superior tapered bearings.  BTW, (at least on a 750) the ball diameters are different top-to bottom.

[mustangcar]

are the ball diameters different on the k8? i didn't notice that when i repacked and cleaned them,steering is fine with the balls,Ijust took out the bike a few days ago after a complete frame resto tear down,the bike runs GREAT!!!!!!!

[Hush]

If your bike is 30 years old and the bearings have never been replaced and you have it all apart then might as well do it.
The way to test them is put bike on centre stand and see if there is a bias in either direction when the front wheel is off the ground, if the steering likes to self centre then they need replacement even if you think they feel fine.

[mystic_1]

Tapered steering bearings..why??

Because they make me look cool.   










Just kidding, tapered roller bearings are stronger than the loose ball bearings that came stock in the steering head, and they won't wear as fast, meaning adjustment is needed less frequently.  Even if your existing bearings seem ok, you will notice a difference in the feel if you upgrade the bearings.  For the small cost and effort involved, you should definitely go ahead and do it now since you have everything apart already.

mystic_1

[JerryRice]

Hush, My steering goes to the left.

I assumes self centering would mean its OK.

But you are saying the opposite.

You are saying it should go left or right vs stay centered?

[mystic_1]

Well, the manuals describe the test like this:

Prop up the front of the bike, so that the front wheel is off the ground, and center the bars.  Now, bump one side or the other of the bars.  The front end should fall all the way to the steering stop on that side smoothly.  Now repeat the test in the other direction.  You want smooth action with no binding in both directions.

Also, if the steering feels "notchy" or tends to want to "snap" into place in the centermost position, the bearings need to be replaced.

mystic_1

[rhinoracer]

  BTW, (at least on a 750) the ball diameters are different top-to bottom.

  I needlessly banged my head on the wall ('cause I just replaced mine with 1/4" bb's top and bottom) before verifying your quote. The Honda parts direct diagram shows 1/4" balls top and bottom, whew, I'm fine! Although the race and cup radius does seem made for larger ball bearings.

[rhos1355]

BTW, (at least on a 750) the ball diameters are different top-to bottom.

Boy, I really, really hope your information is wrong there, Steve. Because it didn't say so on the parts manual or the maintainance manual. (ok, ok, I didn't really look)

[Steve F]

BTW, (at least on a 750) the ball diameters are different top-to bottom.

Boy, I really, really hope your information is wrong there, Steve. Because it didn't say so on the parts manual or the maintainance manual. (ok, ok, I didn't really look)

My book states that there 19 balls on the lower, and 18 upper.  I distinctly remember after measuring them there are two sizes.
There are different part numbers for upper and lower bearing parts, according to the parts fische:
RACE, STEERING LOWER BALL-50302-268-000
RACE, STEERING LOWER-50302-268-010
RACE, STEERING LOWER BALL-50302-268-305

RACE, STEERING TOP BALL 50301-268-000
RACE, STEERING TOP BAL-50301-268-010
RACE, STEERING UPPER BALL-50301-268-305

RACE, STEERING LOWER CONE-53212-250-000
RACE, STEERING LOWER CONE-53212-250-010
RACE, STEERING-53212-250-305

RACE, STEERING TOP CONE-53211-268-000
RACE, STEERING TOP CONE-53211-268-010
RACE, STEERING UPPPER CONE-53211-268-305

I'm not sure why there are 3 different numbers for the 4 basic items, perhaps upgrades or changes, or perhaps as a "set" (-305) ?

[333]

Here's the real reason why rollers are better.  Each ball bearing has a single point of contact on the race.  Over time a dent in the race will occur at the place where the bike is going (steered(SP?))straight.  A roller bearing spreads out that contact patch the entire length of each roller.

[rhos1355]

I've just checked my parts book and it states the folowing

96211-08000  Ball, steel, RB8 (1/4")       37 pieces for K0,K1 and K2

Phew, I was crapping bricks there.

[nippon]

Because I hate searching the balls on the floor after disassembling.
Go for the tappered ones, they are stronger and better than an almost 40 year old
technology.

nippon

[Steve F]

I've just checked my parts book and it states the folowing

96211-08000  Ball, steel, RB8 (1/4")       37 pieces for K0,K1 and K2

Phew, I was crapping bricks there.

That 1/4" description leaves me skeptical.... these bikes are metric after all.  It almost sounds like a compromise.  But anyway, if you can, replace the balls with tapered rollers.  I like 'em.

[voxonda]

I've just checked my parts book and it states the folowing

96211-08000  Ball, steel, RB8 (1/4")       37 pieces for K0,K1 and K2

Phew, I was crapping bricks there.

That 1/4" description leaves me skeptical.... these bikes are metric after all.  It almost sounds like a compromise.  But anyway, if you can, replace the balls with tapered rollers.  I like 'em.

It may sound funny, but there are no metric balls!

Cheers.

[333]

Just like rims and tires.  No metric rims, and tires diameter always in inches.

BTW, roller bearings have been around for 40+ years.  They have always been a common upgrade for bikes.  Balls are just cheaper.

[voxonda]

The main reason tapered bearings are used is that these bearings can accept heavier loads, due to the fact that a roll has more contact-area (line) then a ball (point), and accept loads from 2 sides. sorry can't explain better. Goes beyond my english. You also have to have 2 tapered bearings opposit to each other to accept loads from both sides.But there is a downside.................... make sure you adjust them right, or they won't survive either.

Hope it's a bit clearer now, or is it?

cheers, Rob

[Kouros]

I have 74 CB750K4.

What other years match the 74, as I'm having problems finding the 1974? I've found 2 on ebay a 75 and a 79. Should I got with the 75?

Are these a good choice as front Wheel bearings?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=002&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3APIC&viewitem=&item=120303380145&rd=1

Are these a good choice for Tapered Steering?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=016&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&viewitem=&item=260285321523&rd=1

Thanks in Advance.

Kouros