Topic: 78 CB 550K motor rebuild

[MRieck]

How do i search mike reicks profile to pm him

Email is jmrieck2@gmail.com

[AlekStooge]

Hey Alek, I just want to get some definitive answers. For the transmission, did you disassemble the shaft and remove the o-ring in question? You just said you never removed that bearing...I don’t get what makes you think that the #40 o-ring needed replacement.

I haven’t disassembled the tranny shafts, but I assume that o-ring goes between the inner bearing race and the collar that the seal slides on to.

When you reassemble the lower case, be sure the end of the cam chain tensioner sits in it’s little pocket in the lower case. I bet installing the lower case with the oil pan off (which I think has to be done anyway) will be fairly easy to see if the tensioner is in it’s home. Just keep an eye out, but you’ve done this before so you’ll be good.

Correct I never removed that bearing nor do I know how... I bought all new O-rings, seals, gaskets so I figured I'd replace them all. I guess if the old one is still there, then I don't need to worry about it and I could let that one go. I'm just being meticulous, left over engine parts scare me.

Cam tensioner pocket, got it!

[DaveBarbier]

Hey Alek, I just want to get some definitive answers. For the transmission, did you disassemble the shaft and remove the o-ring in question? You just said you never removed that bearing...I don’t get what makes you think that the #40 o-ring needed replacement.

I haven’t disassembled the tranny shafts, but I assume that o-ring goes between the inner bearing race and the collar that the seal slides on to.

When you reassemble the lower case, be sure the end of the cam chain tensioner sits in it’s little pocket in the lower case. I bet installing the lower case with the oil pan off (which I think has to be done anyway) will be fairly easy to see if the tensioner is in it’s home. Just keep an eye out, but you’ve done this before so you’ll be good.

Correct I never removed that bearing nor do I know how... I bought all new O-rings, seals, gaskets so I figured I'd replace them all. I guess if the old one is still there, then I don't need to worry about it and I could let that one go. I'm just being meticulous, left over engine parts scare me.

Cam tensioner pocket, got it!

Ohh ok, I was under the impressi that you forgot to install it after you removed it. I would not worry about disassembling the tranny shaft to get that new o-ring in there. The old one is more than likely fine.

[AlekStooge]

Ok, I got the engine buttoned up again. I didn't really need to open the cases because that O-ring was never taken out but I'm glad I did otherwise I wouldn't have found those pucks. I put those in now using Hondabond, honestly they were still moving around in their places. What could you do.

I'm working on my electrical harness. I'm hijacking my own thread but then again engine won't run without electric. I decided to get quality electrical supplies from vintage connections instead of messing around with aluminum wiring and plastic connectors. I don't know how to utilize some of these supplies. Here is what I have.



I believe those are 2 into 1 bullet connectors, which you'll see in a moment I'll use.

I have these junctions that I want to use for my ground, have all my ground wires connect here through bridges and then one wire to the battery. I was thinking today I can use one of my housing pairs if somehow possible, they take up less space.

I also have the crimping tool and I ordered wiring that will match the stock wiring harness colors (as long as they had those colors) and 3/8 braided electric sleeve.

Here is my harness I drew up. A lot of it is copied off the original. Couple things before taking a look at it.
1. if the color wire wasn't available I used a different one. Like after the headlight fuse I just continued with brown or I just used red instead of red/white from the battery to rec.
2. White is purple, it doesn't show up on paper well.
3. Speedometer and oil pressure switch can be added easily.
4. I did a secret 2 way switch just making the bike harder to start if you're not me
5. I decided to do a 3 way, 6 terminal toggle switch. One side is on headlight/power to coil. Middle is kill. Other side is headlight hi/power to coils. It is rated 25 amp at 12V DC.




I am not sure about the coils wiring color wise. I have a C5 for those of you that didn't see the beginning of this thread. I am using the stock timing curve so blue and brown will be grounded. I know black and white are trigger wires not sure which one is for which coil? Seems like those two replace the stock harness's blue and yellow? Both coils have a black wire coming from the negative. I thought the coils were grounded through the spark plugs? Is the black/white wire the power to coils correct?

[calj737]

Is the black/white wire the power to coils correct?

It is in the stock configuration.

[AlekStooge]

I have my ignition set and I understand all the wires at the module. I am just doing the stock timing curve so brown and blue will be grounded. The coil wires I don't understand. I know the colors won't match the stock coils but I'm afraid I have a different version of the coils than the instruction manual describes since I don't have a yellow wire.

http://www.c5ignitions.com/cycle-manuals.html


Does this connect to the trigger wire from the module? I asked someone at C5 and they said yes, negative goes to trigger leads but it's the weekend so I didn't want to bug them too much.

Is this positive for switched battery power?

What are the two nuts for then?

[DaveBarbier]

Can you post a picture of the whole coil? They must be a newer version than mine. I’m just curious what they look like.

There should be 4 connections. One for each coil and one positive to battery and one to ground.

The coil wire connections on mine are labeled “trigger”. I have the black wire going to the 1/4 coil.

[DaveBarbier]

And I don’t know what the nuts are for, but something tells me you shouldn’t remove them.

[AlekStooge]

And I don’t know what the nuts are for, but something tells me you shouldn’t remove them.

No kidding


Both coil have the black wire going out of the negative. Apparently that goes to the trigger wires at the module. So then where does ground plug into on the coil and the positive power source? It's confusing because there is a positive opening and also a nut that says +.

There should be 4 connections. One for each coil and one positive to battery and one to ground.

The coil wire connections on mine are labeled “trigger”. I have the black wire going to the 1/4 coil.

It sounds like you're describing the wiring at the module not at the coil. Those I get I'm just don't see how things hook up at the coil. If you see the instruction manual I am missing the yellow and red wire. The black also is the ground in the instructions, I am being told it is the trigger wire?

[ruger01]

The 24.5mm oring butts against the bearing and the seal collar slides onto the shaft internal taper against the oring. At least that's how mine came apart and how I interpret the parts fish.

[Little_Phil]

ruger01

The O ring is part 40 it goes between the bearing and the seal. I tore the cases apart and I'm glad I did, I am getting weary of this and just want it to be over.

Yes sorry part 40. It's 24.5mm o/d and slides on the shaft before the bearing. It is to prevent oil from getting between the I/d of the shaft and the area to the splines where the chain drive sprocket fits. You will see that the oil seal metal ring is a separate pressed on part (but not available separately) so in theory could leak here.

Just catching up with this. I explained earlier. Seems it was ignored or forgotten.

[AlekStooge]

Must have missed it. All taken care of now the O-ring was never removed in the first place and the seal has the metal ring in it. I'd say good to go. I'm wiring the bike up now and maping where everything will lay before starting it up.

[AlekStooge]

I was looking around at a couple of things before carrying this thing upstairs. I need to start this thing up it's been two years. I'm waiting for a few bullet terminals to come in to finish the wiring.

1. Is that a really symmetrical dent? I think so.


2. What are 11 and 12 for? I don't ever remember those two just the spring behind the case.
https://www.cmsnl.com/honda-cb550k-1978-usa_model7222/partslist/E++11.html#.XMepYe_sbIU

3. Most importantly. When I put my head cover on the pucks felt loose in their slots..quite a bit. I used Honda bond on them but that didn't seem to help. This was the 2nd time I replaced a couple of them. They fell into the cases and got crushed. I cleaned them out and I'm 99% sure I replaced them again with OEM pucks, because I have a few spares laying around and they are Honda. I don't know what to do I feel if I take the cover off they'll still be loose and if I start the engine up they fall into the cases again. I don't know what to do.

[flatlander]

11 and 12 are inside the hollow "bolt" that holds the oil filter housing in place. that "bolt" is actually a valve that lets oil flow through the filter in the right direction, and those parts are part of the valve mechanism.

the pucks get slightly crushed when you install the cover on the head. when you take the pressure off again by removing the cover, they are loose again. after using the engine, and a few heat cycles, they often get stuck on either the cover or head side.
if they're in the right place, they can't really fall out after installation. do you have a picture of yours, how they sit in the head?

[AlekStooge]

Hmmm I don't remember those. I will have to look for those two then. Edit, oh do you mean the spring and valve is already installed into the bolt like in this one? https://4into1.com/honda-oil-filter-bolt-cb350f-cb650-cb750f/

Makes sense what you're saying. I don't believe I have any photos. I'll check my computer when I'm home. I think I'll fire it up and hope they stick. Maybe they dropped in there when degreeing the cam taking the cover on and off several times.

[flatlander]

yes they're inside that hollow bolt with the holes on the side. that bolt is not just a bolt, it's a valve. and yes it usually comes pre-installed.

and if you are not sure the pucks are placed correctly i'd rather lift the cover and check, and put them in place if needed.

[AlekStooge]

Thank you

[DaveBarbier]

The pucks can’t just “fall” through the holes. The issue isn’t the diameter of the puck but how thick or thin they are to provide a seal. If they are proud from the head surface then they’ll seal fine. Some Hondabond couldn’t hurt though.

[AlekStooge]

I got the engine into the frame. I scratched it a bit.



I decided to use a key ignition switch. My wires running to the coils are 14ga. I noticed the wires running from the fuse to the key and out are 18ga. Will this be alright? How big of a fuse should I use?

[AlekStooge]

I'm finishing up my wiring harness. Instead of grounding the brown and blue wire from my ignition module can I just fold them back and heat shrink them? Also I still don't know about the key ignition switch wire mentioned above?

[DaveBarbier]

For the C5? Aren’t those wires for the rotary switch to choose which ignition curve you want? If it says to ground those wires then you can’t just not ground them.

[AlekStooge]

I ended up grounding those. I did the key through the module power wire instead of the power to coils. Those have a separate switch as a kill switch. I'm putting a 5 amp fuse for the kill switch. I read that is enough for coils. I know coils are measured in ohms, I don't really understand that.

I pulled the ignition wire from the boots on the plug side. It doesn't look like anything ripped, so do I just press it back in?

[DaveBarbier]

Just to let you know, Paul from C5 is very adamant that the whole system be wired exactly as he shows in the diagram. I can’t tell if you’re straying from that. I can’t really remember the exact wiring. And I don’t know about the key switch thing or fuse, I don’t have one of them installed. Hope someone else can chime in!

As for the plug wire, I don’t know because I haven’t removed them, I don’t think... if the inside of the boot had the typical screw then yeah, just push and twist them on. If it has some sort of “permanent” connection then it might have to be stripped back and recrimped. I’d bet it has the normal screw terminal.

[AlekStooge]

No, I'm not straying from it. I grounded the brown and blue wire, I just thought for some reason that you can heat shrink them if your not using it. The key switch just shuts power on/off to the module that's all.

I believe what you said about the plug wire is correct.

[DaveBarbier]

The manual that comes with the ignition should show which wires you need to ground and which you need to tape up to get the #1 advance curve. The other curves are more for carrying a load/passengers.