Author Topic: Worn drive flange (sprocket carrier) CB500-CB550 with pictures (Read 11227 times)

Deltarider · « **Reply #25 on:** September 10, 2015, 03:23:39 AM »

Quote

Thanks for taking the time to post

Thank you for your reaction. I was about to update. I now have a (secondhand acquired) sprocket carrier (drive flange in Hondaspeak) assembled as my original was severely worn. I can't say the sprocket carrier is even but the man who put it on said this is because of the rubbers. I have my doubts but the situation is not as bad as before. Maybe other CB500/550 owners can chime in and report on theirs. I discussed this issue with some SOHC specialists. They agreed the design is poor. For instance you can never balance the rear wheel perfectly with that sprocket carrier in place. I'll see if I can shoot a video.

Puffin · « **Reply #26 on:** September 25, 2015, 09:59:02 PM »

So I pulled my Drive flange off today and saw exactly the same issue as Deltarider showed in his pictures...

Couple of pictures of my Drive Flange and a new one for comparison. You can see the lip around the top which shows how much it has worn

Puffin · « **Reply #27 on:** September 25, 2015, 10:01:52 PM »

Here is what happens when the Drive Flange is this worn....

Guess I'm also on the hunt for a low mileage sprocket carrier. In the meantime I might go and speak to some machine shops and see if they can put a bush or sleeve in there to bring it back up to the original thickness...

Darren Jakal · « **Reply #28 on:** October 21, 2018, 03:15:50 PM »

Quote from: Oddjob on August 08, 2015, 02:04:18 PM

There isn't an O-Ring which fits onto the bearing retainer. No 21 on the parts book goes onto the wheel boss, if you look you'll see the groove for it right next to the area where the rubber dampers go. The other O-Ring goes under the sprocket cover, not exactly sure where it goes as it's been a long while since I removed mine but looking at the parts book it's clear that's the area where it goes. If it went under the bearing retainer I'd have certainly remembered it plus you'd have found it when you removed the retainer the first time, when you changed the wheel bearings.

Bringing this back, as I have some questions about a new-to-me 77 CB550K rear wheel that I'm working on.

Does anyone have a picture that shows where part 20 (o-ring) goes? (I think Oddjob may have mixed up part 020 and 021).

I'm thinking it goes where I indicate on the parts fiche but this bike didn't have an o-ring here (maybe it was what was left of one as it was pretty grunged up).

Anyone know where to get one?

Cheers, dj

754 · « **Reply #29 on:** October 21, 2018, 03:39:59 PM »

Put it in a mill, clock in the register lip for sprocket then clean up the bore.
.030 or more difference, would be ok, but clean it up.
Then make a sleeve or shim it, and use locktite.

Darren Jakal · « **Reply #30 on:** October 21, 2018, 04:11:13 PM »

Hi 754,

Thanks for your response, but I have to say I have no real idea of what you are saying.

I'm wondering about the o-ring (part 020) and where it goes (and where to get one, as they seem to be discontinued).

Maybe you are responding to my questions in my Project Thread, where I was talking about some play in the cush (final) drive. Well I took it apart again and used the retainer to drive the bearing down a bit more and then put it back together. It has tightened up a lot as the retainer is much closer to the final drive flange (part 008). I don't think you want it too tight as there must need to be a bit of room to allow the cush drive to move some as it cushions the engine forces (as I was reading in this thread).

cheers, dj

calj737 · « **Reply #31 on:** October 21, 2018, 06:20:38 PM »

Re: o-ring (#20), you've got it right.

754 · « **Reply #32 on:** October 21, 2018, 06:49:43 PM »

I was describing how to machine it and keep it running straight and true.

Darren Jakal · « **Reply #33 on:** October 21, 2018, 07:14:53 PM »

Great, thanks Cal !

Got it 754 ! This one looks ok for now, but thanks for the info.

dj

Oddjob · « **Reply #34 on:** October 21, 2018, 07:47:47 PM »

Quote from: Darren Jakal on October 21, 2018, 03:15:50 PM

Quote from: Oddjob on August 08, 2015, 02:04:18 PM
There isn't an O-Ring which fits onto the bearing retainer. No 21 on the parts book goes onto the wheel boss, if you look you'll see the groove for it right next to the area where the rubber dampers go. The other O-Ring goes under the sprocket cover, not exactly sure where it goes as it's been a long while since I removed mine but looking at the parts book it's clear that's the area where it goes. If it went under the bearing retainer I'd have certainly remembered it plus you'd have found it when you removed the retainer the first time, when you changed the wheel bearings.

Bringing this back, as I have some questions about a new-to-me 77 CB550K rear wheel that I'm working on.

Does anyone have a picture that shows where part 20 (o-ring) goes? (I think Oddjob may have mixed up part 020 and 021).

I'm thinking it goes where I indicate on the parts fiche but this bike didn't have an o-ring here (maybe it was what was left of one as it was pretty grunged up).

Anyone know where to get one?

Cheers, dj

Actually I got the part number correct, in the CB500 parts book the numbers are not the same, part number 21 in that book is the O-Ring your parts book is showing as number 20, as the original thread was primarily about a CB500 cush drive that's why I said number 21. You are correct in saying on your parts book that number 20 would go in the groove on the bearing housing, it's there to stop any grease from leaking out of the bushing back into the hub so it doesn't get onto any braking components. The other O-Ring which goes inside the sprocket side plate is number 22 in the CB500 parts book.

The part you want is 91261-323-000 and is still available from here

https://honda4shop.nl/index.php?cPath=902_147_216_387&language=en

Little_Phil · « **Reply #35 on:** October 22, 2018, 02:04:42 AM »

I think the hub one is 79 x 2.6 and the one behind the sprocket cover 92 x 2.

Oddjob · « **Reply #36 on:** October 22, 2018, 08:33:09 AM »

You are correct Phil, got the part number wrong it's 91261 which I've now altered in my reply.

According to a fellow mechanic who has/had some of those O-Rings they are not the usual type, they are D section not O section rings, most likely the flat part goes to the bottom of the groove.

Darren Jakal · « **Reply #37 on:** October 22, 2018, 09:47:09 AM »

Hey thanks for your reply Oddjob. Sorry about the mixed up numbers, no slight intended. But I'm getting to understand these rear hubs much better from researching here.

These threads have been useful to me:

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=145633.0

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,166620.25.html

And these picture are pretty useful also.

dj

bryanj · « **Reply #38 on:** October 22, 2018, 11:56:59 AM »

Oddjob is correct about it being a "D" ring and i was the one with a few nos ones. I could post one but to get it to the US from UK would cost a bit.

shads · « **Reply #39 on:** October 22, 2018, 01:47:14 PM »

Yeah you are correct about the location of the D Ring and part number is 91261323000. I thought I got one from CMSNL, but doesnt appear to be in stock any longer. Here's a picture from my recently rebuilt 77 550K rear wheel.

Darren Jakal · « **Reply #40 on:** October 22, 2018, 06:38:26 PM »

Thanks for your replies Shads and Bryan.

How much could something like this D-ring weigh? I was looking at postage from UK to Canada and it seems pretty reasonable, as you could probably just put it in an envelope. (from what I saw on-line Non-standard and up to 100 Grams is like £1.79)

It may be too much of a bother, but how much would you want for one of the D-rings, Bryan? Of course a bit for you troubles.

Cheers if it's not be be, Darren

bryanj · « **Reply #41 on:** October 23, 2018, 08:35:44 AM »

I have just got out of hospital after a stage1 MI and a stent so if you want it quickly it isnt going to happen, but i will look for them and find out what i paid, i think i also had the one that goes under the tin outer cover. PM me your details and i will see what i can do.

Darren Jakal · « **Reply #42 on:** October 23, 2018, 09:46:54 AM »

Hey Bryan,

I think I sent you a PM (first time so not sure if it worked, let me know if you didn't get one from me).

Sorry to hear about the hospital visit.

cheers, dj

Darren Jakal · « **Reply #43 on:** October 24, 2018, 08:33:04 PM »

Sorry to keep working this old thread, but it may be useful to others in the future.

I've cut the spokes and freed the hub and have done some preliminary measurements on where the hub and the drive flange interface. The hub surface is not bad with some variance in outside diameter, but the lowest number I found was 78.68 mm. The drive flange is obviously worn when considering the grease slots and how much is left of them. The biggest inside diameter I found was 81.69mm.

So, looking at the worst case of smallest OD to biggest ID there is 3.01mm difference. I've been looking through the manual for tolerances but have not found any information on this topic. Anyone have any idea of what the new inside diameter should be on the drive flange and the outside diameter for the hub or how much clearance there should be.

I may try Frank's suggestion and clean up the drive flange inside surface and try to make a sleeve. Thanks for the idea Frank !

Any opinion on what to make a sleeve out of?

cheers, dj

edit to add: here is a interesting thread with repairs by a member called Franky:

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=84537.0

Darren Jakal · « **Reply #44 on:** October 26, 2018, 09:18:34 AM »

Gonna bump this as my last post may have given the impression that I sleeved the flange drive. That's a pic from a member named Franky.

Anyone have any idea of what the new inside diameter should be on the drive flange and the outside diameter for the hub or how much clearance there should be.

Cheers, dj

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Author Topic: Worn drive flange (sprocket carrier) CB500-CB550 with pictures (Read 11227 times)