Author Topic: how many guys interested in buying Viton X-rings for 500,550,650 cylinder head? (Read 3950 times)

motorhead55 · « **on:** February 24, 2009, 04:56:36 PM »

I have been searching for some "X-rings" to substitute for the standard orings that always leak between the cylinder and head. They are round like an oring but the cross section is better. GOOGLE "X-rings" and see what I am talking about. kayaker43 mentioned this and I looked them up. I got a quote for $100.00 for 100 pieces. The material is VITON. That is their minimum. I would be interested in splitting the costs with 4-10 guys. NO mark-up! Just pay your EQUAL precentage and postage. Maybe I am crazy but I don't want to pull tha head off again just because it is leaking oil.

aussie · « **Reply #1 on:** February 24, 2009, 05:03:39 PM »

I would be interested ,if you were ok with shipping them to Australia.

SteveD CB500F · « **Reply #2 on:** February 25, 2009, 01:08:36 AM »

Me too.

+ shipping to UK.

bryanj · « **Reply #3 on:** February 25, 2009, 02:16:34 AM »

How about the Base ones as well, they are 11 x 2.5 ( head should be 5 x 2.4) If you can get both I would have 10 of each

jreich · « **Reply #4 on:** February 25, 2009, 05:18:44 AM »

Those look great...I'll throw in for the total amount once we see how many guys/gals are interested

cheers
JD

hymodyne · « **Reply #5 on:** February 25, 2009, 05:33:10 AM »

count me in for two full engine sets

hym

Soos · « **Reply #6 on:** February 25, 2009, 06:10:58 AM »

A buck a o-ring?
But to try something new... priceless.
Fixing the frigging persistent oil weep... again priceless.

Count me in.

PM sent.

l8r

psykod · « **Reply #7 on:** February 25, 2009, 07:59:13 AM »

You can add me to the list for 4 as well.

fastbroshi · « **Reply #8 on:** February 25, 2009, 09:35:18 AM »

Put me down for 4 as well.

motorhead55 · « **Reply #9 on:** February 25, 2009, 02:56:18 PM »

OK....I have been researching this and another member suggested finding the lower orings also. These are the ones that are between the case and cylinder and seal the oil restrictors. I found them in McMaster-Carr online catalogue. www.Mcmastercarr.com I am still researching the cyl to cyl head ones. The BOTTOM X-rings or Quad rings as they are also known, the ones between the case and cylinder are a Mcmaster-Carr part number "6540K135" They are a direct size replacement. $12.50 for a pack of 25. These are Viton material. I will probably buy a pack of these for me.
I am going to contact a place on the east coast tomorrow(I am WEST coast). They specialize in METRIC orings, seals, ect. I will give him the dimensions of the upper o-ring. I will report back when I get an answer. Chris

jreich · « **Reply #10 on:** February 25, 2009, 03:44:00 PM »

Thanks for doing the footwork on this Chris!

JD

Quartza · « **Reply #11 on:** February 25, 2009, 05:10:19 PM »

you can put me down for a set. Thanks,

CBJoe · « **Reply #12 on:** February 25, 2009, 05:17:37 PM »

You can put me down for two sets as well.

Joe

kayaker43 · « **Reply #13 on:** February 25, 2009, 05:52:04 PM »

I did suggest X-rings as a possible improvement but can't say from experience whether they really work better. Think of it as an experiment and not a proven fact. I did try harder durometer o-rings but they leaked too.

Why is it some engines never have a problem while others can never be sealed? I would like to find the differences,.. is it depth of counterbore, surface finish, different head gasket crush, warped head?

The X-rings seem like a good try but their benefits might be more for aplications that need to seal while rotating or sliding?

motorhead55 · « **Reply #14 on:** February 25, 2009, 07:40:29 PM »

Quote from: kayaker43 on February 25, 2009, 05:52:04 PM

I did suggest X-rings as a possible improvement but can't say from experience whether they really work better. Think of it as an experiment and not a proven fact. I did try harder durometer o-rings but they leaked too.

Why is it some engines never have a problem while others can never be sealed? I would like to find the differences,.. is it depth of counterbore, surface finish, different head gasket crush, warped head?

The X-rings seem like a good try but their benefits might be more for aplications that need to seal while rotating or sliding?

kayaker43. Well...You know if they DON'T work...ALL of us are coming to your house and moon you on your front lawn!!!

No really, I appreciate the idea. I didn't know that they even existed. They look like a much better way to go. I personally am going to take a chance and try them. Most all of us know how the O-rings work...NOT VERY WELL!
Buying my bike new, I had them retorque the head when they started to seep within the warranty period. It lasted for several years but I put it away 3 years ago when it really started to leak. And mind you, I ONLY have 9800 miles on my bike.
ONE thing I did have done was I had my head VERY fine cut surfaced. It came back looking like a mirror.
The SAE equivalent o-ring or x-ring cross section IS .0046" thicker. 2.5mm= .0984". 3/32= .103"

motorhead55 · « **Reply #15 on:** February 25, 2009, 09:42:56 PM »

I received a set of Quad/X-rings yesterday. I ordered one set larger (#107)than the 106's that are a bit smaller dimension than the stock orings. I am going to go with the larger and take the cylinder to a machinist friend that has a mill. We are going to open the recess in the top of the cylinder about 10 thousandths in diameter, a 13/32 mill cutter is perfect. Here are some pics of the Quad rings and the supplier. I paid about $25.00 delivered. It would be $6.00 less if I didn't order the smaller quad rings. The smaller fit but the OD is about .007" smaller and the ID id as well. I also bought the bottom ones from them as well because they are a #70 DURO hardness instead of #75 (harder) like the ones I bought from Mcmaster-carr.
I think this should solve the leakage problem...I am willing to try it
The second pic is the smaller quad ring. The third is the larger installed but the cylinder hasn't been opened up yet. It fit too tight. The 4th and 5th is the 11mm one for the cylinder base. It fit PERFECT! Use the part numbers in the pics if you want to order them.

Here is their website www.smallparts.com

motorhead55 · « **Reply #16 on:** March 13, 2009, 11:44:20 AM »

Check the previous post

77honda · « **Reply #17 on:** March 14, 2009, 03:04:45 AM »

**Note**
We use viton o rings on some equipment at work and had a safety warning that if the material is subject to high temp around 300 deg c it degrades and produces hydrogen fluoride and if mixed with water produces hydrofluoric acid which is very nasty. We have removed all viton from rotating equipment and only use it in static situations

I doubt if an engine will reach these temps, but if you were using a heating torch to remove parts you should take precautions

Mike

Decapitated Toy · « **Reply #18 on:** May 26, 2009, 12:11:52 AM »

thanks for the heads up and good idea on the x rings... did you have any leakage or did they work fine?

motorhead55 · « **Reply #19 on:** May 26, 2009, 08:00:14 AM »

I haven't started my engine yet. I need to go through my carbs still. I have been so busy with car work and working on my Dodge pickup that It is sidelined right now.

kayaker43 · « **Reply #20 on:** May 26, 2009, 04:31:07 PM »

I haven't been checking in often but would like a couple sets if that deal is still going?

If I build a race motor, I'll go with external lines but I hate weepy street motors.

Doug

motorhead55 · « **Reply #21 on:** May 26, 2009, 07:17:38 PM »

I found a place that I was able to buy 5 of one size and the larger ring I was able to buy separately. I will post my results when I get the bike running.

manjisann · « **Reply #22 on:** May 26, 2009, 07:49:36 PM »

Please do!!

Brandon

motorhead55 · « **Reply #23 on:** August 02, 2009, 10:24:37 PM »

IT'S ALIVE!!! I finally got the top-end done, carbs overhauled, ceramic coated the exhaust flanges. So far no leaks from the QUAD RINGS. The Bike runs SWEET! I am very confident that they are going to be a good deal to stop the leaks on the cylinder/cylinder head oil feed.
I also found that before I rebuilt the carbs that they would piddle while the bike was running. I was going to replace the needles and seats but they were about $30.00 EACH. On inspection of them, I discovered that the Orings shrink enough when they are old to let the fuel weep past the orings that seal the seat into the carb. I reused the same, origional, 33 year old needle and seats but put new HONDA oring kits in each carb. NO MORE PIDDLING! I will post some pictures of the bike when I get it cleaned up.

HB-1fan · « **Reply #24 on:** August 03, 2009, 08:53:05 AM »

I had a friend tell me he used "Coppercoat" to coat the o-ring and its seating area and never had a problem after that. It was a cb550 race engine and I have since done this to an 836 engine and still no leaks!!
It comes in a small metal can with a brush in the cap. Permatex brand if I remember, right.
NOT silicone with copper added!!!!!!!!

HB

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Author Topic: how many guys interested in buying Viton X-rings for 500,550,650 cylinder head? (Read 3950 times)

Quartza

Decapitated Toy