Topic: Billet blocks....who will pay...pics added 9/7/09...10/24....2/10

[754]

i have never seen anything other than the RC and the MReick.
 Heard of the Japauto, only on here..

 Anyone know if Japauto ever sold blocks alone to the public??

[Retro Rocket]

Try asking Rob {Voxonda} he has one on one of his bikes..

Mick

[Big Jay]

I believe Weisco and MTC made big blocks for the old cb750's for a short time.   

Only twin cams.

[voxonda]

Yes, Japauto did sell to the public. And they are cast items. Block is a beauty, very period rough.
This particular one is brand new.

rob

[nippon]

....some detailed pics of the 1000VX cylinder with pistons.

http://www.classiccyclecity.com/gallery/thumbnails.php?album=54

nippon

[bear]

74mm, is all we can manage with these.

Cheers,
Brian

[bear]

Pic's a bit small. I'm new to this caper, will try again
Cheers,
Brian

[MRieck]

 They are nice but the idea of sleeves kills me.

[BLUE71TURBO]

 BEAR,  Pictures are fine. We just have to left click on them and they blow up to a larger size.   

[H2Eric]

They are nice but the idea of sleeves kills me.

I agree. I had a cast block many years ago and with 1000cc liners in it there was but a weasel's whisker of metal left between them. And guess what, it cracked. Oh dear! Hope you don't suffer the same fate.

Cheers
Eric

[bear]

I agree. I had a cast block many years ago and with 1000cc liners in it there was but a weasel's whisker of metal left between them. And guess what, it cracked. Oh dear! Hope you don't suffer the same fate.

Cheers
Eric
[/quote]

G'day Eric
Our block is a solid sand cast unit. There is no air gap between the cylinders therefor oil leaks and cracking isn't a problem.
As far as a Whisker of metal goes, if you look closely we have actually milled a small amount off the sides of our sleeves to mate them up.
Having said that any damage to the sleeves and the whole unit is a through away.

Cheers,
Brian

[kos]

I'M with Mike on this, Todd Henning with help from Kevin Cameron (of Cycle magazine) and Kenny Augustine showed us the world without sleeves back in mid 1990's! if just to take off 8 pounds of weight off your racer. With added benefit of much nicer bore material and finish and very little bore distortion for better ring seal over many heat ranges.

KOS

[Bill/BentON Racing]

I'M with Mike on this, Todd Henning with help from Kevin Cameron (of Cycle magazine) and Kenny Augustine showed us the world without sleeves back in mid 1990's! if just to take off 8 pounds of weight off your racer. With added benefit of much nicer bore material and finish and very little bore distortion for better ring seal over many heat ranges.

KOS
+1,my APE 1000cc kit will probably sit til I can afford one of Mike's cylinders.Bill

[MRieck]

 I have sold the 6 cylinders I had made. I'm planning a run of 10 in the future as there are several people who want one.

[Bill/BentON Racing]

Cool!Put one on the CB750A tab....tell Sam it was Christmas gift! ,Bill

[Terry in Australia]

They are nice but the idea of sleeves kills me.

I agree. I had a cast block many years ago and with 1000cc liners in it there was but a weasel's whisker of metal left between them. And guess what, it cracked. Oh dear! Hope you don't suffer the same fate.

Cheers
Eric

That's interesting Eric, I've got an RC block at home that's cracked between the sleeves, was yours an RC block as well? The RC block I bought from Michrobi was fine though, and a much better casting all round. I wonder if RC changed the material/casting process due perhaps, to this cracking problem? Cheers, Terry.   

I agree. I had a cast block many years ago and with 1000cc liners in it there was but a weasel's whisker of metal left between them. And guess what, it cracked. Oh dear! Hope you don't suffer the same fate.

Cheers
Eric

G'day Eric
Our block is a solid sand cast unit. There is no air gap between the cylinders therefor oil leaks and cracking isn't a problem.
As far as a Whisker of metal goes, if you look closely we have actually milled a small amount off the sides of our sleeves to mate them up.
Having said that any damage to the sleeves and the whole unit is a through away.

Cheers,
Brian
[/quote]

That's good info Brian, thanks for that mate, I've got a K0 block at home, it's an entirely different casting from the later (K1 on) blocks, I'll have to check it out and see if it's a candidate for a big bore job, what sleeves are you using? Cheers, Terry.

[Retro Rocket]

Hi Terry, would it be possible to Nikasil plate the RC block? What is the size of the blocks bore without the sleeves?

Mick

[Terry in Australia]

Hi Terry, would it be possible to Nikasil plate the RC block? What is the size of the blocks bore without the sleeves?

Mick

Nah, the metal between the sleeves is pretty thin mate, so even if the engine could handle 77.6 mm pistons (the OD of the sleeves) I reckon you could time the life of the engine with a stop watch. You could machine alloy sleeves to fit I suppose, and nikasil coat them, but steel sleeves of similar thickness would be much more durable. Cheers, Terry.

[bear]

G'day Eric
Our block is a solid sand cast unit. There is no air gap between the cylinders therefor oil leaks and cracking isn't a problem.
As far as a Whisker of metal goes, if you look closely we have actually milled a small amount off the sides of our sleeves to mate them up.
Having said that any damage to the sleeves and the whole unit is a through away.

Cheers,
Brian
[/quote]

That's good info Brian, thanks for that mate, I've got a K0 block at home, it's an entirely different casting from the later (K1 on) blocks, I'll have to check it out and see if it's a candidate for a big bore job, what sleeves are you using? Cheers, Terry.
[/quote]


Sorry Terry,

I wasn't referring to a K0 block. An old bloke in Melbourne actually sand cast some solid blanks for us.

Cheers,
Brian

[Terry in Australia]

Sorry Terry,

I wasn't referring to a K0 block. An old bloke in Melbourne actually sand cast some solid blanks for us.

Cheers,
Brian

Aha! And who would this "old bloke in Melbourne" be mate? (and what's his phone number?)

[bear]

Aha! And who would this "old bloke in Melbourne" be mate? (and what's his phone number?)
[/quote]

He was my first father in law and a great old bloke. He had a little foundry in Heidelberg. By the the time I got involved with these things he had been retired for quite awhile.
When I say foundry, it was actually the same size as a single car garage and it was his father that started the business.
The whole setup was at the back of his house.
Anyway to cut a long story short, Max and I where having a cleansing ale on his back veranda on evening and I was winging about our troubles re; big bore motors.
He told me to bring as many old barrels as I could next time I came down and he would see what he could do.
The result was a hand full of solid blanks and they where the ducks guts.(God luv him)
Max passed away a couple of years ago and the block you see is the last one standing, other than one that I gave to a fellow racer.
If we ever get a chance to have a beer I have some great stories to tell about Max.

Cheers,
Brian

[Terry in Australia]

Thanks Brian, it'd be fascinating to hear some stories about an old school pioneer like Max, there's too much emphasis on CNC this and CAD that nowadays, and all those old craftsmen have all but disappeared....... Cheers, Terry.

[H2Eric]

G'day Terry

That old block of mine wasn't an RC job, it was made at a local foundry in Yorkshire, but very much in the style of an RC block. Basically the same, but without the RC logo on it. It took several attemps to get it right as air holes were a problem. It was much cheaper than an RC block of course, but I guess you get what you pay for, but then again maybe not as it appears your RC block cracked in just the same way between the liners. I also had a standard CB750 block with 1000cc MTC pistons and liners in it around the same time, but you could see the liners in places between the fins. I guess that's not such a good idea either. Hind sight is a great thing, but it's never there when you need it.

All the best
Eric

[Terry in Australia]

Thanks Eric, what did you have to do to get one cast? Did you have to make a wooden "buck"? My cuz is having an entire engine and gearbox housing cast for a vintage car and he's making wooden bucks for about 14 different castings, looks like a helluva lot of work, a cylinder block wouldn't be too bad, but I thought, what about a fibreglass or even plaster cast? Cheers, Terry.

[H2Eric]

Thanks Eric, what did you have to do to get one cast? Did you have to make a wooden "buck"? My cuz is having an entire engine and gearbox housing cast for a vintage car and he's making wooden bucks for about 14 different castings, looks like a helluva lot of work, a cylinder block wouldn't be too bad, but I thought, what about a fibreglass or even plaster cast? Cheers, Terry.

Hi Terry

To make the casting a wooden pattern was made first using pieces of plywood cut to the basic shape of the block, but some of the pieces were slightly bigger in order to get the fins. Simply glue them together alternately and bingo there you are. Plenty of filler and sanding is required to get a smooth finish though. It needs to be taller than the standard block of course as the metal casting will shrink as it cools and you will also need to have something to machine off to get two nice flat surfaces top and bottom. The expensive bit was the machining of the casting afterwards. This was all prior to the CNC age I hasten to add.
To save a lot of hassle and get an infinitely better product in the end, I'd put an order in to Mike for one of his billet blocks. I'm expecting the postman to drop by with one in the very near future. Drool!

All the best
Eric