Topic: Can you tell me what cam this is...? added piston pictures..

[BrianAdair]

I have a cam that i plan on installing in my engine, that I picked up from a guy that has a lot of NOS and NOPerformance parts.
I am trying to find who made this cam and what the specs are on it, any help i would greatly appreciate!

[CBJoe]

Might be a resource....

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=37850.0

reference to the K134

Member Big Jay might be a good reference if no one else chimes in. 

Cheers, Joe

[CBJoe]

here's another reference... all seem to point to a Kenny Harmon Cam.   I'm sure someone with more knowledge will chime in.....

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=79832.0

Joe

[BrianAdair]

Thanks Joe!
I did see those post but since those cams had K/H stamped where mine has L I, I know they have the K 134, but didn't know if it would still be the Kenny Harmon cam. I can't find anything on the Satanic mechanic site either.

[754]

Some of the Norris and Kenny Harmon grinds are still done by I thnk Megacycle. Usually use part of the old number,

 I got one lately that is marked on the edge of the cam sprocket flange..

[MidnightLamp]

Some of the Norris and Kenny Harmon grinds are still done by I thnk Megacycle. Usually use part of the old number

This. The K134, D2, C2, CWC are all from the foundry that made the cam blank. From searching, unfortunately, some of the vintage magazine cams were unmarked other than those markings. It looks less intense than a KH Super F (if you look on my post). Those markings are found on KH cams, but may be found on others as well.

Have you looked at satanic mechanic for info?

[754]

 the end stamped number counts, most of those others are batch or date codes.. CWC is the maker of the casting, the cam is made out of.

[BrianAdair]

thanks for the replies guys!                                                                                                                                                               I have searched the satanic mechanic site, I'm just trying to get the specs so I know what the valve lash should be set at?   Also if I should use a degree wheel and dial it in? Or stronger springs, retainers? I was telling the guy that I got it from who is an old drag racer, mechanic shop owner, he he was like "hell no I ran these cams just dropping them in and going, you arent going to tell much of a difference by spending the extra time and money for that crap"                                                I just want it to run right and not have problems....... I bored it over to 64mm pistons, and also wondering about checking for valve to piston clearance....? I plan on doing this but I did have the K7 domed pistons and I'm going back with NOS Rocky S12 64mm flat top pistons, so I don't see that clearance would be an issue, other than I did have the head re surfaced.

[Bill/BentON Racing]

Springs cheap insurance,yes degree if possible,check valve to piston clearance,height above pin may be different,
plus you've surfaced head,if you float those valves(old,weak springs)you could do major damage! Valve lash if not known on non stock cam ....@ .004 or .005.Good Luck,Bill

[BrianAdair]

Springs cheap insurance,yes degree if possible,check valve to piston clearance,height above pin may be different,
plus you've surfaced head,if you float those valves(old,weak springs)you could do major damage! Valve lash if not known on non stock cam ....@ .004 or .005.Good Luck,Bill

                                                                                                                                                                                 Thanks Bill, I was thinking the same thing. One question tho, what do you mean by "pin height"?

[754]

The height from top  of pin to deck of piston, ie top outer edge.. Dont take it for granted, even if you think you are lucky.
   

  Check, check & recheck... the basis for good engine building.. if you miss something, it will be coming apart SOONER and at GREATER Cost..

 You need springs unless its a real mild cam.. you  will have a lot higher rpm range with that cam,,

[Big Jay]

Might be an Engle. Don't remember if they did Honda cams. But LT1 sounds like theirs.

[BrianAdair]

The height from top  of pin to deck of piston, ie top outer edge.. Dont take it for granted, even if you think you are lucky.
   

  Check, check & recheck... the basis for good engine building.. if you miss something, it will be coming apart SOONER and at GREATER Cost..

 You need springs unless its a real mild cam.. you  will have a lot higher rpm range with that cam,,

Ok, so if i understand this correctly, I need to measure the stock piston form the top of the wrist pin hole to the deck of the piston, and then the same on the one I'm going back with and compare the measurements for clearance issues?

If I'm not able to find the make & specs on this cam, and seems I'm not, I have searched the web with every number on this cam, and not finding anything that seems to be it.
How would I find out what it should be dialed in at for opening and closing of the valves, for when I use a degree wheel?

Ok, so heavy springs are a must, what about new retainers....? little spendy  for them, but I think it's cheaper than having to redo the top end again....
I know just looking at cam lobes don't mean much without measuring them, but the guy i got the cam from had a RC 315 cam also and this one compares to be about the same, by looking at them side by side.

Big Jay, you will be my source for these parts, I was looking at your site, and I will be placing a order soon I hope!

Thanks to everyone who has helped with their input!

[754]

Does he want to sell the 315?

  I looked at a 315 today, had most of the same marking you listed from yours. I know some, if not all RC cams were made by Engle. Yes it looks close to yours.

 But as I said before the end one is what counts.
 
 While I have seen Engle ads in old mags, I have not seen a list or specs anywhere.

 Most hotter cams run from .004 -.007ish clearance.. RC 315 and 327 run .012

[BrianAdair]

Does he want to sell the 315?

  I looked at a 315 today, had most of the same marking you listed from yours. I know some, if not all RC cams were made by Engle. Yes it looks close to yours.

 But as I said before the end one is what counts.
 
 While I have seen Engle ads in old mags, I have not seen a list or specs anywhere.

 Most hotter cams run from .004 -.007ish clearance.. RC 315 and 327 run .012

Unfortunately he won't sell it.... I tried getting it first and he was kinda skeptical about it and said "let  me look through all my stuff, I know I have more I might want to sell" 
So the one I have is what he came up with that he was willing to let go of.

Is this valve lash, or piston to valve clearance your talking about?

sorry for so many ignorant questions, but this is my first rodeo.....

[754]

I meant valve lash.
 
You can install a piston  without the oil ring with modeling clay on top, turn the engine a few turns with cam and rockers in that cylinder, then, open up cut clay and measure Can use an old head gasket to do this, dont need full torque on headbolts., can use single(or lighter) spring on the valves

 There is an easier fast method for checking them , but I would not use it on pistons with very little valve touching the piston, unless you are very careful.... invoves putting a dial inicator on the spring collar, then lifting rocker at full lift

[BrianAdair]

I meant valve lash.
 
You can install a piston  without the oil ring with modeling clay on top, turn the engine a few turns with cam and rockers in that cylinder, then, open up cut clay and measure Can use an old head gasket to do this, dont need full torque on headbolts., can use single(or lighter) spring on the valves

 There is an easier fast method for checking them , but I would not use it on pistons with very little valve touching the piston, unless you are very careful.... invoves putting a dial inicator on the spring collar, then lifting rocker at full lift

Thanks man, I had read up on doing the clay method and plan to do that this weekend maybe.
What is a safe distance for valve to piston clearance? I thought I read on here some where no less than .050 ?


EDIT: Just found this on another thread...

Clay is good but is sometimes a #$%* to get a good accurate read. On assembly when you degree the cam and with a degree wheel in place, mount a dial indicator with the pin on the valve spring retainers.  (both in & ex) Check a few degrees before and after TDC when the pistons are closest to the valves. Gingerly pry the valve open until it just kisses the piston and take the readings on the dial indicator. 0.080" exhaust and 0.050" intake is safe.

I'll get some pics of the pistons tomorrow evening, they do have small cut outs for valve clearance.

[BrianAdair]

I measured the pistons tonight, from the top of the pin hole to the top center highest point of the piston deck on both, stock piston, and the ones I'm going back with. The stock pistons are .030 to .036 taller than the Rocky S12 pistons I'm using.
The guy that done my head surfacing and cylinder boring said he took off around .012 to .013 on the head....... I was hoping for around .004 to .006....

What is the ring end gap suppose to be.....? I checked mine tonight and it is .012....

Here are some pics of the pistons, and also one of the stock cam, (on the left side in pic) and the unknown cam on the right.










I was reading on the Satanic Mechanic site, and they say if you don't have the specs on a cam and want to use a degree wheel, to just go off of lobe centers and set I & E to the same distance.......? Aren't some cams offset and not the same on lobe centers for intake and exhaust....?

[a700guy]

definately picking up some duration, I would be curious to know what it measures with a degree wheel, thats pretty frigging visable.

[Big Jay]

I measured the pistons tonight, from the top of the pin hole to the top center highest point of the piston deck on both, stock piston, and the ones I'm going back with. The stock pistons are .030 to .036 taller than the Rocky S12 pistons I'm using.
The guy that done my head surfacing and cylinder boring said he took off around .012 to .013 on the head....... I was hoping for around .004 to .006....

What is the ring end gap suppose to be.....? I checked mine tonight and it is .012....

Here are some pics of the pistons, and also one of the stock cam, (on the left side in pic) and the unknown cam on the right.










I was reading on the Satanic Mechanic site, and they say if you don't have the specs on a cam and want to use a degree wheel, to just go off of lobe centers and set I & E to the same distance.......? Aren't some cams offset and not the same on lobe centers for intake and exhaust....?

Those are old Rocky cycle ( Now Tucker Rocky) S12 pistons. 3 mm oversize stock dome. Don't know if the Honda 350 rings will fit or not.

[BrianAdair]

Those are old Rocky cycle ( Now Tucker Rocky) S12 pistons. 3 mm oversize stock dome. Don't know if the Honda 350 rings will fit or not.

Yes, I was wondering about the 350 rings fitting also, the guy I got these from has a bunch of NOS 350 pistons and rings, I almost got 350 pistons, but would have had to machine them for the dome height, from what I have read.




I'm still looking for some info on this Cam guys
Anyone.......?
Without the specs, if I wanted to degree it, how would I do it?
Thanks for you responses!

[NitroHunter]

My .02
I'd use the Lobe center method. Intake LC is the most sensitive to change so I'd focus on my intake closing number.
Like has already been pointed out here, install and find the LC for int, then repeat for exhaust. Probably both intake and exhaust are ground on the same lobe centers - should be something around 102 - 108 for the ones I've seen.
Find those numbers and go from there.

[754]

If you want to run the cam, you need springs, and will have to cut the pistons.. Soos in Utah can cut them. if you pull them out you can trim the domes a tad.
 
 I dont have a mild cam to trade, only thing I could do is an NOS stock cam to trade for that

[BrianAdair]

Thanks for the tips guys!

Frank,
Yea I was wondering about having to cut them for valve clearance, I know the guy that bored the cylinders told me he could do it also, so I may just take the pistons to him and have them shaved down a bit on the outer edge and also dished out for valves. I have to get springs, and a new cam chain tensioner, so I'm kinda held up on building it anyway now. I still have my stock cam and it's in good shape so if all else fails I can put it back in..