Author Topic: Lacing wheels. Help needed, bordering on being certified crazy!!!!!! (Read 6381 times)

Elvarko · « **on:** January 16, 2017, 09:36:55 PM »

I have studied and studied all of the posts on lacing wheels. I have always had the correct amount of beer and believe patience, but no matter what I do the end result is always the same, WRONG!!!!!!

The pictures show that I have all of the inners in, there are no protruding nuts, yet the outer will not fit? I have loosened all of the spokes so that there is movement in the hub, but for the life of me I cannot get it right.

As an experiment I tried only lacing one side of inners and then put the outers in and still the same issue. I am using the the correct inner and outer spokes

Do I need more beer, easily fixed, more patience, hm could be a problem as have tried multiple times or?

?

Please tell me I have made a dumb mistake!!!!!!

timbo750 · « **Reply #1 on:** January 16, 2017, 09:50:41 PM »

I got some good advice when I did mine and had no issues, use this link and go post number 311 on page 13.

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,126864.msg1721010.html#msg1721010

Elvarko · « **Reply #2 on:** January 17, 2017, 12:17:28 AM »

Thanks Mate, will give it a go.

Terry in Australia · « **Reply #3 on:** January 17, 2017, 12:25:31 AM »

You're obviously thinking too hard, and not drinking anywhere near enough beer mate!

fantino · « **Reply #4 on:** January 17, 2017, 12:58:13 AM »

The inside spokes should be parallel to each other, not going the opposite directions like you have them. You'll have to switch one side to go the other direction into the appropriately angled holes.

Elvarko · « **Reply #5 on:** January 17, 2017, 01:34:23 AM »

Understand about drinking more beer but not sure what is meant that the inside spokes should be parallel to each other? On each side. The spokes are parallel but run n the opposite direction to the other side.
About, to crack several stubbies ( beer). Think about then try again tomorrow.

Terry in Australia · « **Reply #6 on:** January 17, 2017, 01:49:46 AM »

Have you got a complete laced wheel there to refer back to mate? What he means is that you've got the pattern wrong. (although it looks lovely after a couple of pints of Peroni..........)

Elvarko · « **Reply #7 on:** January 17, 2017, 01:57:17 AM »

Unfortunately not!! Having had a few drops of the amber fluid am trying again. Understand what you are saying though. Many thanks for the feed back see you on the Nullarbor one day??

fantino · « **Reply #8 on:** January 17, 2017, 01:57:28 AM »

Actually, I thought about it some more and I think my advice may not matter. I'm finding pictures of wheels that are built in both configurations. Having both inner spokes rotated clockwise (or counterclockwise) and vice versa for the outers worked for me.

You may also try shifting all the spokes on one flange of the hub over one hole. They are drilled offset to the holes on the opposite flange and I think depending on which direction you rotate the spokes it does matter whether you are to the right or left of the spoke on the opposing side. See this picture from the interwebs:

http://bikebrewers.com/lace-motorcycle-wheel/

This guide may be helpful and has clear pictures of a fully laced wheel.

fantino · « **Reply #9 on:** January 17, 2017, 02:18:08 AM »

http://www.troubleshooters.com/bicycles/wheelbuilding/index.htm

Found additional conceptual information about wheel building that may help. This is for bicycle wheels, but the same concepts apply. You can ignore some of the information because our rims have dimpled, angled holes that force us into a specific configuration with regard to the valve stem.

Read the section on Hub Polarity and also Symmetric and Asymmetric lacing. Symmetric seems to be generally preferred as it's easier to visualize. This reinforces my belief that you have the spokes one hole off on one side of the hub.

disco · « **Reply #10 on:** January 17, 2017, 02:33:17 AM »

This might help. Your lacing pattern looks OK, but like Fantino said, I think you might be 1 spoke off between left side & right side.

There is normally some spoke indentation left on the hub from previous use. This has always been helpful when I laced up.

Elvarko · « **Reply #11 on:** January 17, 2017, 03:14:15 PM »

Fantino and Disco,

Thanks a lot. I think, knowing which side goes clockwise is the trick. Will have another go later on as last night was another disaster. Many thanks

thirsty 1 · « **Reply #12 on:** January 17, 2017, 05:04:03 PM »

Quote from: Elvarko on January 17, 2017, 03:14:15 PM

Fantino and Disco,

Thanks a lot. I think, knowing which side goes clockwise is the trick. Will have another go later on as last night was another disaster. Many thanks

Some more help on page 2.

http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,127295.0.html

Elvarko · « **Reply #13 on:** January 17, 2017, 10:57:53 PM »

Guys,

I looked at all attachments and copied it to a T But...... Istill get it wrong

Hopefully the pictures will show what I mean. I have counted the 7 holes after lacing the first side. All spokes go in but as you will chaos on the rims. The fist spokes on both sides "box" in the Valve.

jgger · « **Reply #14 on:** January 17, 2017, 11:31:42 PM »

Looking at the pic that Disco posted it looks like all the "inside" spokes go the same direction (they don't cross). Then the "outer" spokes go the opposite direction from the inners and cross 2 spokes.

You could print a copy of that picture then use a high lighter to color with a different color for inners and outers and each side of the hub. That may show you the error of your ways.

754 · « **Reply #15 on:** January 17, 2017, 11:48:16 PM »

Inners cross on some wheels, and go the same way on others.
Harley for example, uses both ways, depends on the year.

So this was mentioned way back, but I think you didnt catch that.
If you got it wrong the spokes wont go in.

I bought an alloy rim, started to lace it to a Honda front hub, and it appears that it was drilled for..."the Other arrangement".

Now I am not sure, some hubs are drilled with spoke holes, offset between the sides of the hub....
Meaning simply that if you were drilling the hub, and you went clear through to the other flange, you would end up in a spot between two spoke holes.
Not certain but some hubs I think could be drilled straight through.
Now I dont know if that determines whether inners cross or not...or its all in the rim drilling..

************************************************************************
Confusing ? You Bet !
So here is what I do before you take a wheel apart. Make a note, whether inners cross or not. Count how many inners an outer crosses, make a note. Check offset and note if there is any. Make a sketch, of a circle, then draw in two adjacent spoke (inner and outer), and the angle they firm in the circle(rim).
Then you should get it on your first try...

Elvarko · « **Reply #16 on:** January 18, 2017, 12:23:32 AM »

All good advice. Will leave for today and try again tomorrow. Many thanks for all of your help. If you are ever in Aus will buy you a beer.

timbo750 · « **Reply #17 on:** January 18, 2017, 12:48:10 AM »

Have you got a photo of the rim before you pulled it apart?

disco · « **Reply #18 on:** January 18, 2017, 03:34:26 AM »

Elvarko,
Start at the valve nipple. Here's some more pics. These are taken from the RH side (speedo side).

The inside spokes on the speedo side(the ones that you thread from outside to the inside of hub) go anti-clockwise when viewed from RH side of bike.

The inside spokes on the disc side go clockwise when viewed from RH side of bike.

The speedo side inside spokes are offset to the hole closest to the front of the bike. Then count 7. See where screwdrivers are in 2nd pic.

Try moving all your speedo side spokes over one hole (in a clockwise direction)

palepainter · « **Reply #19 on:** January 18, 2017, 07:18:58 AM »

Really glad you guys are reviving all this information.

Elvarko · « **Reply #20 on:** January 18, 2017, 04:16:20 PM »

Unfortunately no picture of any value of the rim before it was stripped.
Disco, those photos help a lot. I think my challenge is when I flip the wheel to start the second run I get the starting point wrong. Your description should help me fix that. Will start again later on. Hopefully with pictures of a properly spoked wheel!!!!!

thirsty 1 · « **Reply #21 on:** January 18, 2017, 09:32:06 PM »

You need to set the out to in spokes first and in the same direction. see page 2 in the link I posted. It spells it out plain as day.

go here:
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,127295.25.html

disco · « **Reply #22 on:** January 19, 2017, 12:52:59 AM »

Thirsty,
If you look closely at your front wheel 'before' picture you'll see that both the inner & outer spokes are heading in different directions on each side. You've laced them so they're both laying the same way which wasn't how Honda did it.

thirsty 1 · « **Reply #23 on:** January 19, 2017, 07:43:51 AM »

Huh .. apparently there's more than one way to skin a cat. It worked good for me and it still runs true.

. I'm certainly not taking it back apart ! lol

Don R · « **Reply #24 on:** January 19, 2017, 07:59:24 AM »

Look closely at the rim holes, there are ones on each side of center and they angle differently. It's more obvious which hole to use when you can tell which side they angle to, and as mentioned, match the existing marks on the hub. Al innies first, all outties next.

It took me 4 wheels before I could get it right on the first try.

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Author Topic: Lacing wheels. Help needed, bordering on being certified crazy!!!!!! (Read 6381 times)