Topic: Non-running CB550F into (hopefully) just total freaking glory!!

[ZoomyZen]

Ok, so I guess I'll kick off my build thread even though I don't have the bike yet, though I do have photos!!!!  I was going to get it tomorrow but my buddy apparently is attending a knife show in Portland to score some finer cutlery for his kitchen.......................  I actually could not believe he was serious, but he was.   I pick it up ASAP.

This will be, I suppose, a fairly unique build thread as I will simultaneously be learning about the piloting of this contraption and getting my certification from Team Oregon later in the summer.  I have some experience riding in the dirt as well as some experience gliding in the dirt (as in across it) and know, to some extent that the human flesh and bone just fail at inertial dampening when speeds approach true weightlessness.  SO...  This will be a serious venture.  I do have an instinct that forces me to check side mirrors when turning and intersections when crossing so I have that going for me but going against me is an abysmal driving record that consists of many  speeding tickets, so that is something I will definitely need to work on.....      

I was also an avid cyclist in the city so I do have many memories of just how completely stupid people can be, some seem to feel you are fully capable of manipulating the space/time continuum to allow a passage right through the middle of their goddamn vehicle, while looking you right in the eye.  It is UNBELIEVABLE!  It is WAR on the tarmac (or at least defensive positions!)!!!!

But anyhow, about my build:

I am a guitar and effect builder by trade, and got the contraption you see in my avatar in trade for a yet to be built amplifier, to be completed before the end of February.  It hasn't run "in a while"; due to "electrical issues", and the front brake is locked.  A friend of a friend got it for free from a woman whose husband bailed, and left the bike.  She gave it to my buddy's friend for free (let's try not to speculate on THAT whole relationship dynamic), he gave it to my buddy in trade for two amps, and he traded it to me for one amp!!!!  What a steal eh!?!  haha....  Here are more photos:















SO, as you can see it is a CB550F in decent condition.  I am beside myself with joy and mojo.  

Initial question:  What should I do when I get it?  Try and figure out the electrical and get the engine at least moderately functional (for reference, IE, to know that it runs) or just take the thing apart?  

[Greggo]

From what I've read echoed by other posters, it's much better to get it running before a tear down just to know that it runs before you take the time to put it back together...Also hear you should clean it before the tear down, too.

[ZoomyZen]

From what I've read echoed by other posters, it's much better to get it running before a tear down just to know that it runs before you take the time to put it back together...Also hear you should clean it before the tear down, too.

Cool.   That definitely makes sense.

[Greggo]

Also, if you search for 'stuck caliper', you will find many tips for freeing it.  If I remember correctly, this is also easier to fix if it's still on the bike.

It sounds like you have an appreciation for proper riding gear, so I'd say you're miles ahead of many when it comes to staying safe.  I'm a new(ish) rider myself, and I don't hop on the bike for a ride without full gear.  Your cycling reflexes will be a big help too.  Though I'm starting to think Cagers have less respect for motorcycles than bicycles.  They at least give you more space on the bicycle...

[Syscrush]

Cool bike, you're going to have a lot of fun with this project.

I was also an avid cyclist in the city so I do have many memories of just how completely stupid people can be, some seem to feel you are fully capable of manipulating the space/time continuum to allow a passage right through the middle of their goddamn vehicle, while looking you right in the eye.  It is UNBELIEVABLE!  It is WAR on the tarmac (or at least defensive positions!)!!!!

I'm an inner-city cyclist and motorcyclist, too, and I hear this idea/attitude a lot from my fellow two-wheelers.

I have to say, though - I really don't think that it's that bad.  We ALL make mistakes and usually it's just that - a mistake.  You know there's been a time when you cut someone off, or squealed your tires because you misjudged something and then had to slam on the brakes or whatever.  And you feel bad about it and remind yourself to pay more attention next time.  Just assume that when someone else makes a mistake that they feel the same way.

What I repeat to myself when someone else causes a near-miss is "no harm, no foul".  It helps me calm down and stay focused on the task at hand - which is getting where I'm going safely.

[wardenerd]

My 550F was much worse and thats the kind of mechanic I am...much worse. Electrical may mean something as simple as unplugged or coroded.  I cleaned all my connections and ran new wire or shrink wrapped the bare spots.  Got it started and have been riding and fixing for 18 months.  These are great bikes and nimble too.  The carbs are beyond my expertise although I tried twice.  Ended up at a shop for rebuild.  money well spent.  How is the tank?  put a filter inline just to be safr.  mine waqs clean but kept shedding stuff that looked like corn.  very bad for needles and seats.

[ZoomyZen]

I have to say, though - I really don't think that it's that bad.  We ALL make mistakes and usually it's just that - a mistake.  You know there's been a time when you cut someone off, or squealed your tires because you misjudged something and then had to slam on the brakes or whatever.  And you feel bad about it and remind yourself to pay more attention next time.  Just assume that when someone else makes a mistake that they feel the same way.

What I repeat to myself when someone else causes a near-miss is "no harm, no foul".  It helps me calm down and stay focused on the task at hand - which is getting where I'm going safely.

Indeed.   Point taken!  Thanks for the comment!

[ZoomyZen]

My 550F was much worse and thats the kind of mechanic I am...much worse. Electrical may mean something as simple as unplugged or coroded.  I cleaned all my connections and ran new wire or shrink wrapped the bare spots.  Got it started and have been riding and fixing for 18 months.  These are great bikes and nimble too.  The carbs are beyond my expertise although I tried twice.  Ended up at a shop for rebuild.  money well spent.  How is the tank?  put a filter inline just to be safr.  mine waqs clean but kept shedding stuff that looked like corn.  very bad for needles and seats.

Thank you for the encouragement! 

I have not see the bike closely yet.  I'm going to a ball game tomorrow, and will try to pick it up Sunday.  Is there a particular compound I can buy to rinse the tank out?

How severe is the danger that the carbs will be gummed up with... just crap (I assume that would depend on whether or not everything was drained, I do not think this was the case though)?   I think the plate said it was last registered in 06.  I would estimate the lowest temp it has seen would be about 20 degrees.... To the best of my knowledge It has been in a garage since it last ran and sits in one right now.

[Greggo]

I have not see the bike closely yet.  I'm going to a ball game tomorrow, and will try to pick it up Sunday.  Is there a particular compound I can buy to rinse the tank out?

How severe is the danger that the carbs will be gummed up with... just crap (I assume that would depend on whether or not everything was drained, I do not think this was the case though)?   I think the plate said it was last registered in 06.  I would estimate the lowest temp it has seen would be about 20 degrees.... To the best of my knowledge It has been in a garage since it last ran and sits in one right now.

If I owned a farm, I'd bet it on those carbs needing a good cleaning, if not a rebuilding, and at the very least a synching for the bike to run well.  Do you know when it ran last?? 

[ZoomyZen]

I have not see the bike closely yet.  I'm going to a ball game tomorrow, and will try to pick it up Sunday.  Is there a particular compound I can buy to rinse the tank out?

How severe is the danger that the carbs will be gummed up with... just crap (I assume that would depend on whether or not everything was drained, I do not think this was the case though)?   I think the plate said it was last registered in 06.  I would estimate the lowest temp it has seen would be about 20 degrees.... To the best of my knowledge It has been in a garage since it last ran and sits in one right now.

If I owned a farm, I'd bet it on those carbs needing a good cleaning, if not a rebuilding, and at the very least a synching for the bike to run well.  Do you know when it ran last?? 

No, I don't.  But I can find out.  My situation is such that running "well" isn't really of great concern, I am in no hurry to get on the road.  I am, however, in a hurry the start on a build that will see every part dissembled down to the last bearing.  My intention is to have an end result that will see me with a bike that is essentially new...  I will probably take a welding class at the local Community College in the near future, and will buy a welder so I can do some modifications to the seat area and anything else I determine to be required (hehe)...  That kind of thing.  Plus it's a skill I desire to have as I'm into boats as well.   

Considering this, would it truly be necessary for me to get it running before I start the tea-rdown?  The engine will be completely rebuilt, as well as the transmission, suspension and electronics. 

[OneWheelDrive]

I'm a cyclist as well and it definitely gives us a leg up on our scanning abilities and defensive skills.  I'm only about a month ahead of you or so and the knowledge that you can't help but gain will probably surprise you.

The carbs should definitely be your first date with your new girl.  There's no way the carbs are clean after 4 years of sitting, the jets can get plugged after several weeks with bad gas.  

There are obviously mixed reviews about carbs being easy or difficult to work on, but as long as you do one at a time (and leave at least one carb intact as a rebuild example) you really can't get into any trouble.  Before you start, buy a rebuild kit that includes gaskets and o-rings, I promise you'll rip and/or break some as you take the set apart.  

Take your time upon disassembly so as not to damage any of the soft brass parts.  Buy a gallon of carb cleaner or Simple Green at home depot and make a 50/50 solution to soak the parts in.  Don't soak any rubber parts you want to salvage in the cleaner.  The great thing about those genius Japanese engineers is they designed much of these bikes so you can't put parts in the wrong spot.  Every piece has it's own place.

While the parts from the first set are soaking, start working on the second set.  Keep organized with muffin trays (not my wife's favorite) or something similar.   Before reassembly, make sure all the jets are clear of debris by blowing compressed air through the pathways.  Those cans of air for cleaning your computer are cheap and work well if you don't have a compressor.  The pathways really are the most important component of the cleaning process.  They can look clean as a whistle on the surface, but a clogged jet will leave you scratching your head when trying to run the bike.

Adjust your float level carefully to spec and put it all back together with your new gaskets.  Spray a bit of WD40 on the inside of the bowls to protect your hard work in the event they end up sitting on the bench for another month or so.

Bench sync the set to ensure that the linkage is engaging each carb evenly.  A vacuum sync will probably be a good move after you reassemble the bike.

Good luck with the bike!  

[ZoomyZen]

I'm a cyclist as well...

...Good luck with the bike!  

Thank you for the great information!  These will serve to be a great reference points/steps for when I begin to learn how the carbs function!!!

By the way, a very interesting point about the methodology of the Japanese engineers!  That truly shows that they went for quality in build not quantity in product for doing things the way you stated requires individual parts for all areas of function!  Very cool!

[wardenerd]

I did not know they played football in Oregon.  oh yeah all those California players coming north.  Will make a friendly wager that Auburn kicks butt in the BCS game.  I am a big Alabama fan but SEC all the way.  We both ride 550's can't be too bad.

[Stev-o]

I would say a good cleaning is the first order of business when you get it home. Gunk Foamy Engine Cleaner works great, get two cans at your local auto parts store.

Why are you planning to rebuild the motor already? These motors can run 30,000+ miles without a rebuild, even more with proper maint.

[ZoomyZen]

SO!!!  I FINALLY got it!  It was about 40 miles over, I was too busy to get it until now!  It's been storming like hell so it got a decent bath on the way home, but tomorrow I'm taking it to the car wash where it will get a good hosing.  Then, back home, unloaded and I start the festivities!!





It came equipped with a nice little rack!



I talked to my buddy and his wife (who are very experienced in all things motorcycle, she is an MMI bike mechanic) and seeing as the electronics are screwed and I plan to rebuild it anyways the consensus was this: It would be pretty pointless to sort the electronics out, along with any problems with the engine that might turn up in an attempt to to get the engine started, only to turn right around and tear it down..  At some point I will take the engine out whole set it aside and start to break the rest of the bike apart to learn how it's constructed and to begin a formulation of what exactly I plan to do with it!  I'm very excited!

[FunJimmy]

Great score and welcome to the group.

These 550’s are quite simple machines and I’m sure you’ll get along just fine pulling it apart and working your way bto the bike of your dreams.
Locating the electrical issues and repairing them will likely happen through the natural process of reassembling the bike as you complete your build.

Now I’d be really impressed if you scored on the chick that passed the bike on to your buddy too. 

Cheers
FJ

[ZoomyZen]

I did not know they played football in Oregon.  oh yeah all those California players coming north.  Will make a friendly wager that Auburn kicks butt in the BCS game.  I am a big Alabama fan but SEC all the way.  We both ride 550's can't be too bad.

I didn't see your post!  Little late to comment on the games eh!?!

[ZoomyZen]

Great score and welcome to the group.

These 550’s are quite simple machines and I’m sure you’ll get along just fine pulling it apart and working your way bto the bike of your dreams.
Locating the electrical issues and repairing them will likely happen through the natural process of reassembling the bike as you complete your build.

Now I’d be really impressed if you scored on the chick that passed the bike on to your buddy too. 

Cheers
FJ

I might have to look into that...  And the ideas are rolling in haha...

[TwoTired]

Before you do ANY work on it either get a clear title or verify that you will get one for certain.

You do NOT need to completely rebuild the engine.  That's a waste of time and money and invites more problems with breakage, stripped bolts, nuts etc.  It probably only looks bad on the outside and is fine inside.  And if the engine IS bad, yo cna get another used one far cheaper than you can rebuild the one you have.

But, if you really want a money pit or parts bike, go ahead and dismantle it. 

It takes very little electrical to make it run.  Two wires actually, and a fully charged battery.

I doubt your gas tank is any good, I can see it is rusting through at the bottom.  Probably that rust went into the carbs.  So, if you must dismantle something start with the carbs.

It makes perfect sense to have it running before going any further.  They are pretty stout engines built by the factory.  Lots of home mechs don't have near the factory expertise/prowess.

Cheers,

[ZoomyZen]

There does appear to be some rust in this photo.  I will examine this closely tomorrow along with taking more detailed photos.

I went out and felt around a bit.  There is no distortion anywhere on the bottom of the tank (relatively flat) that I could determine, while what appears to be rust seems to be confines around a lip that was formed when the sides were joined to the bottom.  This lip appears to have accumulated some rust, it doesn't feel like it has continued into the tank but certainly appears to have done just that in the photo.

[fastbroshi]

   The electrical could be easier than you think.  Get yourself a wiring diagram and compare to what you've got to identify the problem areas, then clean all the connectors and make sure they have a good sturdy connection, likewise for the fuse block.   The only real PITA is if someone ever hooked up the battery cables backwards (or did this while trying to jump start it from a CAT bulldozer, oh no definitely not my bike  ), which can fry a LOT of the harness real quick.  If you check the main ground connections and they look good, you should be in the clear on that note.  If not, get a new harness. 

  Given what they have highlighted on that diagram, it's probably a problem with the starter switch circuits.  You can always work around that to test the starter and check the mechanicals anyway.  Good luck with it all man and we're here if you have any questions.

[TwoTired]

There does appear to be some rust in this photo.  I will examine this closely tomorrow along with taking more detailed photos.

I went out and felt around a bit.  There is no distortion anywhere on the bottom of the tank (relatively flat) that I could determine, while what appears to be rust seems to be confines around a lip that was formed when the sides were joined to the bottom.  This lip appears to have accumulated some rust, it doesn't feel like it has continued into the tank but certainly appears to have done just that in the photo.

That picture shows the tank is rusting from the inside out.  Those are the low points in the tanks where water collects at the bottom.  Water + iron (int the steel) + oxygen = rust conversion.
I have an orange tank, like your blue one, out in the shed that has rusted through in the same way as yours, base pan fine, leaking out the sides near the seems.
I can see that it was already solder patched.  A little vibration and that tank will weep some more.  Plan for it now or be surprised latter.  Did you look inside the tank for rust?

Cheers,

[ZoomyZen]

Damned rain!!!

The detailed examination will have to wait until tomorrow.  I got stuck in my field trying unload the thing (it's kinda heavy!!!)  and have to wait until a buddy can come by tomorrow to lend a hand....and pull my truck out of the mud.  I got stuck driving backwards, up a hill......

In other news, there is definitely solder on the tank.  That is a little disappointing.  I can't open it up because I forgot the key........    I'll probably get it when my friend can find the time to detach himself from this sledding contraption he straps to his feet...

[Greggo]

If it's like 90% of the gas tank 'locks' on these bikes, any similar sized key will work. 

[TwoTired]

If it's like 90% of the gas tank 'locks' on these bikes, any similar sized key will work. 

It is.  There aren't any tumblers for the key slot.  A screwdriver will turn it.