Topic: VFourfreak's extensive research of the 1940 French military campaign

[70CB750]

And there was sinking of the french fleet - time period is quite full of big events.

Foreigners what fought on French side left the continent for French Legion and later transferred to UK to continue the fight, it was a mess and there are many ways to look at it.

[demon78]

Yes it'd be a s.o.b. your superiors would be telling you to surrender and you would be suspicious of the senior officers and strategists because of their major cluster #$%*, so what do you do ? It's not just the ground pounders and the matelot's that are betrayed the airforce was under equipped with obsolete and under gunned A/C anything that was competitive with the german A/C were few and far between, welcome to high command and politicians strategic thinking/religion. Poor sods. Sorry V4 not trying to usurp your thoughts just I used to read a lot of that era and put myself in their boots.
Bill the demon.

[Terry in Australia]

As important as it is for you to enlighten us all about France's part in WW2 Kev, does it really matter?

France has a long history of getting the crap kicked out of it by Britain, Germany, Austria, Russia, etc, so unless you want to write a complete history of how unkind the rest of the world has been to France over the last 1000 years or so, what's the point?

We all love France for French women, crusty French Rolls, Gauloises cigarettes, good coffee, snooty waiters and Marcel Marceau, do we really need to know how brave you think your countrymen were in 1940? Can't we just let it be, and talk about relevant things, like CB750's? Don't dwell in the past Kev, give peace a chance!

[Damfino]

wee, wee....

[Killer Canary]

All that France needed in 1940 was one division of Canadians! 

[LesterPiglet]

I am enjoying expanding my knowledge no matter what anyone else thinks, please carry on.

[dave500]

the french didnt throw grenades,they threw parties?

[Terry in Australia]

I was lucky enough to meet Nancy Wake on a couple of occasions, she was known as the "White Mouse" who organised and lead some 7000 Maquis French Resistance fighters during WW2. Nancy was one fierce biatch, and by 1943, was the Gestapo's most wanted person.

There are many stories about Nancy, but one that stands out was when she discovered that 1 of the women who were travelling with her fighters was apparently spying for the Germans. She told her French male fighters that this woman would have to be executed, but they couldn't bring themselves to kill women, so she just walked up to the woman and shot her dead in front of them.

Even when she was in her 80's, she was a tough old bugger, and could drink a lot of my fellow Commando's under the table. History books are full of the details of various battles between conventional forces in WW2, but I find the "unconventional warfare" stories much more interesting. Cheers, Terry.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nancy_Wake     

[BeSeeingYou]

Wow to think 70CB750 is the PC police in this thread, I think I might be still asleep! 

The only thing that save America's butt in the beginning of WWII was our isolation from the rest of the western world. If we had Germany as a neighbor instead of Canada we would probably would've have suffered the same fate. It took a couple of years for us to get rolling with experienced fighters and military equipment build up. But I'm glad things turned out the way they did

+1
Most Americans probably think the U.S. Armed forces of 1944-5 were the same as the 1939-40 version.  In that earlier time the U.S. Army was 17th in the world in size with a few hundred outdated tanks and 2000 outdated aircraft.  Poorly led and poorly armed they would have had their asses handed to them on a platter by the Germans in 1940. Neither the French, British, Russians, or the Americans were prepared for the modern type of Blitzkrieg land warfare that the Germans introduced.  The Brits were lucky they had the Channel and the RAF to save their bacon in those early days and are the only ones who can stand proud.  I find it hard to fault the French as my own country probably would not have done any better in that time.

[demon78]

Terry she sounds like a blast to hang around with, extremely dangerous but fun.
Bill the demon.

[70CB750]

Wow to think 70CB750 is the PC police in this thread, I think I might be still asleep! 

The only thing that save America's butt in the beginning of WWII was our isolation from the rest of the western world. If we had Germany as a neighbor instead of Canada we would probably would've have suffered the same fate. It took a couple of years for us to get rolling with experienced fighters and military equipment build up. But I'm glad things turned out the way they did

+1
Most Americans probably think the U.S. Armed forces of 1944-5 were the same as the 1939-40 version.  In that earlier time the U.S. Army was 17th in the world in size with a few hundred outdated tanks and 2000 outdated aircraft.  Poorly led and poorly armed they would have had their asses handed to them on a platter by the Germans in 1940. Neither the French, British, Russians, or the Americans were prepared for the modern type of Blitzkrieg land warfare that the Germans introduced.  The Brits were lucky they had the Channel and the RAF to save their bacon in those early days and are the only ones who can stand proud.  I find it hard to fault the French as my own country probably would not have done any better in that time.

Funny thing, if my country did not siht it's pants in 1939, the whole war would develop differently.  In the time of Munich, the Wehrmacht machinery was not that powerful, sure we would get out a$$ kicked, but it is better to go down fighting.

Just venting.

[72 yellow]

Wow to think 70CB750 is the PC police in this thread, I think I might be still asleep! 

The only thing that save America's butt in the beginning of WWII was our isolation from the rest of the western world. If we had Germany as a neighbor instead of Canada we would probably would've have suffered the same fate. It took a couple of years for us to get rolling with experienced fighters and military equipment build up. But I'm glad things turned out the way they did

+1
Most Americans probably think the U.S. Armed forces of 1944-5 were the same as the 1939-40 version.  In that earlier time the U.S. Army was 17th in the world in size with a few hundred outdated tanks and 2000 outdated aircraft.  Poorly led and poorly armed they would have had their asses handed to them on a platter by the Germans in 1940. Neither the French, British, Russians, or the Americans were prepared for the modern type of Blitzkrieg land warfare that the Germans introduced.  The Brits were lucky they had the Channel and the RAF to save their bacon in those early days and are the only ones who can stand proud.  I find it hard to fault the French as my own country probably would not have done any better in that time.

Very true.  Here is a pic of my dad's youngest brother drafted in 1940.  Looks exactly like a doughboy from WWI.  '03 Springfield rifle, same flat helmet and most of the uniform.  He was the first of the 5 brothers to be drafted.  All returned safely.

[Terry in Australia]

Terry she sounds like a blast to hang around with, extremely dangerous but fun.
Bill the demon.

Yeah mate, she was a wicked old bugger, and she had bigger balls than the guys she was working with.

[faux fiddy]

Shall I begin ?

Where? Alsace-Lorraine?  Kolmar Pocket? Worse than the Battle of the Bulge. 12th Armored Division.
http://12tharmoredmuseum.com/

Hey Faux,

while VFour is down the garage trying to dry his manuscript, can I please share a story regarding US artillery in 1945 ? I had the pleasure to work for DuPont in Delaware in 1982. There was a great guy there named Ted who served in the artillery in 1944/1945 , I took lunch with him any time I could such where his stories and anecdotes. Ted related to me a day in April 1945 when they had been lopping shells at the retreating Wehrmacht approaching the river Elbe. Word came over the radio that their shells were now landing on Red Army lines on the other side of the Elbe, they were now that close to each other. Unfortunately, Ted had just loaded the artillery piece with a shell and nobody wanted to extract it, being fused and all. So the officer in charge asked all 5 of them in turn if they personally knew any Russians, to which they all truthfully answered in the negative. So the officer then yanked the cord, launching a shell on to his allies. Maybe it fell harmlessly,or perhaps it killed a few Russians who had survived many years of cruel warfare.

Who knows. War is very horrible.

But I digress. I hear noises from the garage (big echoes due to empty vat) VF may be close to producing a manuscript.

Kev

I'll have to ask about Elbe River. Some of the old timers are still around and cognizant about their service.  I know they had major battles crossing the Zorn River.

[70CB750]

Elbe, or Labe as we say in Czech - the river starts in my country -  was the line where the east and west was supposed to meet.  There were no major battles, being April 1945, end of war and all that.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elbe

They met there the 25th of April my memory says, but don't quote me on that.