Author Topic: You Too Can Respoke A Wheel! (NOW with Parts 1 & 2!!)  (Read 23525 times)

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Offline Jonesy

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You Too Can Respoke A Wheel! (NOW with Parts 1 & 2!!)
« on: March 20, 2007, 04:16:27 pm »
I'm rebuilding the rear wheel on my CB750 and this afternoon all the parts for relacing the wheel had arrived, so I got to it. Here was the wheel before I started:



Before dismantling a spoked wheel with the intention of replacing the spokes, it's a good idea to take many detailed pictures of the wheel at different angles so you have a good feel for how the spokes are layed out. Here's one example pic, with the valve stem hole used as a reference point:



Fast forward to today. The wheel was taken apart, new rim and spokes ordered and the hub cleaned and polished. The replacement wheel bearings will be picked up tomorrow. Gather the hub, spokes and rim on a spacious and well-lit work surface. Make sure your worktop won't scratch the new parts. The large cardboard disc that was strapped to my new rear tire worked nicely here. You will also need a flat screwdriver, a spoke wrench and a bottle of light oil. Lay out the parts in their general positions:



Now, take a look at your spokes. There are 2 different kinds (20 of each for a CB750 Rear in my case), and they are usually packed in separate bags. Note the difference. The spokes with a slight curve at the end are the inner spokes (pictured at the top), and the ones with a more pronounced hook are the outer ones (shown at the bottom):



Also, take a close look at the rim. You will see that the spoke holes are angled either upward or downward, and to the left or right. This is important as this will dictate which spokes go in these holes. (More on this in a minute):



Let's get started. My hub had slight indents in it from the outer spokes, so this helped show the layout. Referencing your pictures you took before disassembly (or another wheel, if you have one), thread the first 10 inner spokes into the hub so the buttons on the end face towards the outer part of the hub. As seen in the "before" pictures, the inner spokes on the sprocket side angled to the left. Look at the holes in the rim and find one that is angled upwards and to the right (so the left-angled spoke will point right to it). Put a spoke through this hole, put a small drop of light oil on the tip of the threads and thread the spoke nipple on 4 turns. Now, the next spoke will fit into the fourth spoke hole in the rim. Here's a pic of the first few:



Repeat the process all the way around. When you complete the first set, it will look like this:



Now, flip the wheel over and do the next set of inner spokes. Once you get them threaded into the hub, make sure they are angled in the appropriate direction and overlapping the first set of spokes on top. This is important as once a few of these are attached to the rim, there won't be enough wiggle room to move the rest of the spokes into the correct position if they are under the existing spokes. See the pic:



As with the first set of spokes, oil and thread on the spoke nipples 4 turns until you've got all the inner spokes on:



Now we move on to the outer spokes. With the wheel on the same side, thread the first set out outer spokes through the hub, with the buttons on the ends now facing inwards. This set of spokes will be angled in the opposite direction as their inner neighbors. Insert the spokes into the correct holes in the rim (those angled in the correct fashion) and install the spoke nipples as before:



When completed, flip the wheel over and install the last set of spokes.



Yay! We've got all the spokes installed:



Now, there is still quite a bit of slack in the spokes. We needed this so we could wiggle the hub around in order to fit the ends of the spokes in their respective holes. Put a dab of oil on the head of each spoke nipple. This will aid in tightening.



Now we take out the slack. Starting at the valve stem hole, tighten each spoke nipple one at a time with a screwdriver a few turns. The key thing is to tighten each spoke the same number of turns. This will get us in the ballpark for truing the wheel later. Keep working all the way around the rim until the spokes are all just tight. Then, go around the wheel again with a spoke wrench and tighten each spoke a quarter turn. This will ready the wheel for truing and the final tensioning.

In Part 2 I will cover my experience truing the wheel (I need the bearings before I can do this). But now, I think I'll kick back and have a beer! (it took longer to type this than it did to do the job, though...)



« Last Edit: March 21, 2007, 05:39:29 pm by Jonesy »
"Every time I start thinking the world is all bad, then I start seeing people out there having a good time on motorcycles; it makes me take another look." -Steve McQueen

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Re: You Too Can Respoke A Wheel! (Part 1)
« Reply #1 on: March 20, 2007, 04:26:07 pm »
Good post Jonesy  :)

Offline 736cc

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Re: You Too Can Respoke A Wheel! (Part 1)
« Reply #2 on: March 20, 2007, 04:40:46 pm »
Wheels make a bike (or car)

Offline Ricky_Racer

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Re: You Too Can Respoke A Wheel! (Part 1)
« Reply #3 on: March 20, 2007, 05:51:36 pm »
 Very, very cool, Jonesy!  I saved the entire page as a pdf file for future use.  Thanks!  RR


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Offline Sam Green Racing

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Re: You Too Can Respoke A Wheel! (Part 1)
« Reply #4 on: March 20, 2007, 06:28:28 pm »
Good thread Danny, with nice clear pictures.

I am normally against do it yourself wheel builders as I am of the oppinion, you are taking your life into your own hands.

I would allways leave it to the experts but in your case, seems like you have done your homework.

Good luck with the build Dan.

Sam.  ;)
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Offline Spikeybike

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Re: You Too Can Respoke A Wheel! (Part 1)
« Reply #5 on: March 20, 2007, 06:38:45 pm »
CMS to the rescue, so what do think of new stamping on the side of the rim (i've got the same wheels)

great post , wish i would have had it a year ago, when i laced mine the first wheel took 2 hours and the second took 20mins
great work

Offline Jonesy

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Re: You Too Can Respoke A Wheel! (Part 1)
« Reply #6 on: March 20, 2007, 06:52:21 pm »
Thanks for the comments, guys.

I am normally against do it yourself wheel builders as I am of the oppinion, you are taking your life into your own hands.

Yes, Sam that can be said for at least a third of the components on a motorcycle... I've built bicycle wheels before, but this is my first MC wheel. I studied up on this so I could do it properly. There was a nice tech article in the VJMC magazine and it provided the general procedures. I added in extra stuff, like checking the overlap of the spokes for the second set (didn't do it the first time and had to take them apart and redo them).  :P

CMS to the rescue, so what do think of new stamping on the side of the rim (i've got the same wheels)

Actually, the rim was purchased from HondaParts-Direct as it was $50 less than dealer price (and one of the last few OE rims left!), so it was a better deal than CMS (would have gotten killed on shipping, too...) I wasn't super happy about all that lettering on the side of the rim, but considering I could still get a new one I guess it's a small concession. I'm mainly trying to dress the bike up and the rear wheel was really rusty. In my case it will work. If I was doing a concours restoration, no way.

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Offline nickjtc

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Re: You Too Can Respoke A Wheel! (Part 1)
« Reply #7 on: March 20, 2007, 09:41:52 pm »
Nicely done. Are we to assume that there is no offset between the hub and the rim in this case?
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Offline Jerry Rxman Griffin aka MuthaF'er

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Re: You Too Can Respoke A Wheel! (Part 1)
« Reply #8 on: March 20, 2007, 10:16:12 pm »
Great job! This needs to be included in Tricks & Tips. The pictures are invaluable for a first timer and your directions make this seem easy.
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Offline CrisPDuk

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Re: You Too Can Respoke A Wheel! (Part 1)
« Reply #9 on: March 20, 2007, 11:45:46 pm »
Great job! This needs to be included in Tricks & Tips. The pictures are invaluable for a first timer and your directions make this seem easy.

I second that nomination ;D

Great post Jonesy 8)


I am normally against do it yourself wheel builders as I am of the opinion, you are taking your life into your own hands.


I fully agree there Sam.  Back in my dim and distant I had a part time job rebuilding battered and worn out mountain bike wheels at my local bike shop, and some of the damage I saw (both human and mechanical) as a result of people doing DIY jobs on them was scary :(
I dread to think of the mess someone could make of themselves if a badly assembled motorbike wheel jammed up or came apart :o
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Offline Sam Green Racing

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Re: You Too Can Respoke A Wheel! (Part 1)
« Reply #10 on: March 21, 2007, 12:04:51 am »
Yes Chrispy, and like Nick metioned, was there any offset on the rim to hub, did Danny check before pulling the wheel apart ?

Sam. ;)
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Offline Raul CB750K1

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Re: You Too Can Respoke A Wheel! (Part 1)
« Reply #11 on: March 21, 2007, 01:11:17 am »
Good work Jonesy! And thanks for taking the time to write the text and post the pictures, I know it takes some time resizing, hosting pictures....

I'm eagerly waiting for the trueing thread. I'll be doing it in some time...



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Offline oldbiker

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Re: You Too Can Respoke A Wheel! (Part 1)
« Reply #12 on: March 21, 2007, 02:48:19 am »
Hi,  Ricky Racer said he saved the whole file as a pdf file.  How do you do this? ???

Offline clarkjh

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Re: You Too Can Respoke A Wheel! (Part 1)
« Reply #13 on: March 21, 2007, 03:13:39 am »
Hi,  Ricky Racer said he saved the whole file as a pdf file.  How do you do this? ???
CutePDF will do it.  Instead of printing the document to a normal printer, print it to the cutepdf, it saves it as a PDF file.  Works really well, we use it at work.  Just Google it for the download.

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Offline Jonesy

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Re: You Too Can Respoke A Wheel! (Part 1)
« Reply #14 on: March 21, 2007, 04:35:35 am »
Nicely done. Are we to assume that there is no offset between the hub and the rim in this case?

I asked around on this and for the rear there is no offset. I heard there is supposed to be offset in the front wheel, but I don't know how much.
Good work Jonesy! And thanks for taking the time to write the text and post the pictures, I know it takes some time resizing, hosting pictures....

I'm eagerly waiting for the trueing thread. I'll be doing it in some time...

Thanks, Raul. My intention was to have this be a potential FAQ item and I looked through the FAQ section on wheels and the only reference to wheel building was a link to hondachopper.com. If we already had something in there I wouldn't have gone to the trouble.

Sam and Crispy, You guys are making me think that if we did put this in the FAQ I ought to add a "Do this at your own risk" disclaimer at the top!
« Last Edit: March 21, 2007, 04:47:56 am by Jonesy »
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Offline Clutch Cargo

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Re: You Too Can Respoke A Wheel! (Part 1)
« Reply #15 on: March 21, 2007, 04:38:46 am »
Jonesy - Great Post!

Where did you get your spokes?  

Parts-n-More has a set for $ 29.00 and that almost seems too reasonable. Buchannan has a set in the $ 84 range that is a bit pricey.

Mike
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Offline Jonesy

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Re: You Too Can Respoke A Wheel! (Part 1)
« Reply #16 on: March 21, 2007, 04:50:13 am »
PartsN'More is where I got mine. They are a good match to the originals. I looked into stainless spokes but they cost as much as the rim!!

OEM Honda spokes list around $2.30 each. That works out to around $92 for the wheel!
« Last Edit: March 21, 2007, 04:54:26 am by Jonesy »
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Offline CrisPDuk

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Re: You Too Can Respoke A Wheel! (Part 1)
« Reply #17 on: March 21, 2007, 05:05:02 am »
Sam and Crispy, You guys are making me think that if we did put this in the FAQ I ought to add a "Do this at your own risk" disclaimer at the top!

Given the tendency of some of your fellow countrymen to err on the side of litigation, I personally would add that disclaimer if I was writing instructions on how to lace shoes, let alone bike wheels ;)
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Re: You Too Can Respoke A Wheel! (Part 1)
« Reply #18 on: March 21, 2007, 06:38:17 am »
Ive been doing them for years and the only difference i do is true the wheel after fitting the first 20 spokes as you are adjusting less of them. Fit the other 20 afterwards and tighten with a final truing
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Offline Master Ted

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Re: You Too Can Respoke A Wheel! (Part 1)
« Reply #19 on: March 21, 2007, 06:46:18 am »
Hey Dan, I had a look at the local spoker guy and his operations... conclusion: I think there is great merit in DIY - for one it's not like the procedure is rocket science and second, no one will care more about doing it right.

Great post!

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Offline KB02

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Re: You Too Can Respoke A Wheel! (Part 1)
« Reply #20 on: March 21, 2007, 07:24:38 am »
Sam and Crispy, You guys are making me think that if we did put this in the FAQ I ought to add a "Do this at your own risk" disclaimer at the top!

Given the tendency of some of your fellow countrymen to err on the side of litigation, I personally would add that disclaimer if I was writing instructions on how to lace shoes, let alone bike wheels ;)

I once read an instruction sheet for a small product (The MUT Enterprises Pin Splitter) and the warning read something like this:
"The misuse of this product, heck even this instruction sheet, could lead to serious injury or even death!! If you one of those people who have no clue on what you are doing with this tool, PLACE THE TOOL ON THE GROUND AND WALK AWAY IMMEDIATELY!!!"

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Offline nickjtc

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Re: You Too Can Respoke A Wheel! (Part 1)
« Reply #21 on: March 21, 2007, 08:07:26 am »
Given the tendency of some of your fellow countrymen to err on the side of litigation, I personally would add that disclaimer if I was writing instructions on how to lace shoes, let alone bike wheels ;)

A sad observation, but true!
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Offline Clutch Cargo

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Re: You Too Can Respoke A Wheel! (Part 1)
« Reply #22 on: March 21, 2007, 11:03:04 am »
"I asked around on this and for the rear there is no offset. I heard there is supposed to be offset in the front wheel, but I don't know how much"

I'm not following this offset comment - can someone explain further?

Mike
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Offline Jonesy

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Re: You Too Can Respoke A Wheel! (Part 1)
« Reply #23 on: March 21, 2007, 12:01:00 pm »
When one refers to rim offset, that means that the rim is not meant to be on-center with the hub. For instance, if the hub had to be mounted slightly off-center (say, to make room for a brake rotor), the spokes on one side would have to be tightened more to pull the rim into the centerline of it's mountings. From what I've seen on the subject, this usually isn't very much.
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Offline OldSchool_IsCool

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Re: You Too Can Respoke A Wheel! (Part 1)
« Reply #24 on: March 21, 2007, 12:14:38 pm »
quote author=CrisPDuk link=topic=19575.msg204349#msg204349 date=1174478702]
Sam and Crispy, You guys are making me think that if we did put this in the FAQ I ought to add a "Do this at your own risk" disclaimer at the top!

Given the tendency of some of your fellow countrymen to err on the side of litigation, I personally would add that disclaimer if I was writing instructions on how to lace shoes, let alone bike wheels ;)
Quote

Jonesy,

The quality of your work and your posts really makes me look like a slacker... think I'm guna SUE!!! :D
« Last Edit: March 21, 2007, 12:31:11 pm by OldSchool_IsCool »
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