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Author Topic: first start after rebuild  (Read 3003 times)

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Offline theslayedsaint

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first start after rebuild
« on: March 16, 2015, 06:56:11 PM »
hello guys,

 So i finally got my engine started today! took a bunch of kicks but started ok..
Have a few questions, first being my engine seemed pretty hot after only running on and off for a few sec, kick kick, throttle and dies then i got it to run with idle only. is that normal? and is there away to make sure that oil is getting in the engine correctly?
ok here comes the real question my rear wheel is not engaging i can hear the gears shifting and when I let it out in 1st i can see the gear move a little bit. My thought is its the clutch plates i had some issues installing them or knowing how many to use. could that cause the issues? if someone says its the gears i may shoot them lol. jk but really. going to post a video just because i'm happy the thing starts! also keep in mind its not moving and yes i know the chain is not right also there is oil on the ground stupid oil filter wasn't on tight enough.
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1974 CB750 custom build cafe racer
-849cc big bore
-Webcam 63a
-APE rods
-4-1 stainless exhaust
-GSXR front end

Offline theslayedsaint

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Re: first start after rebuild
« Reply #1 on: March 16, 2015, 07:04:08 PM »
also forgot to say that i can shift gears without pull clutch also seems like that should also not happen
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1974 CB750 custom build cafe racer
-849cc big bore
-Webcam 63a
-APE rods
-4-1 stainless exhaust
-GSXR front end

Offline theslayedsaint

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Re: first start after rebuild
« Reply #2 on: March 17, 2015, 08:40:48 AM »
Yeah that was my first thought. Any tips on what Im doing wrong? I know that the bike came with 8 metal plates and I only put 7 back in, just don't understand how the i diagrams allow for 8 metal plates. Guess I'll open it up and start trying to figure it out. She's so close to being on the road. Any thoughts on the engine heat?
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1974 CB750 custom build cafe racer
-849cc big bore
-Webcam 63a
-APE rods
-4-1 stainless exhaust
-GSXR front end

Offline Old Scrambler

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Re: first start after rebuild
« Reply #3 on: March 17, 2015, 10:27:20 AM »
Regarding oil circulation............motor running.........flashlight in hand.........check the oil tank to see if foaming oil is building in the tank.......that would be a good sign ;)  Also check the cam-tower by removing one or more of the valve-inspection caps and again.......flashlight in hand.........look for oil flowing onto the camshaft at the journals and from the rockers........

If no positive signs.........drain the sump and drop the oil pump to hand-activate the pump-piston.

regarding heat..........with water-spray bottle........check each pipe to measure heat.  If one is cold or colder than others, check the idle-circuit for fuel.

If your running the motor for extended time, place a window fan to move cool air across the motor.
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Offline theslayedsaint

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Re: first start after rebuild
« Reply #4 on: March 17, 2015, 11:43:38 AM »
Amazing! Great info thanks so much.
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1974 CB750 custom build cafe racer
-849cc big bore
-Webcam 63a
-APE rods
-4-1 stainless exhaust
-GSXR front end

Offline theslayedsaint

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Re: first start after rebuild
« Reply #5 on: March 18, 2015, 12:37:03 AM »
Got a bunch of work done today! Like I posted on a different form looks like it was the clutch cover! Didn't know that was possible but I removed it and then the bike stayed in gear and I coundt move it when it was in 1st and I tried to push it. So After the rest is done I'll test drive it and see what happens.
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1974 CB750 custom build cafe racer
-849cc big bore
-Webcam 63a
-APE rods
-4-1 stainless exhaust
-GSXR front end

Offline theslayedsaint

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Re: first start after rebuild
« Reply #6 on: March 18, 2015, 02:11:25 PM »
So have a strange sound coming from the alternator a "spinning" sound after the engine cuts off any ideas? I'll try and get a video just kind hard to do
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1974 CB750 custom build cafe racer
-849cc big bore
-Webcam 63a
-APE rods
-4-1 stainless exhaust
-GSXR front end

DH

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Re: first start after rebuild
« Reply #7 on: March 18, 2015, 02:31:05 PM »
rotor bolt loose? or starter components still engaged?
« Last Edit: March 18, 2015, 02:33:12 PM by DH »
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Offline theslayedsaint

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Re: first start after rebuild
« Reply #8 on: March 18, 2015, 06:17:07 PM »
Pulled the clutch it looked fine for the hell of it I added the other metal plate that was on the bike when I torn it apart so 8 metal 8 cork. Seems wrong to me but at this point I went with it. So fare it works no test ride yet! However if someone can help me out i swear I'll stop posting! Why when I kick the bike sometimes it wants to kick me off the bike!!! Wtf is going on? And when that happens I get blow back out the air filters? I'm not getting what's going on, when the bike starts it runs and idles ok for not being synced yet.
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1974 CB750 custom build cafe racer
-849cc big bore
-Webcam 63a
-APE rods
-4-1 stainless exhaust
-GSXR front end

Offline scottly

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Re: first start after rebuild
« Reply #9 on: March 18, 2015, 08:52:12 PM »
Quote from: theslayedsaint on March 18, 2015, 02:11:25 PM
So have a strange sound coming from the alternator a "spinning" sound after the engine cuts off any ideas? I'll try and get a video just kind hard to do
Did you remove the starter motor, but leave the starter drive gears under the stator cover in place?
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Don't fix it if it ain't broke!
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Offline theslayedsaint

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Re: first start after rebuild
« Reply #10 on: March 18, 2015, 09:18:18 PM »
Starter motor is still there. Just kicking bike because I can't get my push button to work. This is the worst feeling having it all back together and started but still not sure if it's working right. Keep hearing the spinning sound in the alternator, so guess that's coming off tomorrow! On the up side I went as fast as I could in the garage  :-\
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1974 CB750 custom build cafe racer
-849cc big bore
-Webcam 63a
-APE rods
-4-1 stainless exhaust
-GSXR front end

Offline scottly

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Re: first start after rebuild
« Reply #11 on: March 18, 2015, 09:35:31 PM »
If the starter is installed, the spinning sound might be the alternator rotor spinning on the end of the crankshaft, as DH suggested. Might also explain the metal in the pan?
PS, it doesn't help when you post symptoms on separate threads, when they may be related. ;)   
« Last Edit: March 18, 2015, 09:37:28 PM by scottly »
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Don't fix it if it ain't broke!
Helmets save brains. Always wear one and ride like everyone is trying to kill you....

Offline theslayedsaint

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Re: first start after rebuild
« Reply #12 on: March 18, 2015, 10:09:24 PM »
Yes you are right! And I'm sure everyone is sick of seeing my posts. It's just been that kind of week. I had hoped to have it rideable this weekend so I've been frustrated that things haven't been working out. My apologies to everyone.

Ok so that would make the spinning sound after the engine turns off? I should make a video would do more good. And is that a good thing or a normal thing to have happen? And would that have anything to do with why the kickstater wants to kick back? The strange thing is it only happens when the power is on.
Man am I a newbie at this old bike #$%*! Can't wait to be doing a ton on this bad boy
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1974 CB750 custom build cafe racer
-849cc big bore
-Webcam 63a
-APE rods
-4-1 stainless exhaust
-GSXR front end

Offline theslayedsaint

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Re: first start after rebuild
« Reply #13 on: March 19, 2015, 08:47:09 AM »
come on guys someones got to know if this bucking kickstarter is normal? I don't want to keep kicking it if its messed up.
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1974 CB750 custom build cafe racer
-849cc big bore
-Webcam 63a
-APE rods
-4-1 stainless exhaust
-GSXR front end

Offline ekpent

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Re: first start after rebuild
« Reply #14 on: March 19, 2015, 09:22:46 AM »
Quote from: theslayedsaint on March 19, 2015, 08:47:09 AM
come on guys someones got to know if this bucking kickstarter is normal? I don't want to keep kicking it if its messed up.
If it starts to fire while initially kicking over it may kickback. Ask anybody who has owned a big bore thumper.
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Offline theslayedsaint

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Re: first start after rebuild
« Reply #15 on: March 19, 2015, 10:45:46 AM »
Thank you ekpent!
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1974 CB750 custom build cafe racer
-849cc big bore
-Webcam 63a
-APE rods
-4-1 stainless exhaust
-GSXR front end

Offline DaveBarbier

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Re: first start after rebuild
« Reply #16 on: March 19, 2015, 02:07:41 PM »

Quote from: theslayedsaint on March 19, 2015, 10:45:46 AM
Thank you ekpent!

I've heard that the proper way to kick a bike over is to first find TDC. I don't know how to do that by feel as most of you guys probably do, but that might help with the kickback. And regarding a thumper, there's a thread on here somewhere describing people getting thrown over the handlebars while trying to kickstart a bike...it's not THAT bad, is it Saint?!


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Offline theslayedsaint

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Re: first start after rebuild
« Reply #17 on: March 19, 2015, 04:00:39 PM »
ok,
I pulled the alternator cover and like someone had said the bolt was lose! so i was thinking great maybe this is a easy fix for once! so tightened it up and put it back together, starts right up if i use starter  :)  again i'm thinking this was easy... at that moment it goes back to free spinning and won't turn engine over. so i pulled the cover off and did it again, this time it lasted longer but still spun off! I tried setting the torque at 60ft-lb is that still not enough? seems like a bad set up what if it spins off while I'm ridding? i did read some other posts about this. maybe making sure i don't have oil on the bolt and using lactate thoughts?

DaveBarbier- never heard of the finding TDC thing, but getting thrown off the bike... maybe causing you to get hurt and fall off the bike but i can't see it pushing you off. 
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1974 CB750 custom build cafe racer
-849cc big bore
-Webcam 63a
-APE rods
-4-1 stainless exhaust
-GSXR front end

Offline theslayedsaint

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Re: first start after rebuild
« Reply #18 on: March 19, 2015, 05:59:59 PM »
any thoughts guys? should i just try and tighten it? is there any other reason it would be coming off?
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1974 CB750 custom build cafe racer
-849cc big bore
-Webcam 63a
-APE rods
-4-1 stainless exhaust
-GSXR front end

Offline DaveBarbier

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Re: first start after rebuild
« Reply #19 on: March 19, 2015, 06:16:20 PM »
Since my 550 torque value is max 29lbs, I'd think 60 is too much. The Clymer doesn't say to Loctite the rotor bolt but I think I did when I installed mine, forgot if I used red or blue...probably blue but I'm not sure. But if you Loctite, I think it takes something like 24 hours to set up so don't start it right away.


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1978 Honda CB550K
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Offline scottly

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Re: first start after rebuild
« Reply #20 on: March 19, 2015, 06:17:36 PM »
The rotor is locked to the end of the crank by the taper; the loose rotor spinning on the crank certainly didn't do anything good to the fit. IIRC, the proper torque spec for the bolt is 75 ft/lbs?
The kick back might be caused by advanced ignition timing.
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Don't fix it if it ain't broke!
Helmets save brains. Always wear one and ride like everyone is trying to kill you....

Offline theslayedsaint

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Re: first start after rebuild
« Reply #21 on: March 19, 2015, 06:23:27 PM »
Ok no ide what IIRC stands for? So you think it could have caused more damage even though it wasn't run long like that? Anyone want to take a swing at what they would do next?
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1974 CB750 custom build cafe racer
-849cc big bore
-Webcam 63a
-APE rods
-4-1 stainless exhaust
-GSXR front end

Offline theslayedsaint

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Re: first start after rebuild
« Reply #22 on: March 19, 2015, 06:27:34 PM »
IIRC = If I remember correctly
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1974 CB750 custom build cafe racer
-849cc big bore
-Webcam 63a
-APE rods
-4-1 stainless exhaust
-GSXR front end

Offline scottly

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Re: first start after rebuild
« Reply #23 on: March 19, 2015, 06:29:32 PM »
Pull the rotor off and inspect the tapered bore, and the tapered end of the crankshaft. Pics would help.
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Don't fix it if it ain't broke!
Helmets save brains. Always wear one and ride like everyone is trying to kill you....

Offline BPellerine

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Re: first start after rebuild
« Reply #24 on: March 19, 2015, 06:32:42 PM »
kicking a bike the old way involves kicking the bike slowly over compression then retard the ign and give it a big kick,if you have the timing wrong on an old single or twin it will kick back and really hurt!!! if your bike is kicking back due to timing it must be way advanced cause I run a magneto setup set at full advance and does not kick back,would run hot too.bill
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