Author Topic: Broken cylinder case bolt failed drilling attempt.  (Read 4209 times)

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Offline strynboen

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Re: Broken cylinder case bolt failed drilling attempt.
« Reply #25 on: November 12, 2018, 09:30:31 AM »
 :)
« Last Edit: November 12, 2018, 12:18:32 PM by strynboen »
i kan not speak english/but trying!!
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=60973.0
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=144758.0
i hate all this v-w.... vords

Offline Korven

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Re: Broken cylinder case bolt failed drilling attempt.
« Reply #26 on: November 12, 2018, 10:51:52 AM »
All of that aluminum soldering stuff is junk. I wouldnt use it to fix anything I needed to say fixed. Your best bet would be to use a thread insert or weld the hole up properly and drill/tap. That huge aluminum case will pull heat away too quickly to get the type of heat he was able to manage in the video. Either way, I have used this stuff and its crap.

This is not the same as the ordinary alu solder you get at walmart. insert was first option but when the hole got to large there was only 1.8mm left of aluminium in the hole after the big-sert (that was like 110$ with shipping and import) We heated the block up in a owen to 250C (notice the color on it) and the meltin point of the solder is 380. used propane with oxygen to heat it the rest of the way. it probs took 10mins tho. the solder wasnt cheap either, 30$ and it was just enough to fill that hole and repair that fin.

I don’t think I’d use an aluminum “solder”  to fix threads. They would have no strength for torque beyond a few ft/lbs.

Tensile Strength: More than 78 Newton / mm2
    Hardness: Rockwell B 55-62
    Extension: 4-9% depending on cooling conditions 380ºC
    Breakout Limit: More than 78 Newton / mm2
    Ref: KTH in Stockholm and Linköping University
    Corrosion: Ref: Corrosion test test et. SS. 150 3766, Ref .: 53390/2

applications

    Assembly of aluminum and aluminum alloys of all shapes, including cast and zinc alloys.
    Alutite is able to "build with".
    Alutite can be reprocessed with advantage, for example, drilling and threading.
    Alutite can be reused.
    Alutite is lead- and cadmium-free, thus meeting the requirements for joints that come into contact with food and drinking water.
    Alutite is inoxible. Eloxation and paint must be removed before work.
« Last Edit: November 12, 2018, 11:07:27 AM by Korven »

Offline Korven

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Re: Broken cylinder case bolt failed drilling attempt.
« Reply #27 on: November 12, 2018, 11:38:19 AM »
your bringing up alot of good points. you need to use a screwdriver (or something sharp) to scratch the surfaces once your up in meltingtemp of the solder to remove the oxide layers, thats what the instructions says atleast. not sure if the kind you used had that same instruction order? im aware that its weaker than welding but seemed to torque down just fine to the specified value. this engine is already giving me soars.
« Last Edit: November 12, 2018, 10:59:33 PM by Korven »

Offline Korven

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Re: Broken cylinder case bolt failed drilling attempt.
« Reply #28 on: November 12, 2018, 12:03:49 PM »
I’d be expecting a few more, regrettably. Like expect that stud to pull out the threads and cause an oil leak.

Downsides to solder are presence to heat after curing. Exhaust header, engine operating temp, etc. These will all reduce the strength of that solder, which is already 1/3 the strength of the base metal.

Drill it out, install a helicoil or timesert now and save the headache later. Or, weld it up properly then drill and tap it. Fingers crossed for you-all

Thanks for your opinion
The difference between this solder as I understand is that you use mechanical removal of the oxide instead of normally flush/chemically removal
« Last Edit: November 12, 2018, 12:38:13 PM by Korven »

Offline Korven

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Re: Broken cylinder case bolt failed drilling attempt.
« Reply #29 on: December 08, 2018, 08:28:41 AM »
So made a Test to see how strong this stuff is, the only way you will know for sure is to test it out yourself.
Ape stud installed per instruction. Torqued down to 22LBS or 30nm. Ran it in the owen (spelling?) to simulate a really hot engine at 150c for 3 hours. Turns out it did fine. I know you can never know for sure since a running engine is slightly diffrent from half a case thats heated up. you dont have all those vibrations and pressure within the motor.

It was then torqued slightly beyond the instruction to 26lbs 35NM and ran a couple of hours again. Been sitting for a few days and after that i tore it apart. threads look and feel fine.

As cal said earlier, this is probs nothing you should do with cylinder studs but for repairing holes that have lower torque values it should do fine but use helicoils/bigserts firsthand.

Im temped of trying where the breakage point is of this stuff, just gonna need to get a solid block of aluminium first

« Last Edit: December 08, 2018, 08:40:01 AM by Korven »

Offline PeWe

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Re: Broken cylinder case bolt failed drilling attempt.
« Reply #30 on: December 10, 2018, 08:43:58 AM »
A happy ending!
CB750 K6-76  970cc (Earlier 1005cc JMR Billet block on the shelf waiting for a comeback)
CB750 K2-75 Parts assembled to a stock K2

Updates of the CB750 K6 -1976
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,180468.msg2092136.html#msg2092136
The billet block build thread
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,49438.msg1863571.html#msg1863571
CB750 K2 -1975  build thread
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,168243.msg1948381.html#msg1948381
K2 engine build thread. For a complete CB750 -75
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,180088.msg2088008.html#msg2088008
Carb jetting, a long story Mikuni TMR32
http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,179479.msg2104967.html#msg2104967

Offline DaveBarbier

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Re: Broken cylinder case bolt failed drilling attempt.
« Reply #31 on: December 10, 2018, 09:58:12 AM »
Yeah hopefully it lasts. I’m sure you’ll keep an eye on it weekly or something while you’re riding it. Keep us posted. I’m not about to try this myself but maybe there’s someone willing to risk it in the future, haha.