Topic: The oil thread of all oil threads?!!

[70CB750]

  Just plain old dino oil seems to becoming obsolete.

I’m using Valvoline 20w50 motorcycle, Dino oil, JASO rated, $6 quart at Meijers
but I have seen Valvoline motorcycle full synthetic 20w50 with JASO rating, a few bucks more.
The future is now??

https://sharena21.springcm.com/Public/Document/18452/a3213ab0-e481-e711-9c10-ac162d889bd3/97fca89f-e29c-e711-9c10-ac162d889bd3

Same here, only I get it at Waĺmart.  Use it in 750 and also in the 82 CB900C. 

[grcamna2]

  Just plain old dino oil seems to becoming obsolete.

I’m using Valvoline 20w50 motorcycle, Dino oil, JASO rated, $6 quart at Meijers
but I have seen Valvoline motorcycle full synthetic 20w50 with JASO rating, a few bucks more.
The future is now??

https://sharena21.springcm.com/Public/Document/18452/a3213ab0-e481-e711-9c10-ac162d889bd3/97fca89f-e29c-e711-9c10-ac162d889bd3

Same here, only I get it at Waĺmart.  Use it in 750 and also in the 82 CB900C.

I run the non-synthetic Valvoline 10/40,get it at wallyworld;it was $4.50 a qt less than a year ago,but now.. gone up over a $ per qt.  I use it for Winter and break-in of a fresh engine,then I switch back to the Rotella T4 15/40 during the hot season. I've run Lucas Semi-Synthetic 10/40 ($10+ per qt.) in the past and really enjoy the way it treats my engine.

[grcamna2]

Yes, I'm starting an oil thread!


We all know that Spectro is the best oil, Greg has used it on his 750F and has 250K[?!] trouble free miles for over 40 years!  Is this it?

https://www.amazon.com/Spectro-R-HD25-Heavy-Engine-Oil/dp/B01M7V6TT6?th=1

Time for my annual oil change and with 7 bikes in the garage that need oil, that could get a llittle pricey at $15/quart - 500 bucks?!

My go-to has been the Rotella, can get it now for $16/gallon with free [prime] shipping.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01LH7L0XA/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER&th=1


What is the best oil?! [for the price]    I've experienced two catastrophic engine failures in the last 15 years  [Big Bang Bike & H1] and neither was oil related. So it seems Rotella is doing it's job.

So what do you use??

Stev-o,thanks for starting this 'good ol'e' oil thread 

[PeWe]

I really love oil threads!

It would be nice with tests where the viscosity is tested after some use.
Viscosity is very important for bearings, guides etc.
My CB750 users guide say 20W-50. (10W-40 below +15C).
I wonder if Honda had ambient temp over +30C in their minds?
When is 20W-60 needed?

Another thing is air cooled engine that torture the oil much more than a much cooler water cooled engine.

I have got the impression when reading about oils that most 4T oils are made for water cooled engines.

V-twin oil adapted for hotter running air cooled engines.
The longer stroke in a twin demands an oil with good oil film that can lubricate the longer stroke until next splash of oil. 
Harleys have stroke of 114mm and more while CB750 has 63mm unless stroked a few mm.

The V-twin oils I have and used so far are all designed for gearbox and wet clutch. Spectro, Red Line and Eurol.

CB750 engine design need high oil pressure that later designs of engines do not have.
Viscosity is again a very important factor.

I have read about this on a Porsche forum where people used wrong oils, engines ruined due to too low viscosity.  Good oils used, but too thin. (Engines that had 20W-50 in their spec)

Crank with rods + top end with guides needed higher viscosity oils.

The writer of that post had done a viscosity test of a good oil brands oil and saw it degraded rather quick. I think it was done after only 250km or so. Not much but a significant factor to have in mind.

Modern engines have tighter clearances and different designs so they must get thinner oils so it can be lubricated asap.

EDIT:
I also read about 4T oils to have anti foaming additives to cope with engines revving over 10000 rpm. The crank will whip the oil rather much.

[RAFster122s]

Our gearboxes tend to break down a lot of oils much faster than cars will ever do...
My VStrom has 7000 mile oil changes... And that is on regular dino oils. But here in desert with high heats I am using semi synthetic to get the extreme heat capabilities of the blended oil.
Vstrom is water cooled but still sees some hot temps
Nothing towards overheating on the gauge though. Not sure how well the CB is going to handle the desert when I put it back on the road.
The CX being water cooled will handle it fine.
Stop and go is where the CB will suffer in 100+ heat, just like I do...
The evaporative vest is a godsend in temps over 90-95. 90 and short rides are doable, 95 and above it is too much for me without the cooling vest. At 105 and above I have to stop after 30-45 minutes to add more water as it is starting to dry out. Humidity is that low in our high temps.
That's why you have more than one bike when dealing with vintage bikes...

ProjectFarm on YouTube does viscosity comparisons of oils but is looking at car or truck use, not MC. He is methodical and good in his testing methods using good practices.

[PeWe]

"7000 mile oil change". That will make a really long holiday easier. Around USA or far south

It must be the water cooling that make that possible.
I have changed oil in my CB750's at around 5000km, ca 3000miles.
But it depends on other jobs and rich running carbs.
When carbs are fine I can stretch it to 6000km, 3750 miles.
Semi synth oil or full synthetic.
Back in the 80's I rode to Jugoslavia, Italy and Spain on different vacations. Every ride ca 6000 km.
Back then dino oil. Bike ran rather hard in higher speeds so it took some oil. Has to refill 1/2 liter on the back home.

Live in the heat must make oil to live shorter.

It would be fine with a simple viscosity tester.
A drop (or specified amount) of oil on a flat surface and see how fast and much it will flow.
Room temp as well as direct after a ride.
If there is a simple tool that fulfill oil spec measurements, tests can be done quick at home and see when oil need to be changed. Like 20W-50 oil now act as a 10-40 or thinner.

Like comparing fresh egg with an old egg.
The fresher has thicker viscosity, not flowing as water or close as the bad egg.

A 20W-50 oil is a 20 oil with additives to make it to 50. When additives are worn out, it is a 20 oil.

My car with turbo kill synthetic oil before 10000 km. Mostly 0W-40 synth, not the best synth.
 It feels and look like black oil mixed with white spirit.
Here not very hot temperatures either.

https://www.petro-online.com/news/fuel-for-thought/13/breaking-news/how-to-test-oil-viscosity/31399

https://www.azom.com/article.aspx?ArticleID=12878

I need a simple tool like a tube where I can fill with oil direct after a ride. Turn tube around and take time or similar.

I have a dip stick with thermometer for CB750 so temp can be part of the calculation.
Data like temp vs how quick oil flows is needed.

Possible to make tests direct after a change direct after a ride at every 1000km or so to see how it degrades.
 When too bad another detail to determine.

Oil temp must reach at least >100C to get condense water out.

[ekpent]

As for my bargain hunting I mentioned earlier I bought this 5qt never opened jug of 5-30 full synthetic oil Saturday at a church sale for 3 bucks.  My wife's car takes that stuff so there is a very cheap oil change in her future. 

[PeWe]

Never wrong to buy oil for a good price.
I have bought oil to my car from Germany, 24L each time. Max amount for fixed shipping price.

My car take only 3.7L oil.
Equal oil here cost at least 2.5 times more.
I like to have a few oil changes with filters for car and bikes in stock at home.

[Kelly E]

Twice a year the Carquest in town has a filter sale. I stock up on oil and air filters for our cars and trucks. We use factory oil filters in the bikes.

[C317414]

Castrol 20/50 4T motorcycle oil. I have been having trouble finding it lately. None at Walmart, Autozone, O'Reilly, NAPA, etc. Like you said I found it at Amazon.

My Royal Enfield Interceptor requires 10/50 full synthetic and I'd been looking for a decent deal pretty much since last summer when I bought the bike. I bought a 6-pack of Castrol on Amazon for $8.78/Qt delivered, together with a good deal on oil filters directly from India on ebay, I'm set for 2 oil changes at about $35 each. It's too easy to overspend these days and I'm fighting it tooth & nail.

My wife's Royal Enfield, and my Triumph Thruxton R, both require 10/50 full synthetic.  I also buy Castrol 6-packs at Amazon.  It's now up to $9.17/qt.

[C317414]

There's a gentleman named, Jim Comstock that has done extensive testing of oils, to see which ones are most suitable for the flat tappets used on Norton twin engines.  Some of these oils will probably do well on older Japanese motorcycles as well.  Note that a number of the oils Comstock tested are not suitable for wet clutches.

https://www.accessnorton.com/Oil-Tests/NortonOil.php

[grcamna2]

As for my bargain hunting I mentioned earlier I bought this 5qt never opened jug of 5-30 full synthetic oil Saturday at a church sale for 3 bucks.  My wife's car takes that stuff so there is a very cheap oil change in her future. 

What a great deal on some good quality oil 

[PeWe]

There's a gentleman named, Jim Comstock that has done extensive testing of oils, to see which ones are most suitable for the flat tappets used on Norton twin engines.  Some of these oils will probably do well on older Japanese motorcycles as well.  Note that a number of the oils Comstock tested are not suitable for wet clutches.

https://www.accessnorton.com/Oil-Tests/NortonOil.php

Good list to investigate
V-twin oil common among the tougher oils.
They are made for harder use, old engine design.

The lowest friction oils probably wet clutch slippery.

Motul 7100 and Spectro are oils I have used.
But not Motul 7100 20W-50, it was 10W-50.
The difference noticed with very warm engine though. From gear in to neutral that can be tricky when standing still with hot engine.

Red line 20W-50 4T gave smoother shifting gearbox than Motul 7100 10W-50 I tested a few years ago. That Motul oil smell very strong, not bad.

That test give Spectro HD 20W-50 good result as discussed earlier by experiences on this forum.
My gearbox liked it too, shifting to neutral.

I wounder how soon the load capacity will degrade by use.
When oil has to be replaced.

Race valve springs shimmed to higher force with hotter cam really need a functional oil to not get metal to metal contact. Even lots of ZZDP might not help then.

A stock lower compression cooler running engine with softer spring setup,  not aggressive lobes with less power for crank bearings  must run longer between oil changes.

[edwardmorris]

When I finished my 750 8 years ago (WOW time flies!) I got extremely lucky that I found a local ma n' pa shop that carries spectro. Slightly pricey at $8/quart but more than happy to support the local guy on top of getting what seems to be an excellent choice for oil. I did use Rotella for the break in runs only, also very good. But really I only stopped by to share my all time favorite oil thread and in particular, Schmitty's legendary response. Full thread here.

It has been over 5 years since we discussed which engine oil is preferred. 

No it hasn't...

Which oil do you use/recommend in my situation?

100% Pure Extra Virgin Olive Oil...

Where do you buy your oil?

At an olive farm that sells virginal olives...

Thanks!

Don't mention it!

[Trevor from Warragul]

Don't forget some ZDDP...

This is why I use Penrite oils. I think Terry's a fan of it, too!

[ofreen]

Yes, I'm starting an oil thread!
We all know that Spectro is the best oil, Greg has used it on his 750F and has 250K[?!] trouble free miles for over 40 years!  Is this it?

Oil threads have a bad rap, but with all things, it just depends on how it is conducted.  I like reading about other people's experiences if there is some actual info presented.  My old 750F is approaching 168,000 original miles, using Spectro 20W50 HD.  I started using it back in 1998 at around 60,000 miles.  Oil change intervals are 3000 miles these last many years, though sometimes in the past I went 4000.  It is the only oil I have ever used where the shifting doesn't get notchy and get  increased engine noise as it approaches the 3000 mile mark, even on triple digit temperature days here in SW Idaho.  It still comes out "oily" when changed.   Even with all the miles, I usually have to add very little inside the 3000 mile interval.  Although oil consumption seems to increasing in the bike, it still is a lot less than what manufacturers claim is 'normal' for new bikes.  I also use it in my '93 R100GSPD.

I buy it by the gallon.  It looks like it has gone up a couple of bucks since I bought some last fall, but I still think it is worth it at 10 bucks a quart.. 

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B075RL79DF/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o02_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1


Hey Stev-o, I don't think I'll live long enough to get the bike to 250K, but I'll give it my best shot.

[Stev-o]

But really I only stopped by to share my all time favorite oil thread and in particular, Schmitty's legendary response.

Hey Mo...good to hear from ya, hope all is well.  Schmitty's response is a classic, I miss that smartass, oil threads can bring out the best type of humor!

[Stev-o]

Yes, I'm starting an oil thread!
We all know that Spectro is the best oil, Greg has used it on his 750F and has 250K[?!] trouble free miles for over 40 years!  Is this it?

Oil threads have a bad rap...


Hey Stev-o, I don't think I'll live long enough to get the bike to 250K, but I'll give it my best shot.

Hey Greg... we are all pulling for ya!!

[Johnie]

So I know Valvoline 20/50 VR1 conventional has high zink...what other oils are you using that have it rather than adding ZDDP?

[RAFster122s]

Spectro has adequate zinc levels for our bikes. Mark related a period where Honda over did the zinc levels in their oils and he had some issues cleaning the zinc coated/impregnated  clutch discs.

[PeWe]

A living example of a CB750 that has done 168,000 unrestored miles on a specific oil say more than various tests.
Relatively long between changes and not a smoker either!

Maybe time to contact Spectro and tell the story as commercial and get oil for free? 
Ride it as much as possible to next change to increase milage.

I have inspiration to ride when weather will become warmer to see how far the rear tire will survive, oil change at the same time.