Topic: Was anyone else deeply offended by the "You Lie!" outburst?

[NickC]

Weren't the malpractice lawyers the biggest contributors to the DNC last year?

[Duke McDukiedook]

Caps were put on malpractice suits in Missouri to a limit of $250,000.

Insurance is not regulated in Missouri hence malpractice insurance costs are sky high and medical costs didn't come down one cent like all these republicans are raving about.

Tell me again how frivilous lawsuits are affecting insurance companies when it only accounts for around 3% of their business revenues?

[Inigo Montoya]

Illegals are a problem but there simply is no way to patrol ever foot of border we have because you would have to include the coast lines as well. It is always going to be an issue until mexico and cuba make their countries decent enough to stay in. For some reason, I do not see that happening.

[edbikerii]

Illegals are here illegally.  Simple as that.  Why don't we treat them when they arrive at the emergency room, then call immigration and deport them as soon as they are stable?

[MickeyX]

So now you want everyone to have a full background check... because you would have to do it to everyone, not just "those people". I hope you don't have any outstanding parking tickets... or anything else. Do you think the person at the front desk has the right to know your medical history, let alone your citizen/legal status? I could have sworn you were fighting against govt interference, Ed. Weren't you spouting off about socialism, fascism.... maybe the numbers on the forearm and chipping is where you are going with this, Ed? Hmmmmm.

Illegals are here illegally.  Simple as that.  Why don't we treat them when they arrive at the emergency room, then call immigration and deport them as soon as they are stable?

[NickC]

Illegals are a problem but there simply is no way to patrol ever foot of border we have because you would have to include the coast lines as well. It is always going to be an issue until mexico and cuba make their countries decent enough to stay in. For some reason, I do not see that happening.

Coast lines are fairly well manned. Sure, some get through, but not near the multitude that are coming through mexico.

[mlinder]

Caps were put on malpractice suits in Missouri to a limit of $250,000.

Insurance is not regulated in Missouri hence malpractice insurance costs are sky high and medical costs didn't come down one cent like all these republicans are raving about.

Tell me again how frivilous lawsuits are affecting insurance companies when it only accounts for around 3% of their business revenues?

The malpractice cap of the lawsuit in Missouri is irrelevant.
The average cost of insurance a doctor has to pay yearly is still a hundred grand.
Which means the doctors have to charge a #$%* ton just to stay in business and make money for themselves.
Again, if a doctors operating costs were brought down, the cost of medical services would come down, therefore medical insurance would come down.

I'd like to see your source of "3%", though, honestly, I don't remember mentioning frivolous lawsuits, just malpractice lawsuits in general, and the amount of insurance that doctors MUST pay to run their practice.
I do agree that malpractice insurance should be representative of actual risk, however, and I believe it is really out of proportion. Yeah, I guess the insurance companies are #$%*ing us from both sides, high premiums for doctors, so the doctors fees must be high to pay for them, and then high insurance premiums for us, because doctors fees are so high...

[lynchj]

Yeah, I guess the insurance companies are #$%*ing us from both sides, high premiums for doctors, so the doctors fees must be high to pay for them, and then high insurance premiums for us, because doctors fees are so high...

[/quote]

Don't forget all of CEO's and board members of the insurance companies that are making some serious cash and they do nothing to actually care for a patient. What is the value added for thier part.  Just another leech sucking money out of the current system that we end up paying for.

[HavocTurbo]

Has anyone else noticed a few reporters and news agencies call him "MR." Obama...

I thought you were forever to be referred to as Mister President or President Obama.

That to me seems a little rude and inconsiderate of the man's accomplishment. Regardless of what you think of him. I don't remember anyone else being called "MR." Bush, Clinton, Kennedy, Etc..

[mlinder]

Yeah, I guess the insurance companies are #$%*ing us from both sides, high premiums for doctors, so the doctors fees must be high to pay for them, and then high insurance premiums for us, because doctors fees are so high...

Don't forget all of CEO's and board members of the insurance companies that are making some serious cash and they do nothing to actually care for a patient. What is the value added for thier part.  Just another leech sucking money out of the current system that we end up paying for.

While I agree that CEO's and board members pay scales may not be commensurate with their duties and contributions to their respective companies, remember, they are the people who operate and run the companies that offer these services. It's a job, like any other job. You do your work, and you get paid. Should they volunteer instead of being paid for their work?

[Inigo Montoya]

Coast lines are fairly well manned. Sure, some get through, but not near the multitude that are coming through mexico.

This would only be true since land crossings are easier than water. All you need is your feet. but if we tighten the land border, water will go right up. And I doubt given the thousands of miles of shore that it is patrolled as well as you think.

[mark]

The problem isn't being addressed from it's root causes.
.....
.....
A lot of it has to do with the insanely high premiums that hospitals and doctors have to pay for malpractice insurance.
The average premium for a single doctor is in the range of $100,000.00 per year.
Why is that? Well, because our legal system promotes inane and insane lawsuits against everyone. Lawyers love to sue doctors. When we can sue doctors and their insurance companies and the lawyers can make as much as 50 cents on the dollar, if not more, on a lawsuit, you bet they want to sue for everything, all the time.

still not getting to the root cause there.....

lawyers do not decide cases or award Lotto-jackpot settlements.....

That is for the jury to decide. Twelve of your fellow citizens who couldn't come up with a good excuse to get out of Jury Duty.

Think about that next time you get a Summons from the Court.

Sure... it only pays a few bucks a day and you are indispensable at your job.... might be a bit of a sacrifice.

Would you rather leave the decision to a dozen boneheads who are there simply because a real live trial might be more exciting than daytime TV?

[mlinder]

The problem isn't being addressed from it's root causes.
.....
.....
A lot of it has to do with the insanely high premiums that hospitals and doctors have to pay for malpractice insurance.
The average premium for a single doctor is in the range of $100,000.00 per year.
Why is that? Well, because our legal system promotes inane and insane lawsuits against everyone. Lawyers love to sue doctors. When we can sue doctors and their insurance companies and the lawyers can make as much as 50 cents on the dollar, if not more, on a lawsuit, you bet they want to sue for everything, all the time.

still not getting to the root cause there.....

lawyers do not decide cases or award Lotto-jackpot settlements.....

That is for the jury to decide. Twelve of your fellow citizens who couldn't come up with a good excuse to get out of Jury Duty.

Think about that next time you get a Summons from the Court.

Sure... it only pays a few bucks a day and you are indispensable at your job.... might be a bit of a sacrifice.

Would you rather leave the decision to a dozen boneheads who are there simply because a real live trial might be more exciting than daytime TV?

First, if the judicial system had proper guidelines, the jurors would have proper boundaries in which to operate and make decisions. Lawyers may not decide how much is awarded, but they decide how much they want to make for a given trial and ask for 4 times that amount so that if they get half that, they get half of the half.
Second, I do not qualify to be a juror, otherwise I'd happily serve.

[HavocTurbo]

Second, I do not qualify to be a juror, otherwise I'd happily serve.

Hehe I'm right there with ya brother!!

I'd happily serve my country also but.... such is life.

[Duke McDukiedook]

The Missouri case is very relevant to this argument. Legislators placed an injury cap of $250,000 per occurrence and malpractice insurance costs are higher than the national average, nobody saw any savings save the insurance companies.

Doctors are leaving here by the score because it is too expensive to operate, insurance is too high. Same thing in Texas is happening.

3% is the number people in the news are floating about, I haven't heard any arguments from the other side against that number so I used it.

I have the answer to frivolous lawsuits- the party shown to have no standing or the case is thrown out on grounds pays for all the parties costs involved, just like over in Europe, that will stop a LOT of frivolous lawsuits.

Caps on injuries only hurts the people who are victims of negligence- how are you supposed to live off $250K for the rest of your life if you are a quadriplegic due to a doctor's gross negligence?

[mlinder]

The Missouri case is very relevant to this argument. Legislators placed an injury cap of $250,000 per occurence and malpractice insurance costs are higher than the national average, nobody saw any savings save the insurance companies.

Doctors are leaving here by the score because it is too expensive to operate here, insurance is too high. Same thing in Texas is happening.

3% is the number people in the news are floating about, I haven't heard any arguments from the other side against that number so I used it.

Then this is a case of the insurance companies failing to be responsible with their fees. If their annual payout is say, halved, by that legislation, then insurance premiums should be halved. Perhaps legislators should look into that.
numbers like "3%" always bother me. It's like that finding on motorcycle accidents listed last month, that 90% (or some number) were by peopel who had not taken the MSF course. Makes it sound like you ahve a 90% chance of having an accident unless you take the MSF. They did not list the percentage of total riders that did not attend the MSF. If the total number is 90%, also, then it's a total nonfactor. The fact that they didn't list it makes the percentages they are spewing meaningless.

[edbikerii]

so, what are you saying, Mickey?  Let them stay?  Give them all the protection and benefits that the US Government affords it citizens?

So now you want everyone to have a full background check... because you would have to do it to everyone, not just "those people". I hope you don't have any outstanding parking tickets... or anything else. Do you think the person at the front desk has the right to know your medical history, let alone your citizen/legal status? I could have sworn you were fighting against govt interference, Ed. Weren't you spouting off about socialism, fascism.... maybe the numbers on the forearm and chipping is where you are going with this, Ed? Hmmmmm.

Illegals are here illegally.  Simple as that.  Why don't we treat them when they arrive at the emergency room, then call immigration and deport them as soon as they are stable?

[NickC]

Coast lines are fairly well manned. Sure, some get through, but not near the multitude that are coming through mexico.

This would only be true since land crossings are easier than water. All you need is your feet. but if we tighten the land border, water will go right up. And I doubt given the thousands of miles of shore that it is patrolled as well as you think.

I've personally patrolled said shorelines, so I fully understand the capabilities and assets out there right now.

[Inigo Montoya]

Nick, not saying it sucks out there, just that there is a lot of ocean to cover and small craft are hard to find. But you can bet that if the land borders DO tighten, there will be more boats and yes, we will catch many of them but many will still get through. I wish it was not so but only time will tell.

[333]

Small craft are much easier to find than you think.  That is the Coast Guards main job these days, including going after the drug runners.  Don't you remember hearing this past year about the drug runners making boats that run just under the surface of the water?  That's because radar can find the smallest boat on top of the water.

[MickeyX]

Ah Ed, you know what I said. It's written right there. Maybe an English as a 2nd language class? Just sayin'. 

You can hate people all you want, Ed. It is your right as a human. It has nothing to do with where you live. Hate comes from within. You can't discriminate against them in this country though. That is, in reality, what would be happening. You would have to be targeting people by their demographics, which according to the Constitution, is unlawful. (although the neonazis would love you) There are ways of determining who is a citizen and who isn't. That is up the government, not the chickie manning the ER desk. Issue medical ID cards like passports. The passport people tend to get it right. Many of them could pass as proctologists, I suspect.
 
You really aren't worth any more of my time. I have to get ready for work. I'm sure, as with every other day of the week, we'll be having some homeless vets trying to get some "free" healthcare out of the good taxpayers such as yourself, Ed.

[333]

Not to hijack the thread, but why are there homeless veterans?  I doubt that it is like Reagan said, that they want to be homeless.


Just a thought.

[ev0lve]

Has anyone else noticed a few reporters and news agencies call him "MR." Obama...

I thought you were forever to be referred to as Mister President or President Obama.

That to me seems a little rude and inconsiderate of the man's accomplishment. Regardless of what you think of him. I don't remember anyone else being called "MR." Bush, Clinton, Kennedy, Etc..

It's just a convention. Seems more prevalent in European/BBC articles

Early in an article
"New powers
President Obama said his administration was working on an "ambitious" overhaul of the regulatory system."

Later in the article
"Storms breaking
Mr Obama said that his recovery was bearing fruit and had "prevented layoffs of tens of thousands of teachers, police officers and other essential public servants"."

They refer to the Prime Minister as Mr without the title all the time.

NYT does it too.

Hmmm, seems the AP changed it's (dang, is it it's its or its' ?) recently
http://www.ap.org/pages/about/whatsnew/wn_111208a.html

Anyways, nothing to see here. Move on 

[edbikerii]

Right, I'm a "hater" because I call you on your BS.  Whatever.

Vets earned their healthcare.  They should be treated better than the Veterans Administration does, but that's what you get when you have government-run healthcare.  That's what I've been saying all along.

Ah Ed, you know what I said. It's written right there. Maybe an English as a 2nd language class? Just sayin'. 

You can hate people all you want, Ed. It is your right as a human. It has nothing to do with where you live. Hate comes from within. You can't discriminate against them in this country though. That is, in reality, what would be happening. You would have to be targeting people by their demographics, which according to the Constitution, is unlawful. (although the neonazis would love you) There are ways of determining who is a citizen and who isn't. That is up the government, not the chickie manning the ER desk. Issue medical ID cards like passports. The passport people tend to get it right. Many of them could pass as proctologists, I suspect.
 
You really aren't worth any more of my time. I have to get ready for work. I'm sure, as with every other day of the week, we'll be having some homeless vets trying to get some "free" healthcare out of the good taxpayers such as yourself, Ed.

[HavocTurbo]

Has anyone else noticed a few reporters and news agencies call him "MR." Obama...

I thought you were forever to be referred to as Mister President or President Obama.

That to me seems a little rude and inconsiderate of the man's accomplishment. Regardless of what you think of him. I don't remember anyone else being called "MR." Bush, Clinton, Kennedy, Etc..

It's just a convention. Seems more prevalent in European/BBC articles

Early in an article
"New powers
President Obama said his administration was working on an "ambitious" overhaul of the regulatory system."

Later in the article
"Storms breaking
Mr Obama said that his recovery was bearing fruit and had "prevented layoffs of tens of thousands of teachers, police officers and other essential public servants"."

They refer to the Prime Minister as Mr without the title all the time.

NYT does it too.

Hmmm, seems the AP changed it's (dang, is it it's its or its' ?) recently
http://www.ap.org/pages/about/whatsnew/wn_111208a.html

Anyways, nothing to see here. Move on 

I see it on national news, local news, papers, magazines, etc...

Maybe I haven't noticed before, but I hear and read it everywhere now. I honestly don't remember anyone else NOT being called President so and so, or Mister President.

There should be punishment for not respecting the highest office in the land. Regardless of what you think of that person.

And on a side note... I never really did find closure on the birth certificate thing. Did that ever get "resolved"? I've been looking but maybe not hard enough?