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how to fix my smoothbores

help
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Author Topic: CR 29mm carbs pain in ass...  (Read 10005 times)

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Ivan Holiday

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CR 29mm carbs pain in ass...
« on: May 04, 2010, 11:47:14 am »
My cb 750A engine has 836kit and Klein CR 29mm race smoothbore carbs.
The carb leak like the floats don't shut down the fuel coming in.
I have pods on the carbs...now the engine won't run unless the choke is half on...
anyone got a proper jetting ratio for these carbs and any other info...thanks Ivan

Offline mlinder

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Re: CR 29mm carbs pain in ass...
« Reply #1 on: May 04, 2010, 12:11:41 pm »
Sounds like you need to first check your float valves, and you need to check for carb boot leaks.

What jetting is in there now?
No.


Offline lordmoonpie

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Re: CR 29mm carbs pain in ass...
« Reply #2 on: May 05, 2010, 01:40:14 am »
Welcome to the wonderful world of period keihins ;D

My keihins are 31s but the principle is the same I guess. Float height should be 22.5mm but I also find that when the fuel tap is on, the carbs leak like nothing else. Maybe it's just becasue these things are so darn old? I am going to make new seals for the float chamber and see if that helps (original seals are like rocking horse doo-doo!).

Jetting is likely to be different a bit for 29s but running 31s on my 750 I have the following settings:
Main jet 115
Air jet    200
needle    R CZ 3rd groove
cutaway  No 3
Slow jet    No. 60
Air  screw   1 turn

Float height should be 22.5mm from the body.

The biggest problem I found is that if you have different settings from these, you can change the main jet easy enough but nobody stocks any of the other parts to change the jets. If you or anyone else finds a source of these parts such that I can buy a few different needles and jets for tuning I'd sure like to know the details of that supplier... Good Luck!

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Offline Sam Green Racing

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Re: CR 29mm carbs pain in ass...
« Reply #3 on: May 05, 2010, 02:19:33 am »
My cb 750A engine has 836kit and Klein CR 29mm race smoothbore carbs.
The carb leak like the floats don't shut down the fuel coming in.
I have pods on the carbs...now the engine won't run unless the choke is half on...
anyone got a proper jetting ratio for these carbs and any other info...thanks Ivan

Welcome to the forum Ivan, nice to see another Auto owner with go faster goodies.

Which CR carbs do you have?

These  http://www.allensperformance.co.uk/images/gallery/crt05.jpg

or these  http://www.allensperformance.co.uk/images/gallery/cbx1000-cr.jpg

Sam. :)
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Offline jweeks

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Re: CR 29mm carbs pain in ass...
« Reply #4 on: May 05, 2010, 12:28:26 pm »
Sam,
     Look at the fun that you'll be missing. Even if the main jet is right, it can't handle rapid throttle movement. Chad knows all about that. (cough - cough) I never could find the component source(s) to get mine right. Never was a Dyna jet kit for this old setup! I would have bought a couple if they were available. You'll just have to worry about something else. (like how the driver will perform) Looking forward to this fall. Good luck on the CR carbs!

                                             Hondamatic  :D

Offline Jerry Rxman Griffin aka MuthaF'er

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Re: CR 29mm carbs pain in ass...
« Reply #5 on: May 05, 2010, 02:44:21 pm »
You boys comparing OLD CR's to New CR's?? Careful as to not confuse the issue.
As of today 3/13/2012 my original owner 75 CB750F has made it through 3 wives, er EX-wives. Free at last.  ;-)

Offline sangyo soichiro

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Re: CR 29mm carbs pain in ass...
« Reply #6 on: May 05, 2010, 02:46:14 pm »
How come no one's voting in the poll?!   ;D
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Offline Bill/BentON Racing

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Re: CR 29mm carbs pain in ass...
« Reply #7 on: May 05, 2010, 04:40:58 pm »
As Sam and others will agree....CR stands for Constant Repeat tuning! ;D ;D,Bill. I don't think we'll have that problem.Riders....time will tell.! Jon ,thanks for your help.
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Offline Sam Green Racing

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Re: CR 29mm carbs pain in ass...
« Reply #8 on: May 05, 2010, 10:54:23 pm »
You boys comparing OLD CR's to New CR's?? Careful as to not confuse the issue.

Hi Jerry, Ivan didn't say which CRs he was running, that's why I asked.
Going off the fact they are pi$$ing out fuel, sounds like he's got the old ones like Lord Simon Moonpie.

Sam. ;)
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Offline Sam Green Racing

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Re: CR 29mm carbs pain in ass...
« Reply #9 on: May 06, 2010, 12:33:46 am »
Sam,
     Look at the fun that you'll be missing. Even if the main jet is right, it can't handle rapid throttle movement. Chad knows all about that. (cough - cough) I never could find the component source(s) to get mine right. Never was a Dyna jet kit for this old setup! I would have bought a couple if they were available. You'll just have to worry about something else. (like how the driver will perform) Looking forward to this fall. Good luck on the CR carbs!

                                             Hondamatic  :D

 ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D Hi Jon, I figured you'd show up if automatic and carbs were mentioned in the same breath.  :D

Ivan, you are surrounded by people with experience of both modern and period (old type) CR carbs.
Throw into the mix an authority on automatics and carburation and you have Jon (Hondamatic) Weeks.
When you get back to us, perhaps you'll fill us in on the type of CR and the reason for fitting them to an automatic.
Over the years several forum members have used the old CRs for racing for which they were intended for in the first place.
In the UK you have to use period carbs but in the US, the AMA found there was no advantage, performance wise over the old carbs, so allow the use of the modern ones.
The problems with the old ones are, they ARE old and replacment parts hard to find.
Both carbs are hard to set up but they do perform real well once set correctly.
We campaigned the 836CR that you see in my avatar for five years with modern CR31s with great results in classic sprints and drag races.
The one big problen we found with these instruments was the fact that you can't whack the throttle open fast, they require delicate control of both throttle and clutch to get the bike off the line quick.
When I decided to build an auto drag bike, I turned to the people that knew them and was helped in a big way by Jon Weeks.
Jon had campaigned autos for many years and set us up with a set of 34mm Mikuni CVs, they allow you to hit the throttle hard on the line without over fueling the motor and will give a great rush at the top end.
My advise is to sell the old CRs to someone building a CR750 replica who wants it to be period correct, you'll get a good wad for them and have plenty left over after buying more suitable carbs.

Sam. :)

Wonder if Chad will show up. (cough cough) ;D ;D ;D ;)

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Offline Sam Green Racing

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Re: CR 29mm carbs pain in ass...
« Reply #10 on: May 06, 2010, 12:50:14 am »
As Sam and others will agree....CR stands for Constant Repeat tuning! ;D ;D,Bill. I don't think we'll have that problem.Riders....time will tell.! Jon ,thanks for your help.

Hear Hear. ;)
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traveler

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Re: CR 29mm carbs pain in ass...
« Reply #11 on: July 11, 2010, 01:46:41 pm »
Hate to pull a highjack, but my question is along the same lines.

I'm going to buy a new set of CR's for my 550.  If Dynoman sets them up for me, they should be damn near right on....shouldn't they?

Or are they going to leak all the time, and just be a pain in the butt?


~Joe

traveler

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Re: CR 29mm carbs pain in ass...
« Reply #12 on: July 11, 2010, 08:21:31 pm »
bump

Offline nokrome

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Re: CR 29mm carbs pain in ass...
« Reply #13 on: July 11, 2010, 09:46:53 pm »
i don't know how well dynoman can set them up for you without them being on the bike, i would definitely plan on some tuning time once they are installed.
   i run 29's on my 850 bike and have found them very easy to deal with, jetting and needle changes are quick and easy and they dont leak a drop
 
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Re: CR 29mm carbs pain in ass...
« Reply #14 on: July 11, 2010, 11:06:03 pm »
i don't know how well dynoman can set them up for you without them being on the bike, i would definitely plan on some tuning time once they are installed.
   i run 29's on my 850 bike and have found them very easy to deal with, jetting and needle changes are quick and easy and they dont leak a drop
  
I bot mine in 1980 from lord knows where. Put them on an 888cc engine. My memory was that it took a few hours on a saturday to get the engine pulling cleanly from idle to WOT. Never touched them again for 15 years, 50K+ miles. Idled perfectly, never leaked, took very little choke to start and warm ups were faster than stock.

Going back on a 888 engine after sitting for 15 years. Hope they don't give me a problem.

PS: Ran Pods, no problems.
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Offline turboguzzi

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Re: CR 29mm carbs pain in ass...
« Reply #15 on: July 12, 2010, 01:27:56 am »
Hate to pull a highjack, but my question is along the same lines.

I'm going to buy a new set of CR's for my 550.  If Dynoman sets them up for me, they should be damn near right on....shouldn't they?

Or are they going to leak all the time, and just be a pain in the butt?


~Joe


dynoman can get close but there's no book that details all the possible combinations out there of cams, headwork, ignition, whatever.
you want perfromance? suffer then! :)

if my experience is any help, stick with the 120 main and play mostly with the needle. And very important! air needle should be almost 1/4-1/2 from closed, not 1 1/2 like its usual, seems to be a common source for agravation.

TG

l

traveler

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Re: CR 29mm carbs pain in ass...
« Reply #16 on: July 12, 2010, 04:03:12 pm »
Heard back from Dynoman today "CR26's were never made for your bike, and aren't available".

~Joe

Offline bwaller

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Re: CR 29mm carbs pain in ass...
« Reply #17 on: July 12, 2010, 04:48:13 pm »
I'm not sure why they said that....go to the middle of the next page of topics.

cr 26 carbs on cb 550 / 605 ccm

edit; Of course as Jeff @Z1 explained...maybe so afterall.
« Last Edit: July 12, 2010, 06:07:21 pm by bwaller »

Offline kos

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Re: CR 29mm carbs pain in ass...
« Reply #18 on: July 14, 2010, 08:52:03 am »
Heard back from Dynoman today "CR26's were never made for your bike, and aren't available".

~Joe


Just because they are not on a list does not mean you can make them fit. They made them for CB400F, a very similar engine design. CR Specials are adjustable in rack spacing, so all you need to do is get manifolds to fit.

KOS
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Re: CR 29mm carbs pain in ass...
« Reply #19 on: July 14, 2010, 08:59:32 am »
Heard back from Dynoman today "CR26's were never made for your bike, and aren't available".

~Joe


Just because they are not on a list does not mean you can make them fit. They made them for CB400F, a very similar engine design. CR Specials are adjustable in rack spacing, so all you need to do is get manifolds to fit.

KOS
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traveler

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Re: CR 29mm carbs pain in ass...
« Reply #20 on: July 14, 2010, 09:04:17 am »
Heard back from Dynoman today "CR26's were never made for your bike, and aren't available".

~Joe


Just because they are not on a list does not mean you can make them fit. They made them for CB400F, a very similar engine design. CR Specials are adjustable in rack spacing, so all you need to do is get manifolds to fit.

KOS

I'll jsut go with the 29's I think.  They make them for the 550.  I don't believe they are the "specials"....jsut the NEW CR29 smooth bore carbs.

When are you getting some, and have you ever jetted them for a 550?

I noticed both you and Dynoman aren't big on having a phone, so e-mail is how all transactions are done.

Pls reply.

~Joe

Offline BLUE71TURBO

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Re: CR 29mm carbs pain in ass...
« Reply #21 on: July 14, 2010, 10:13:59 am »
 Why all the hasel over these cr carbs ?  Why not use the great mikuni 29 smooth bore carbs. They work great, easy to get, tune, and
    parts are readily available.   ;D
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traveler

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Re: CR 29mm carbs pain in ass...
« Reply #22 on: July 14, 2010, 04:18:13 pm »
I just ordered and paid for a new set of CR29's from Dynoman, along with a set of main jets, one size larger, and one size smaller to fine tune.  Included in the deal is setting them up for a CB 550 and jetting them.

EXPENSIVE.

Damn. :(

~Joe

Offline 750K8 Kev

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Re: CR 29mm carbs pain in ass...
« Reply #23 on: October 01, 2010, 04:06:02 pm »
I just ordered and paid for a new set of CR29's from Dynoman, along with a set of main jets, one size larger, and one size smaller to fine tune.  Included in the deal is setting them up for a CB 550 and jetting them.

EXPENSIVE.

Damn. :(

~Joe

Can you say how expensive? I am getting my stock carbs rebuilt over the next week and they need a lot of work.  I am expecting a call tomorrow about the cost after they are done their diagnosis . If the the price is right I will go with the CR29's.

Offline MotorFist

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Re: CR 29mm carbs pain in ass...
« Reply #24 on: October 03, 2010, 10:05:35 am »
Another request for "How expensive?" here.  I have a 73 500 Project I am working on and need carbs.  I have none at all as of now and was thinking of CR's as well.  I would imagine the 550 set up would be pretty similar to my 500?
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