Topic: Is VHT (550f) Engine Paint suitable to cylinders or heads?

[Kong]

I am looking for engine paint, rattle can variety, and the color I want can be had in 500 and 550 degree versions, but no hotter.  I am not sure that is enough to stand up to head or cylinder temperatures on a 550-4.  The two brands that have what I want are Duplicolor and VHT, both carried by TCP Global. 

So, in your experience will that paint hold up?  I do not have the engine apart and don't have any plans to take it apart, so powdercoating is not an option.

[paulages]

Yes, works great.

[Toxic]

Ask the experts.  They have a great forum section on their website.

I have gotten an email response within 24 hours

http://www.vhtpaint.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=5

Love your painting posts BTW,  Great skills

[cookindaddy]

Worked great for me.
Handles the head temperature just fine after 1500 miles.
Not as durable as I would have liked, scuffs off where my foot runs the transmission.

[paulages]

Worked great for me.
Handles the head temperature just fine after 1500 miles.
Not as durable as I would have liked, scuffs off where my foot runs the transmission.

Have you baked the paint on properly? VHT has been unbelievably durable for me, but I bake all of the parts as per the manufacturer's instructions.

[cookindaddy]

Good to hear.
I did bake the covers on the BBQ outside but it was difficult to control the temperature.

[Kong]

Thank you all, I have a bit more confidence in the stuff now.  As I may have hinted, I don't think much of rattle-can paints, but as I've recently learned high temperature paints are not commonly available in any other form, at least not that my paint guy is aware of.

The cure instructions on the VHT (brand name) paint is to bring the part up to 200 degrees (f) and that's it.  A good run-in should do it for some parts, but others never get that hot.  That left me skeptical.  I expect its why paint is rubbing off the shift/sprocket cover on some bikes too, because they never get hot enough to cure properly.  That will be the case with my engine too, though not that particular cover, which will be highly polished.

Thank you all again.

[Freaky1]

Good to hear.
I did bake the covers on the BBQ outside but it was difficult to control the temperature.

I never thought of using the grill, I was trying to think of how I could convince my wife to loan me the oven for a few hours!

[Kong]

I was thinking a bit about that curing requirement and to tell the truth it really shouldn't be at all hard to make a small, or not so small, oven that could easily handle that sort of temperature.  I'm sure I could easily and inexpensively build a suitable oven from a used wall locker and electric oven - things which can be found in dumps and junk yards for the most part.

I baked a set of headers (4->1) in our kitchen oven about a month ago, one day when the Queen was out and about.  I knew there would be some smell, but I wasn't prepared for what I got.  Needless to say I panicked at the thought of my good wife coming home before I got the place aired out.  Fans blowing, doors open, all the windows agape - and the temperature outdoors was hovering in the upper 20's - for hours, while this little lemur cowered in the corner dreading the return of the guardian of the hearth.  As luck would have it she ran into a friend, they went to dinner, got lit up on a couple of bottles of wine, and by the late hour she got home I had the nest back to normal and a nice set of pipes for the effort.  The gods smiled on this old monkey that day.   

[Elan]

Good to hear.
I did bake the covers on the BBQ outside but it was difficult to control the temperature.

I never thought of using the grill, I was trying to think of how I could convince my wife to loan me the oven for a few hours!

Ya i did the kitchen oven, I had to do 2 "sessions".  It smelled up a bit, but not really bad.  
I layed some foil on the bottom, and real glad I did- that was the misses' idea! The lower crankcase half inevitably leaked a few drops of oil- which would REALLY stink up the place when you go back to high temp cooking!

[Toxic]

yup we are all a little nuts.

16" rim nestled inside my front rim, fit well.

[Freaky1]

I took a moment and just looked on Craigslist and there were 4 or 5 decent ovens listed under $100, I'm thinking about going that route. When my first project started she didn't really care about me washing parts in the kitchen sink, but that soon changed.

[paulages]

We have a kitchen range at the house which we use for baking paint onto parts. Another consideration regarding adhesion is preparation... VHT makes a self-etching primer which is zinc based if I remember correctly. I've used and not used it, and always had great results with all kinds of fuel spills and brake-kleen contact. I've never had the same results with duplicolor.

[brandEn]

I do not have the engine apart and don't have any plans to take it apart, so powdercoating is not an option.

Just wondering..... I have never seen powdercoat on a cylinder head. Will powdercoat survive the high temps and heat cycles? What about on an aircooled engine? Seems like powdercoat may not allow for enough cooling?

[Elan]

I took a moment and just looked on Craigslist and there were 4 or 5 decent ovens listed under $100, I'm thinking about going that route. When my first project started she didn't really care about me washing parts in the kitchen sink, but that soon changed.

one with convection is a super plus, and necessary if you decide to do some powder coating(not much more $$ if you already have an oven!)

[paulages]

I do not have the engine apart and don't have any plans to take it apart, so powdercoating is not an option.

Just wondering..... I have never seen powdercoat on a cylinder head. Will powdercoat survive the high temps and heat cycles? What about on an aircooled engine? Seems like powdercoat may not allow for enough cooling?

Powder coating cures at 400F, so I wouldn't worry about that so much as heat dissipation. I'd think the thinner the coating, the easier for heat to dissipate, but that's just a hunch.

[Elan]

I do not have the engine apart and don't have any plans to take it apart, so powdercoating is not an option.

Just wondering..... I have never seen powdercoat on a cylinder head. Will powdercoat survive the high temps and heat cycles? What about on an aircooled engine? Seems like powdercoat may not allow for enough cooling?

Powder coating cures at 400F, so I wouldn't worry about that so much as heat dissipation. I'd think the thinner the coating, the easier for heat to dissipate, but that's just a hunch.

It all depends on the type of powder also, theres some hi temp powder designed for engine blocks

[Kong]

Just thought I'd pass on some information on the paint.

The color I was looking for is a dark green, sometimes called British Racing Green, more often called either Emerald or Hunter's Green.  Both DupliColor and VHT (which are both Sherman Williams companies) make it, in 500 and 550 degree versions, respectively.  Locally Auto Zone carries Duplicolor and VHT products, but no store within 50 miles has those colors.  So I went to TCP Global on line, because they always have everything, and indeed there it was, both types and both colors.  They were cheap to, five or six bucks a can.  So I figured I'd buy them there, which I started to do, until I saw the shipping cost.  Nineteen bucks shipping to get a $6 can of paint from there to here.  I could not bring myself to do it.

So later in the day I went to E-Bay to see if anyone is selling the stuff there, and while there wasn't any by VHT there was a hit for the Duplicolor version.  The thing was it was TCPGlobal that was selling it.  But, and this is the good part, when they sell it on E-Bay they charge twelve bucks for the paint, but the shipping is free.  Same paint, same seller, same Fed Ex truck will deliver it, twelve bucks instead of twenty-three.

Just thought I'd pass it on.

[Elan]

I bought mine from brandsport.com

$5.60 a can. I bought 3 cans and it was 10 bucks shipping. not bad. but there is a catch- 5 business days to process! then another 5 in shipping! so its a good deal if you are patient.

[Kevin D]

A burning candle will cover all kinds of odors.

[bluesmoke69]

Check your bigger auto part store. In MN. they all have both of them. Hope this helps.

[Kong]

Actually I spent a good bit of yesterday hitting every auto parts store in the state's 3rd largest town before returning to my own county, where I hit 3 more without success.  I wasn't restricting myself to Duplicator or VHT brands either, I would have bought any brand if it was the color I want.

At any rate I bought a can from the E-bay sales end of the show.  I'll tell you all what I really would have liked to find, some sort of VHT carrier that I could have tinted with a toner to my own liking.  The color I'm shooting for is about like the darkest you can get with KK09, the entire color scheme of the bike I'm building is based on this color:

[Freaky1]

Actually I spent a good bit of yesterday hitting every auto parts store in the state's 3rd largest town before returning to my own county, where I hit 3 more without success.  I wasn't restricting myself to Duplicator or VHT brands either, I would have bought any brand if it was the color I want.

At any rate I bought a can from the E-bay sales end of the show.  I'll tell you all what I really would have liked to find, some sort of VHT carrier that I could have tinted with a toner to my own liking.  The color I'm shooting for is about like the darkest you can get with KK09, the entire color scheme of the bike I'm building is based on this color:

Always been a fan of the green and that is quite green.

[camelman]

One word of advice on the VHT paint.  Even if you let it cure dry to the touch before baking it, it will be tacky after it has been heated.  Don't touch it until it has cooled down.  After it cools, it will be tough as nails.  Also, clean that surface well and use the recommended primer.  If you don't use the primer, then the VHT paint is basically worthless.

camelman

[Freaky1]

I was figuring on going with VHT everything, from stripper and etching primer, I don't want any issues with it.

[Kong]

I have a tendency to stick with "systems" when I paint anything.  By that I mean that I generally stay within one manufacturer's Brand and set of compatible products.  So, for example, if I'm going to use House of Kolor bases then I'm going to use HOK reducers, tints, and clear coat too, that sort of thing.   So I take the advice above to heart.  Well, maybe not the stripper, but from the primer on up I'll stick with the stuffs and procedures Duplicolor recommends. 
By the way, I find it awfully interesting that the Duplicolor "Engine Enamel with Ceramic" (500 degree) has no indicated curing regimen, just drying and handeling times.  Hmmmmmm.