Topic: A Bike Is Born....750/1000cc

[bear]

That's OK, I confuse my self sometimes so what hope have you got?
We remove the GL clutch and use the 4 bolt SOHC clutch on the GL shaft.
The GL clutches can be used with a bit of work, but I would have to chase up what's required.
It's been some years since we have used GL clutches and l can't remember why we stopped using them.

Cheers,
Brian

[dragracer]

That's OK, I confuse my self sometimes so what hope have you got?
We remove the GL clutch and use the 4 bolt SOHC clutch on the GL shaft.
The GL clutches can be used with a bit of work, but I would have to chase up what's required.
It's been some years since we have used GL clutches and l can't remember why we stopped using them.

Cheers,
Brian

Alright, I'm a bit dense here. Let me repeat what I think I understood you to say: Its not the transmission shaft from the GL you are using but the internally splined shaft attached to the outer clutch basket??

[Tintop]

I was told you just swap in the GL shaft that has the correct HiVo teeth to match the 900 crank.  Everything else is still 750.

[POPS 911]

FRANK-BILL - TREY:     E-BAY RC327 CAM  brand new right here in OHIO  $130 today BIDDING STILL GOING ON !

[dragracer]

Thanks Pops. I've got a feeling it'll go higher than its really worth.

[Jerry Rxman Griffin aka MuthaF'er]

FRANK-BILL - TREY:     E-BAY RC327 CAM  brand new right here in OHIO  $130 today BIDDING STILL GOING ON !

Find me a new 315 Pops.

[dragracer]

Alrighty now, so its item #1 and 2 on this schematic that we need. And not a shaft.

[Bill/BentON Racing]

Got to have a shaft for the Hyvo chain hook up. But don't know for sure what's needed. Bill

[kmb69]

Frank, If you are talking about the primary drive modification to mate a CB900 crank, it's a little more complicated than just swapping some parts. The easiest way to get there is to take the HyVo gear off of the GL primary and replace the sprockets on the CB750 primary with the GL HyVo gear (#3 in the picture). Also, you should put some new dampers in there while you have it apart. There's a guy in France that sells the kits. Keith

[dragracer]

That's what I posted to Jon in Reply#197 and just needed confirmation. Thanks for verifying that for me. I keep hearing everyone say shaft, but to me that's a splined sleeve that the primary clutch gear is made onto and riveted to the outer basket.  All good now. I'm now on the same page with the nomenclature. Yes, I do understand there are a lot of other issues to work through for this conversion.

[bear]

Sorry for the confusion Frank.
Keith and yourself have mail.

Cheers,
Brian

[dragracer]

Sorry for the confusion Frank.
Keith and yourself have mail.

Cheers,
Brian

Thanks Bear. You've been much help so far. Sorry if i keep asking questions. My desires may outweigh my pocket. I'm just trying to be clear on the level of complication before i get too deep in this conversion. . Nevertheless, be on the lookout for future PM's.

[jweeks]

Frank,
     I build Hondamatics - stroker Hondamatics, not clutch versions. I can't give you what I've not done. You've got the right people here to give you the details.
     Other thoughts - You need to add a tensioner to the primary chain for the stretch that will be happening with drag racing. The primary hy-vo chain needs to be built or sourced for the application. There's no major surprise expenses here.
     Does using Bear's recommendations on the 1100F rods with the factory part number pistons allow you to not need any spacers beyond available head/base gasket thicknesses? I ran a spacer using steel cb750 rods and off the shelf (at the time) Arias 73 mm pistons. In my application it shifted the powerband down which improved my ET about 3 tenths. You'll go quicker so long as it shifts....

[dragracer]

Frank,
     I build Hondamatics - stroker Hondamatics, not clutch versions. I can't give you what I've not done. You've got the right people here to give you the details.
     Other thoughts - You need to add a tensioner to the primary chain for the stretch that will be happening with drag racing. The primary hy-vo chain needs to be built or sourced for the application. There's no major surprise expenses here.
     Does using Bear's recommendations on the 1100F rods with the factory part number pistons allow you to not need any spacers beyond available head/base gasket thicknesses? I ran a spacer using steel cb750 rods and off the shelf (at the time) Arias 73 mm pistons. In my application it shifted the powerband down which improved my ET about 3 tenths. You'll go quicker so long as it shifts....

Jon,

Ahhh, you had to bring up the shifting didn't you?? Lol. I've got the shifting issue solved, at least for now.

Cometic can make any thickness spacer you need via special order, so using the longer rods is definitely in my plans for this engine. Since a cam chain has to be specially ordered, i'll be cognizant about the extra length required due to the spacer under the block. I'll need some more help from you on the  cam chain tensioner and guide. The cam gear modification should be straight forward. Will get some direction on the primary chain and tensioner. I do have a 750 DOHC under the shed. I'll be pulling the engine off and tearing it down to look at the factory parts to see if any can be modified for use in the SOHC motor. I know i'll be studying the starter clutch set up for adaptation on the SOHC motor.

I'm not familiar with the Matic set up so i'll be leaning on our over seas brothern for direction on the clutch/primary set up they used. I've been put on the right path- i can't expect to get spoon fed every step of the way. 

I may end up using the new 73mm Aries pistons i have to build this engine. I can save myself some money by using what i have. I'll have a machine shop bushen the rods to 15mm on the small end for the SOHC wrist pins. That is IF i can find the 1100 rods. My research crossed over  to CB1000 rods having the same part number by the way.

Again, i'm in no rush, this is just something to keep me occupied over the winter time. 

[bear]

Your right Frank there a few Hondas using the MA3 rods.

Cheers,
Brian

[bear]

     Other thoughts - You need to add a tensioner to the primary chain for the stretch that will be happening with drag racing. The primary hy-vo chain needs to be built or sourced for the application. There's no major surprise expenses here.
     Does using Bear's recommendations on the 1100F rods with the factory part number pistons allow you to not need any spacers beyond available head/base gasket thicknesses? I ran a spacer using steel cb750 rods and off the shelf (at the time) Arias 73 mm pistons. In my application it shifted the powerband down which improved my ET about 3 tenths. You'll go quicker so long as it shifts....

Spacers still required Jon.

My thoughts on the primary chain.
The Morse chains we use are very durable, I've never had an issue with them........but.
We have had some problems with the DOHC tensioners we have used in the past.
We have broken a number of thesr units over the years.
These days we use a manual adjuster made by a bloke in NZ and have not had issues since "touch wood".

There are some drawbacks fitting a DOHC tensioner, it requires two lugs to be welded into the bottom crank case.
The welding can be a bit tricky.

Could I suggest an alternative for the application you blokes are using these motors for.
I think a nylon block bolted in place of the tensioner would be a simple solution that would do the job and save a lot of stuffing around.
I would go down this road if I had a brain snap and decided to build another one of these motors from scratch.

My reasoning behind using the MA3 rods are two fold.
They are a very strong rod and they are affordable,  if you can find a set that is.
 They will give you an acceptable stroke/rod ratio.
I have run into problems when I've gone under 1.7/1 in the past.

Cheers,
Brian

[Bill/BentON Racing]

Doesn't Kenny's primary tensioner resemble that description? Haven't seen one yet. Bill

[jweeks]

     I had to use a spacer for the +6mm stroke with standard height pistons. Using a gasket for the base doesn't allow the o-ring that seals the bottom of the block to the upper case half on the Hondamatic setup. I'd assume that the clutch versions are the same. My metal spacer has two o-rings, one on each side of the spacer. I've stayed sealed well there. Unless anyone knows of a sleeve that can replace the o-ring for the application? I use the 900F cam chain tensioner in my stroker with some modifications for mounting as Bear has referenced. Could I get the NZ source of the manual tensioner for this setup? I'm still looking to improve.
     Still curious about how much air the Cycle X heads flow, especially their road racing head. That should have the velocity that Bear and I would like...

[bear]

Billy,

Haven't seen the Cycle-X tensioner either mate but would assume it would be for a SOHC rather than the DOHC units required for these conversions.

Jon,

I was referring to the primary chain tensioner in the previous post.

I use a cam chain adjuster sourced from a Yamaha quad bike on my Hi-Vo's.

The gentleman's name is Brent Hyde.
He fabricates a re-profiled camchain adjuster foot that may be of interest as well.

I will PM his email address.

Cheers,
Brian

[NalleyRacing]

FRANK-BILL - TREY:     E-BAY RC327 CAM  brand new right here in OHIO  $130 today BIDDING STILL GOING ON !

POPS! Now that I looked I have a bunch of spare cams and one of them is a immaculate RC 327. Going to use it this season..

[dragracer]

I like the way my RC327 performs in my motor. I need another one.

[Bill/BentON Racing]

Yeh, me too!  Got one, but got to put it back in Cobra engine! Bill I could sell several if I had 'em!

[cbr954]

I am going to be running 327 cams in both of my motors also.

[BPellerine]

FRANK-BILL - TREY:     E-BAY RC327 CAM  brand new right here in OHIO  $130 today BIDDING STILL GOING ON !

they went fairly cheap!bill

[dragracer]

Who makes a similar cam to the RC327???