Topic: Minimalist Vintage Cafe Racer Project - 1978 CB550k

[MacaveliMC]

Woo hoooooo! Another project to follow!

So I picked up a '78 CB550K a few months ago for $700 because I really wanted a project bike for the winter.

BUT! Before I begin.....can anyone recommend the best place to host pictures from to post on the forum??

Once I do that, I'll throw a bunch of pictures on here for you of the bike and my progress, and I'll tell you all about what I'm doing (or want to do anyway).

Edit: Finally got some pictures uploaded! This is some of the process in taking the entire bike to pieces.






























Tires look a liiiiiiittle bit old 









Now I'm just about ready to remove the engine.....just trying to figure out how I want to do it, and how I'm going to set the engine up to work on.  Ideally I'd like it on an engine stand, but I'm not sure I want to fab up the parts to make it work with an engine stand...

[MacaveliMC]

Thanks!!! There we go then, added pictures to the first post! 

My next problem to solve: getting the engine out and into a position that I can clean it and re-paint it.....possibly replace some gaskets, pretty oil is leaking from somewhere.

[MacaveliMC]

Hmnmmmm.....I'm looking at my picture of the right front axle, and I'm not sure exactly what you are referring to....could you possibly point it out somehow?

[MacaveliMC]

Ooohhhhh I gotcha! Yeah I had no idea.  Clearly someone who owned this before me had some issues in doing things correctly.  You probably didn't notice the arrow on the tire, but the tire is on backwards lol

Thanks for the tip! Now I'll know for sure when putting it back together!

[jaguar]

Why does anyone think that step one is to take a bike apart?
I admit I have fallen into that trap and paid the price for it.

You would think that with SO many people still gravitating to this "cafe racer" bandwagon that more would be able to see the pitfalls of taking the bike apart.

[MacaveliMC]

So, the bike is already almost all apart lol.....the only screw I couldn't get was one of the two holding the left handlebar controls together.....

but I'm glad you said something, because I tried to take the panel off the left side of the engine covering the sprocket and I couldn't even budge any of the screws....I'm guessing this is where your advice will come in handy! You think I can get away without using an impact by chance? Currently don't have one...

[MacaveliMC]

So jaguar, what is the first step?  I made the decision to take the entire bike apart when I realized I'd be modifying or replacing a lot of the bike.  When you're planning on completely stripping and powdercoating the frame, cleaning the engine and painting it, and possibly doing some engine work (and that's all the tip of the iceberg), where would you start?

I tore it apart because I wanted to see the state of every part, and it's been a success thus far 

[MacaveliMC]

You think I can get away without using an impact by chance? Currently don't have one...

Yep. Heat, and use a mallet and "hammer" the bit once, well, then turn it out. The shock and heat usually loosens the screws.

Awesome! That will be super helpful.

[jaguar]

So jaguar, what is the first step?  I made the decision to take the entire bike apart when I realized I'd be modifying or replacing a lot of the bike.  When you're planning on completely stripping and powdercoating the frame, cleaning the engine and painting it, and possibly doing some engine work (and that's all the tip of the iceberg), where would you start?

I tore it apart because I wanted to see the state of every part, and it's been a success thus far 

Evolution, not revolution.
Even the clowns on TV build the bike up 100% before the tear down.

Step one is a solid and reasonable plan.  What do you actually want to do.  This is some times hard because some are not honest.
Do you have the budget for a "full build", do you know what the budget should be?
Are you going for something with real performance upgrades, or are you going for the style of a café racer? 

I always recommend people get the bike running 100% stock to build a solid base line.  This will help you know if the changes you are making down the line are for the good.  I cant tell you how many people I meet with a bike running pods that have zero idea how bad their engine is running, because they have never heard a CB run correctly!

While riding the bike I would tackle some of the maintenance that is needed.
-Shocks (not ebay remote res junk)
-Forks
-tires
-brakes
-ect
These are also good times to upgrade, if you value the performance end of things.

After you have a bike that is fully functional it is now time to blow it all apart and make it look nice.

Many guys have had a frame PC as step one, only to find out that they really should have cut X bracket off, or needed to install Y bracket to make things work.

[MacaveliMC]

So jaguar, what is the first step?  I made the decision to take the entire bike apart when I realized I'd be modifying or replacing a lot of the bike.  When you're planning on completely stripping and powdercoating the frame, cleaning the engine and painting it, and possibly doing some engine work (and that's all the tip of the iceberg), where would you start?

I tore it apart because I wanted to see the state of every part, and it's been a success thus far 

Evolution, not revolution.
Even the clowns on TV build the bike up 100% before the tear down.

Step one is a solid and reasonable plan.  What do you actually want to do.  This is some times hard because some are not honest.
Do you have the budget for a "full build", do you know what the budget should be?
Are you going for something with real performance upgrades, or are you going for the style of a café racer? 

I always recommend people get the bike running 100% stock to build a solid base line.  This will help you know if the changes you are making down the line are for the good.  I cant tell you how many people I meet with a bike running pods that have zero idea how bad their engine is running, because they have never heard a CB run correctly!

While riding the bike I would tackle some of the maintenance that is needed.
-Shocks (not ebay remote res junk)
-Forks
-tires
-brakes
-ect
These are also good times to upgrade, if you value the performance end of things.

After you have a bike that is fully functional it is now time to blow it all apart and make it look nice.

Many guys have had a frame PC as step one, only to find out that they really should have cut X bracket off, or needed to install Y bracket to make things work.

Thanks for the info! Yes these are all things I have thought about.

My plan for the bike is essentially a minimalist design, but regardless of that a lot of the bike is too old or damaged for me to keep, hence the tear down to get rid of a lot of it.

The bike definitely didn't run well when I got it, and an old owner swapped air box for pods without making the necessary changes to the carbs.  I did the basic maintenance to see if I could get it running better, but it didn't help much and I didn't really see the point since I was going to be swapping the exhaust for an 4 into 1 and replacing the points ignition with a dyna.  I'm going to have to do it all over again anyway, might as well only do it once. I have some contacts who do this stuff professionally I'll be questioning to make sure I get the correct setup, as well as all the wonderful people on the forums

Beyond that, my plan is to clean everything up, paint a lot of it, pick out whatever I like as far as handlebars or clip ons, controls, lights, and re-wire the entire bike from scratch.

I plan on stripping the tank and re-painting it.  If I screw it up or can't get it how I want, I've got a professional contact.

I plan on putting on some sort of cafe racer seat and trying to hide all the electronics in the back.

I plan on a lot of stuff, I've definitely set out a plan for the bike and have lots of ideas and contacts to help me get it done but really I'm not worried about it.  I don't need  the bike done by a certain time, it's not a point of stress for me, it's just a fun project to learn on and have fun with. If I miss something and have to work backwards a bit, so be it.  I guess I'll have to spend more time in my garage working on motorcycles, oh the horror

I really appreciate all the input! You guys definitely always add things to my list of considerations when I'm moving forward, as well as point out things I've missed like those front fork caps lol that's the kind of experience I really appreciate on a forum like this!  I'll do my best to keep updating and let you guys know where I'm at! This will probably be one of those projects that takes a new turn at every step, rather than a very specific plan, but....maybe that'll make it more exciting? guess we'll find out!

[MacaveliMC]

So probably the biggest mistake people make when altering their bike/seat is they cut the flat brace out at the rear rails. They do this to install a "flat style seat" and a rear hoop. The problem is they reduce the clearance to the top of the rear tire during suspension travel. So look that over carefully. The cross brace is needed (or at least a closed loop) for rigidity, but plan for the tire space.

Thanks for the tip! So you're saying if I cut it off behind the mounts for the shocks, and have a loop welded on, it may not be stable enough?

[SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan]

So probably the biggest mistake people make when altering their bike/seat is they cut the flat brace out at the rear rails. They do this to install a "flat style seat" and a rear hoop. The problem is they reduce the clearance to the top of the rear tire during suspension travel. So look that over carefully. The cross brace is needed (or at least a closed loop) for rigidity, but plan for the tire space.

Thanks for the tip! So you're saying if I cut it off behind the mounts for the shocks, and have a loop welded on, it may not be stable enough?

No, he is saying that a loop or a flat cross-member is needed to replace the stock fender mount/cross-member.  With the loop, you will be fine.  Just make sure to check your tire clearance to the hoop.

[MacaveliMC]

OK I understand what you are saying.  At the moment my plan is to put the hoop on and probably not have a rear fender arcing over the tire, but I'll definitely be double checking to make sure the tire doesn't impact.

Part of the reason I'm planning on cutting off the back end and putting the hoop on is so the cafe racer rear end will fit well, but I'll be purchasing that first anyway so who knows, maybe I'll be able to fit it well without doing that! If that's the case, forget this whole hoop thing only problem is I really like that hoop with the LED strip built into the back of it....lol, oh well, we'll see what I end up doing. Slow and steady! 

[MacaveliMC]

New pictures!!! Finally got the engine out and onto a stand, and the frame is by itself!




























My next focus is going to be on:

1. Taking the engine apart (probably just top end) and surveying any damage, replacing gaskets....and figuring out the best way to clean the parts to prep for painting....I'm between just using some cleaning supplies (simple green?) and scrubbing with some brass brushes - or doing some full on soda blasting.  Not sure yet.  Any recommendations are welcome

2. Figuring out how I'm going to modify the frame, and how I'm going to strip it for powder coating.  Does anyone know if the tab with the rubber grommet I took a close-up of above is vital to strength of the frame? or can I remove it without consequence?  I'm going to be removing anything on the frame I don't intend to use for the most part. Edit: After reading another post I found, it seems this is totally do-able without issue. Woo hoo!

Thanks for any advice and wisdom!!!

[timbo750]

Although the tab is primarily there for the placement of the rubber grommet, I still believe that it plays a part in the way the bike handles all be it a small one. On many race bikes of the 750 or 500 group you will see braces on the frames in these locations. Also if you look at the welds and the location of the steel tab on the frame it is definitely located at a structural point and there is another tab on the other side. The general rule of thumb with welding is that an inch of weld will hold a ton, bit of an overkill for a side cover.

Now I am not saying don't do it, we must also remember that when these bikes were made every calculation relating to stress and torque was done on paper or chalk board and in many cases it was a case of doing what they knew had worked in the past and some parts were over engineered and some under engineered.

[MacaveliMC]

Thanks for the tips guys!

A question for anyone with powder coating experience:

Do I need to remove the races from the steering column and the bearings from the swingarm in order to get them powder coated?

[Retro Rocket]

Thanks for the tips guys!

A question for anyone with powder coating experience:

Do I need to remove the races from the steering column and the bearings from the swingarm in order to get them powder coated?

Yes, A reputable powder coater wouldn't touch the parts unless the greasy bearings were removed, all sources of contamination should be dealt with properly before coating..

[MacaveliMC]

So the bearings are all out, only thing that is left are the inner races on both sides. If I have to remove those, any tips? I read something in the manual about a special tool.

[Zaipai]

The project is moving nicely.

.: Scott :.

[MacaveliMC]

The project is moving nicely.

.: Scott :.

Thanks! About to start taking the top end of the motor apart, cleaning, and prepping for paint.  Also hoping to strip and paint the gas tank soon as well! Pretty excited, a lot to learn.

[rusty_tank]

Yo dude! So glad to see your project coming together...errr...apart? You know what I mean

Tell me about that engine mount? Is that off an the shelf and you tweeked it a bit?

[MacaveliMC]

Yo dude! So glad to see your project coming together...errr...apart? You know what I mean

Tell me about that engine mount? Is that off an the shelf and you tweeked it a bit?

Engine mount? oh you mean how I adapted the engine stand to work with a motorcycle engine??

I saw another feller did it for his engine, and he was kind enough to supply me with this link to the original: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,138030.0.html

The original used angle iron, cutting it to size and drilling holes. I just bought thick L brackets from home depot with holes already in them  no drilling or cutting required in this adaption! Just buy your hardware and bolt together! More time to cut, drill, re-cut, and re-drill your actual project! 

[rusty_tank]

Engine mount, engine stand...I don't know
Thanks for the link and the info man

[MacaveliMC]

Update!!!

Started taking the engine apart, and already running into some problems












The bolts heads are starting to strip! even with these JIS bits, I can't get some of them to break clean.....

One if them I used my clamp and clamped the socket wrench down hard on it, and managed to turn it and break it free, but I tried the same thing on the bolt in the last picture, and it just destroyed it.....any ideas??

[FunJimmy]

The bolts heads are starting to strip! even with these JIS bits, I can't get some of them to break clean.....

One if them I used my clamp and clamped the socket wrench down hard on it, and managed to turn it and break it free, but I tried the same thing on the bolt in the last picture, and it just destroyed it.....any ideas??

I usually tap them gently with a small hammer.
If they start to strip, stop. Do not allow the head to strip to the degree show in your photos.
Get a 3/8" extension and hammer (firmly) the now flared JIS head flat.
Insert the correct JIS bit and gently tap to seat it fully before trying again. 
Repeat as necessary. Some of those are so far gone that you might have to drill the heads off.
See if you can get Vise-Grips on them and free them up. Good luck.