Topic: high performance street/strip/track motor... advice???

[J.Webster Designs]

i already have the 78 F bottom end... That is the motor that is in the bike right now.... i need to source the K head and K cylinders...  i am still planning things out as i am still in school. I haven't even had time to call Mike to get his opinion on what he thinks about the motor build due to school getting in the way..... I am slowly buying the things that i need for the second build of this bike.

[wannabridin]

justin,

the 40K mile motor in my 76K might be able to be parted out.  the cylinder can go too, but it would need a little bit of work, ie a couple exhaust bungs are messed up from the P.O.

if you're interested, lemme know, i can take some pics of the damages and let you know if i can let the parts go.  i MIGHT keep it around to build it up to be pretty sweet, but i doubt that would happen...  let me know man, i'd rather them go to a good home 

[J.Webster Designs]

shoot some pictures to that email that you already have for me....

[wannabridin]

can do.  sorry for the delays, you know how the school thing goes...

[MRieck]

can do.  sorry for the delays, you know how the school thing goes...

After school it just gets even more busy....believe me.

[Sam Green Racing]

Well please explain why I just saw you on line when you should be working 

Who do you think you are ?....ME!!!!!! 

Sam.

[andy750]

Why are you not working on my motor Sam! Get on with it! 

[Sam Green Racing]

Why are you not working on my motor Sam! Get on with it! 

Well Andy, I got up this morning and looked at it, I looked at it again and then looked at it some more.
I may look at it this afternoon and again this evening, I might even look at it before I go to bed........after all it is right by the fridge where Mike keeps my beer stash. 

Sam.

[andy750]

Hahaha good to know Sam - enjoy the beer! I hope you find the stash of Chimay 

Have a good day
cheers
Andy

[Sam Green Racing]

Hahaha good to know Sam - enjoy the beer! I hope you find the stash of Chimay 

Have a good day
cheers
Andy

He's got that well hidden Andy, I've been looking for it for days, I'm restricted to Boddingtons. 

Sam. 

[andy750]

Hahaha good to know Sam - enjoy the beer! I hope you find the stash of Chimay 

Have a good day
cheers
Andy

He's got that well hidden Andy, I've been looking for it for days, I'm restricted to Boddingtons. 

Sam. 

Ill bring you some next time I come over ;-)

cheers
Andy

[J.Webster Designs]

After school it just gets even more busy....believe me.

Atleast when you guys get done with your work day you have the option to come home and relax..... when you are in school its constant school related crap.... you get done with classes during the day... then you have to come home and keep doing school related work throughout the night...

[Sam Green Racing]

After school it just gets even more busy....believe me.

Atleast when you guys get done with your work day you have the option to come home and relax..... when you are in school its constant school related crap.... you get done with classes during the day... then you have to come home and keep doing school related work throughout the night...

I feel for you my friend but good schooling and good grades make for good jobs, stick at it and good luck.
In Mikes case it's his job, when he gets home he has to contend with me for a few weeks that is.
Now if I could just find his stash of Chimay

Sam.

[wannabridin]

Justin,

Did you take a peek at that e-mail with the pics of my head?  Let me know what you think.  Also, any more decisions/purchases been made for the motor?

[Retro Rocket]

Did you take a peek at that e-mail with the pics of my head?

Yeah, you need a haircut and your eye's are too close together......

Mick

[wannabridin]

justin,

any updates on your new project??  how'd the semester end up?  all A's i hope??   

[sangyo soichiro]

I'm looking at doing a very similar thing to my engine.  I believe I'll go with the forged 836 Wiseco pistons over the cast ones other places offer.  Have you made a decision yet? 

I don't think I'll need new rods because I think it might be overkill for an 836.  Ditto for the primary chain.  For the camshaft, I'll just go for a 'hot street,' although I'm still trying to learn about the subtleties of these things.  Many of the other things you mention I'm wanting also.  You and I pretty much have the same end goal as far as a hot, reliable street engine.  I'll be following this thread closely.


And I'm still waiting to hear the answer to this question:

Crank - will probably have APE do their magic on it. how extensive should i go before you start getting into reliability and running problems?

[J.Webster Designs]

decisions have not been made yet.... i had to wait for the semester to be over and get done with finals... (all B's) .. and had to buy stuff for christmas... so maybe the beginning of the year i will get to call Mreick and see what he thinks..

I will keep you guys posted with what ends up happening.

[MCRider]

I'm looking at doing a very similar thing to my engine.  I believe I'll go with the forged 836 Wiseco pistons over the cast ones other places offer.  Have you made a decision yet? 

I don't think I'll need new rods because I think it might be overkill for an 836.  Ditto for the primary chain.  For the camshaft, I'll just go for a 'hot street,' although I'm still trying to learn about the subtleties of these things.  Many of the other things you mention I'm wanting also.  You and I pretty much have the same end goal as far as a hot, reliable street engine.  I'll be following this thread closely.


And I'm still waiting to hear the answer to this question:

Crank - will probably have APE do their magic on it. how extensive should i go before you start getting into reliability and running problems?

My opinion, in answer to the question: There is no reliability or running problems with a modified crank. You go as far as APE will take it, and they are very experienced in this area, and you are likely to increase relaibility and running efficiency. You are balancing it, which is always a good thing. And you are lightening it and they will stop before hitting any problem areas. Properly lightened it should reduce stress.  Biggest crank related problem has always been with the alternator. An old style heavy alternator rotor on a hyper motor would twist the end off the crank from inertia. Not a crank problem a rotor problem. Later style rotors are lightened, or you can have APE lighten an old style, no more problem.

[sangyo soichiro]

I'm looking at doing a very similar thing to my engine.  I believe I'll go with the forged 836 Wiseco pistons over the cast ones other places offer.  Have you made a decision yet? 

I don't think I'll need new rods because I think it might be overkill for an 836.  Ditto for the primary chain.  For the camshaft, I'll just go for a 'hot street,' although I'm still trying to learn about the subtleties of these things.  Many of the other things you mention I'm wanting also.  You and I pretty much have the same end goal as far as a hot, reliable street engine.  I'll be following this thread closely.


And I'm still waiting to hear the answer to this question:

Crank - will probably have APE do their magic on it. how extensive should i go before you start getting into reliability and running problems?

My opinion, in answer to the question: There is no reliability or running problems with a modified crank. You go as far as APE will take it, and they are very experienced in this area, and you are likely to increase relaibility and running efficiency. You are balancing it, which is always a good thing. And you are lightening it and they will stop before hitting any problem areas. Properly lightened it should reduce stress.  Biggest crank related problem has always been with the alternator. An old style heavy alternator rotor on a hyper motor would twist the end off the crank from inertia. Not a crank problem a rotor problem. Later style rotors are lightened, or you can have APE lighten an old style, no more problem.

I didn't know about the alternator rotor being a potential problem.  That's good to know.  Thanks for pointing that out MCRider!

[MCRider]

I'm looking at doing a very similar thing to my engine.  I believe I'll go with the forged 836 Wiseco pistons over the cast ones other places offer.  Have you made a decision yet? 

I don't think I'll need new rods because I think it might be overkill for an 836.  Ditto for the primary chain.  For the camshaft, I'll just go for a 'hot street,' although I'm still trying to learn about the subtleties of these things.  Many of the other things you mention I'm wanting also.  You and I pretty much have the same end goal as far as a hot, reliable street engine.  I'll be following this thread closely.


And I'm still waiting to hear the answer to this question:

Crank - will probably have APE do their magic on it. how extensive should i go before you start getting into reliability and running problems?

My opinion, in answer to the question: There is no reliability or running problems with a modified crank. You go as far as APE will take it, and they are very experienced in this area, and you are likely to increase relaibility and running efficiency. You are balancing it, which is always a good thing. And you are lightening it and they will stop before hitting any problem areas. Properly lightened it should reduce stress.  Biggest crank related problem has always been with the alternator. An old style heavy alternator rotor on a hyper motor would twist the end off the crank from inertia. Not a crank problem a rotor problem. Later style rotors are lightened, or you can have APE lighten an old style, no more problem.

I didn't know about the alternator rotor being a potential problem.  That's good to know.  Thanks for pointing that out MCRider!

I've seen 3 cranks with their noses twisted off in my lifetime. Customer comes in with a dead battery on a big bore bike. Check the charging system...dead. Otherwise it was running fine. High RPM speed shifts no problem.     Customer says Oh yeah seems like it had more pep right before it died.  Duh! Didn't need to spin that heavy old rotor anymore.

Honda picked up on this and began using lighter rotors in the K4/K5 area. Very obvious, the flange was machined off of the rotor. Not as light as APE might take it but close enough. If you have one of the earlier heavy rotors, with a big flange on it, you'll want to have it worked on. You can take about 3lbs+/- off an old rotor, about 1 lb+/- off a newer one.

[wannabridin]

hey MC,

i have a K6, so i have the lighter rotor.  can you help enlighten me on why i've read some people saying there's issues with running a lightened crank on a decent running 836 kit?  i think i've made the decision to build the motor properly when i get some funds...  what do they lighten on a rotor, and do you have to run a kick only when you do this? 

after enough consultation with Mreick, i've decided to go with the big bore kit, so i'm looking for some smooth power that's good for an all day cruise if needed!!  i don't think i'm going to go with new rods, just use some F rod ends from Mreick and have the K rods shot peened and cryo'd.  so any input is appreciated! 

sorry to partially thread jack justin, but i figured this could help everyone!  oh ya, did you get those pics of my motor?

[wannabridin]

one other thing...  what about the welded valve covers?  do they make a difference with a build like this??

[Howell]

See my tips on this topic: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=62985.0

[Big Jay]

hey MC,

i have a K6, so i have the lighter rotor.  can you help enlighten me on why i've read some people saying there's issues with running a lightened crank on a decent running 836 kit? 

I have never heard of anyone having issues of any kind running a lightened crank in a Honda.

Couple of other things brought up on this thread.

Lightened rotors.. Way back when, we used to do this with the old style that had the big flamge on them. They also needed to be welded.  Then the factory went to the light rotor that was factory welded. We tried to further lighten a few of those, and ran into issues with the models that had the headlight on all of the time, having the battery go dead. So we stopped doing that. The factory light ones are good.

Rods.... If you have the late style rods ( not 69 - 71?) in a street bike with an 836, you should be OK.