Author Topic: Danielle CB550K Build - Toyon Moto Club #5  (Read 89784 times)

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Offline Blackfin5

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Danielle CB550K Build - Toyon Moto Club #5
« on: October 13, 2013, 05:51:21 PM »
I've started this build a few months ago and promised Fun Jimmy I would start a project topic here.  It is literally a frame up build - I started only with a frame and will be picking up all other parts and the engine separately.  I got the frame after confirming that a vintage build can be registered with the CA DMV even though I have no title for the "frame."  It's a 1978 frame so I will try to use only a '78 engine and parts.  The frame is currently with Rob North for stiffening/bracing/gusseting and to weld on the seat base hoop.

Here's the frame after sandblasting off the old paint and surface rust.  I was very happy with it because it is very straight and has no rust cancer.



I then started cutting off tabs (keeping the side covers and battery there) and cutting the frame for the hoop.  The hoop in a mock up.



Found a 78 tank (sans locking mechanism) and purchased a Pinas seat base from Benjie.  I stresed to Benjie the importance to me of no bondo or filler.  Except for the green slim coating and the need for some fitment work, I was fairly pleased with his seat base.







I used to have a CB450 twin, which I should have never sold (to a cousin for $1).  It was a metallic blue/aqua with a silver frame.  So at least at this moment, when the frame comes back from Rob North, I will most likely powder coat in silver with the tank. seat and fender in a Gulfstream Aqua pearl from Custom House, which is local to me.  Thinking of black or silver for the side covers.



Until this build is complete, this is my weekend ride.



More later.  I have some new shiny things to show off.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2014, 08:50:21 PM by Blackfin5 »

Offline Blackfin5

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Re: 550 Frame-Up Build
« Reply #1 on: October 13, 2013, 06:06:42 PM »
I've been looking for and collecting 1978 engine and parts; thus, the reason for not starting this thread right after getting the frame.

Excel rims.  WM3-19" and WM4-18".   Ordered BT-45Vs in a 100/90-19 front and 120/80-18 rear.



New fork tubes from TNK.  Despite looking a lot, I just wasn't happy with any of the used tubes I came across.  570 mm.



Went to RaceTech for new fork springs and Gold valve cartridge emulators.  This bike will be for both street and some track so I wanted to get the most out of the "stock" cases and tubes.



Drilled out the dampers as required for the emulators.  I did not weld closed the tiny upper rebound holes, is this correct?  I've seen guys not weld any, weld closed one, and weld closed both.  Is there a preferred choice here?  I did not weld closed any.  Even Race Tech is inconsistent on this.



After polishing the fork cases I found through a salavge parts guy, I finished the fork build today.

edit..... these forks must have come off a 500.  They are only 12-1/2".   The fender mounting holes line up the same height as 550 14" cases; however, the upper lip where a Tarozzi fork brace attaches is 1-1/2" lower than the top of 550 lowers.  I hope the fork brace doesn't interfere with the fender.



And finally ..... the new engine.  In great shape and had good compression.  Except for the cosmetic stuff, I'm going to drop it off with Chris at motogpwerk for rebuilding out to 592 and balancing.

« Last Edit: February 01, 2014, 06:30:17 PM by Blackfin5 »

Offline Blackfin5

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Re: 550 Frame-Up Build
« Reply #2 on: October 13, 2013, 06:16:09 PM »
Also today, I got the front and rear hubs and brake plate polished up.  They look great - the photo doesn't do them justice.







Although the rear hub was listed as off a '78 CB550, I think it's actually a '76.  As long as the brake plate fits cleanly with the hub, it's all good.  I like it better anyway because it has a cleaner look without the reinforcing ribs as on the 77s and 78s.  It may need a 76 collar though, which I think is a bit longer.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2013, 06:18:23 PM by Blackfin5 »

Offline Blackfin5

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Re: 550 Frame-Up Build
« Reply #3 on: October 13, 2013, 06:26:43 PM »
I have the choice of 3 front fenders.  I like the polished aluminum one the best, but the one on the left has the nicest fit for a 100/90 front tire.  So it will share the same paint as the tank.


Offline SF

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Re: 550 Frame-Up Build
« Reply #4 on: October 13, 2013, 08:54:54 PM »
Nice bike and looking forward to the frame and engine mods
92 wr250 sold
98 zx6r sold
04 zx10r
73 cb350 twin
75 cb550f
75 cb550f
72 r5c
rgid springer bobber project

Offline brandEn

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Re: 550 Frame-Up Build
« Reply #5 on: October 13, 2013, 08:59:53 PM »
This looks like its gonna be a sweet build!

« Last Edit: October 13, 2013, 09:03:54 PM by brandEn »

Offline Blackfin5

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Re: 550 Frame-Up Build
« Reply #6 on: October 14, 2013, 09:30:12 AM »
bransEn - I have some Ballast Point micro to keep me motivated!

Offline brandEn

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Re: 550 Frame-Up Build
« Reply #7 on: October 14, 2013, 09:46:13 AM »
oh yea. Makes wrenching much more enjoyable 8)

Offline Blackfin5

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Re: 550 Frame-Up Build
« Reply #8 on: October 14, 2013, 05:51:11 PM »
I took good advantage of Columbus Day and started tearing down the engine so I could send out the head and cyclinder block for the rebuild.  The phillips screws on the cam cover were impossible.  So were the stator cover screws.  I had to use a lot of heat and brute force.  Stripped a couple and luckily the small easy out saved the day.  I'm going to try to replace all screws with hex heads.  It doesn't seem like anyone has ever opened up this engine before.  Even though this motor is old, I'm very pleased with the overall condition of everything - not one broken or damaged cooling fin.  It should be a great foundation for a 592cc build.




Offline Blackfin5

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Re: 550 Frame-Up Build
« Reply #9 on: October 14, 2013, 05:54:13 PM »
The biggest frustration after getting off the cam cover is that the center bolt for the oil filter cover is frozen solid.  My socket is stripping the bolt head.  Tried the heat gun but the bolt threads are too deep inside the cover for the heat to be effective.  Any suggestions.........?
« Last Edit: October 14, 2013, 06:38:51 PM by Blackfin5 »

Offline Blackfin5

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Re: 550 Frame-Up Build
« Reply #10 on: October 15, 2013, 12:08:35 PM »
Will be installing wheel bearings and axle collars, etc. today so I can send off rims and hubs to Buchannan's for spoke lacing.  Minor disappointment - it turns out that RaceTech gave me the wrong adaptors for the Gold Valve emulators.  I got the adaptor without piston rings.  The original dampening rods on which the adaptor and emulators sit on top inside the tube did not have a piston ring to prevent fluid from flowing along the inner wall of the fork tube (or at least not an effective one).  The correct adaptor have the required piston rings.  Oh well, they should get here soon.

Offline Blackfin5

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Re: 550 Frame-Up Build
« Reply #11 on: October 26, 2013, 03:21:14 PM »
Well, I finally broke the case apart.  Gears, bearings and journals look great. 



The stator is now out.  The stator rotor was a bear to pull.  I should have done that before the case was split to get better leverage, but with the right puller and impact wrench it broke free.  The stator looks a little scorched in one part so I am looking for someone to re-wrap.



By far the most difficult and frustrating parts of the teardown thus far were the oil filter center bolt and the case studs.  With some heat and a slightly smaller socket (11 mm) forced onto to oil filter bolt head after getting it red hot, I let it cool and then used a freon blast to ice it down to try to break the corrosion bond.  That worked!  I ordered a replacement with a larger head bolt.

For the studs, I used a tried and true method - but it takes days of patience. They were very badly rusted and seized - I was worried about breaking them off.  I almost had to give up.  But after 5 days of soaking the exposed tops of the threads with PB Blaster, on the 5th day I torqued on new 8mm double nuts on the top threads and carefully heated the area of the case surrounding the embedded threads.  I then protected the case area I had heated and used more freon to put a shiver down the vein of the stud from the double nuts down.  With a large vice grip close to the base, a closed-end wrench on the double nut, and with both feet against the case, I tugged as hard as I could, trying to budge the seized stud only a little bit at a time and appling more PB down the threads.  Luckily, I got them all out without breaking any.  A couple almost sheared off, but stopped in time and applying more heat - then ice.  I think by contracting the stud with freon while heating up the aluminum really helps to break the rust/corrosion bond.  I squirted a stream of PB Blaster in the case stud holes and flushed out more rust than I thought I would see.  Next time, silver non-seize paste for sure.  I don't want the next guy (if there is one) to have to deal with that.





The stator cover had some deep gouges which I sanded completed out.  I sanded with 120 grit.  Those last couple of scratches came out nicely and now the cover is being sanded down to 1200 grit and then it will be polished up.



The good news is that my new 592 10.5 compression ratio pistons, APE studs, Black Diamond +1 intake and exhaust valves, valve springs and titanium retainers are on their way already from Dynoman.  Thanks, Buzz.  I initially wanted the Carrill H-beam rods, but they were almost $1200 for a set.  Ouch!  I still may go for the Carrillos once I get over the sticker shock.  Those Carrillos are great rods in any application.
« Last Edit: October 26, 2013, 03:25:42 PM by Blackfin5 »

Offline Blackfin5

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Re: Gulfstream 550 Frame-Up Build
« Reply #12 on: October 31, 2013, 09:37:24 PM »
Today I spent several hours prepping the tank for POR-15.  During the cleaning process I was surprised to see so much rust being flushed out of the tank.  After the 96 hr recommended cure, I will be running several gallons of gas through in order to see whether it drains clear.  With the effort and cost I'm putting into the engine, the last thing I want to do is run rust through the engine.  Ordered a new internal filter for the tank (surprised Honda still has them available for a '78 tank).  I will not start on the tank paint until I'm satisfied that the POR-15 resolved the rust contamination issue.



Finished stripping the cases - removed and inspected the crank and rods,  As mentioned earlier, I was set on Carrillo rods until I was quoted the price.  Instead, I'm sending the rods along with the crank and rotor to APE.  The crank will be balanced and only slightly lightened.  They will check the journals to see if they are out of round (I can already tell they are fine because the bearing and journals look great).  I do want the main journals and rod pins mic'ed to determine what size new bearings to get.  The lower case is stamped "A A A A" and the five main bearings are all "A"s.  The rods will be slightly lightened and balanced to the same weight, then peen shot.  The rod bearings are all "black." The rotor will be balanced and also only slightly lightened.  I may have APE only micro "kiss" the journals depending on what they say after mic'ing everything.

I had originally planned to blast and powder coat the engine cases, cylinders and head; except I'm concerned about the mating surfaces getting powder coat and getting glass beads lodged somewhere indiscriminately.  I picked up some Dupli-color engine enaml with ceramic (aluminum color).  So I have started with the paint stripper on the cases.  Are there any real negatives to using Dupli-color - such as gas spills, durability, fade, etc ..... ???






The wheel bearings are now in, so off to Buchannans with the Excel rims for SS spoke lacing/tuning.





Still waiting for Rob North to finish the frame.  Checked in on him yesterday - not much progress, but you can't rush a legend. 
« Last Edit: October 31, 2013, 09:57:33 PM by Blackfin5 »

Offline SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan

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Re: Gulfstream 550 Frame-Up Build
« Reply #13 on: October 31, 2013, 09:51:53 PM »
Spill gas on VHT/Duplicolor painted surfaces and you will get the pee yellow stains.  Powdercoat is more resistant to stains, chips, fade, etc.
1975 CB550K1 "Blue" Stockish Restomod (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=135005.0)
1975 CB550F1 frame/CB650 engine hybrid "The Hot Mess" (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,150220.0.html)
2008 Triumph Thruxton (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,190956.0.html)
2014 MV Agusta Brutale Dragster 800
2015 Yamaha FZ-09 (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,186861.0.html)

"There are some things nobody needs in this world, and a bright-red, hunch-back, warp-speed 900cc cafe racer is one of them — but I want one anyway, and on some days I actually believe I need one.... Being shot out of a cannon will always be better than being squeezed out of a tube. That is why God made fast motorcycles, Bubba." Hunter S. Thompson, Song of the Sausage Creature, Cycle World, March 1995.  (http://www.latexnet.org/~csmith/sausage.html and https://magazine.cycleworld.com/article/1995/3/1/song-of-the-sausage-creature)

Sold/Emeritus
1973 CB750K2 "Bionic Mongrel" (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=132734.0) - Sold
1977 CB750K7 "Nine Lives" Restomod (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=50490.0) - Sold
2005 RVT1000RR RC51-SP2 "El Diablo" - Sold
2016+ Triumph Thruxton 1200 R (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,170198.0.html) - Sold

Offline Blackfin5

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Re: Gulfstream 550 Frame-Up Build
« Reply #14 on: November 01, 2013, 02:32:07 PM »
Dynoman's stuff arrived today.  Just had to unwrap one of the 61s pistons.  Gawd, I love new forged stuff.  Now I'm craving for those Carrillo rods.



Getting ready to paint or powder coat the cylinder jugs and head.  Stripped and degreased - ready to go.  I am terrible with colors.  As I started this thread, I mentioned that the body parts will be in Gulfstream aqua - pearl.  I'm either going to powder coat the frame black, with shiny aluminum color head and jugs; or silver frame with black head and jugs.  I've never been very good at envisioning colors in my head.

Offline SF

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Re: Gulfstream 550 Frame-Up Build
« Reply #15 on: November 01, 2013, 08:20:51 PM »
I'd go with the colour of those pistons ;D
92 wr250 sold
98 zx6r sold
04 zx10r
73 cb350 twin
75 cb550f
75 cb550f
72 r5c
rgid springer bobber project

Offline Kemp

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Re: Gulfstream 550 Frame-Up Build
« Reply #16 on: November 02, 2013, 09:36:11 AM »
Can you shoot a couple of pics of the new race tech emulators with piston rings. You're old damper tubes have a piston ring on them, but as you say, they may not be as effective as new emulators with their own piston rings. I've used emulators without the rings (Mikes XS) and they make a big difference in feel and performance on the CB550. Really curious to see if the race tech version is noticeably better

Offline Blackfin5

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Re: Gulfstream 550 Frame-Up Build
« Reply #17 on: November 05, 2013, 12:50:17 AM »
Hi Kemp.  Funny you should ask.  The RaceTech literature clearly specifies using an emulator adaptor with a piston ring for the vintage bikes which have the conventional dampening rods, noting that the original dampening rod piston rings are ineffectual.  Hence, RaceTech came up with an adaptor which has its own piston ring.  The adaptor sits directly on top of the damper, under the emulator, and the adaptor piston ring is supposed to work better than the rings on the dampers.  Well, when I receive my RaceTech parts, the adaptor enclosed did not have piston rings.  So instead of returning them, I pick up the phone and talk to a "sales tech" (more sales, less tech) who says, "Yah, you need the adaptor with the piston ring - part no. AD3003-P."  For about $20 I ordered a pair, not wanting to wait on a return.  When the second set of adaptors arrived, they had no piston rings.  I call the "tech" back and after a lot of verbal mumbling and fumbling, he says, "you were sent the right ones - no piston rings for your application."  If you go to the RaceTech product search page, it will show the adpartor for a CB550K & F to be AD3003-P.  The "P" in RaceTech adaptors means with piston rings.  Now I don't know who is correct - the "tech" or RaceTech's own literature.  I need to call back and talk to someone who knows what he's talking about instead of some sales guy looking up parts on a computer screen who knows nothing about Gold Valve applications for CB550s.  Maybe the third time will be the charm.
« Last Edit: November 05, 2013, 08:39:19 AM by Blackfin5 »

Offline Blackfin5

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Re: Gulfstream 550 Frame-Up Build
« Reply #18 on: November 06, 2013, 05:38:16 PM »
Upper and lower case completely stripped - inside and out.  They're off to the powder coater with strict instructions about the gasket and bearing surfaces.

Tank is done and primered - ready for paint, as are the seat base and fender.  Just waiting for final mock up for precision fit once Mr. North is finished welding up the frame.


Offline Blackfin5

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Re: Gulfstream 550 Frame-Up Build
« Reply #19 on: November 06, 2013, 05:40:54 PM »

Offline Blackfin5

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Re: Gulfstream 550 Frame-Up Build
« Reply #20 on: November 07, 2013, 06:01:42 PM »
Crank and rods off to APE.  Still Jonesing over the Carrillos.  Probably don't really need them for my application - 592 cc pistons, 10.5 CR, with +1 valves, but I want them.  Mulling over who to send the head to.  APE?  M.R.?   Where can I look up the difference between Mike's Stage II and III builds?  Which makes more sense to compliment what I have?
« Last Edit: November 07, 2013, 06:05:28 PM by Blackfin5 »

Offline SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan

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Re: Gulfstream 550 Frame-Up Build
« Reply #21 on: November 07, 2013, 08:36:43 PM »
Mike's different Port Job Stages (call or PM for current pricing):

Stage 1: Includes the following. Disassemble, inspect, hot tank, bead blast entire head, porting
and reassembly. OEM valve guide seals are extra OR can be provided by the customer.

Stage 2: Same as above but more extensive porting especially around the guide boss and intake
floor.

Stage 3: Requires removal of valve guides. Extensive reshaping of both intake and exhaust ports.
Epoxy reinforced intake spigots. This head will require new guides, guide honing and a Serdi
valve job. Basic price minus guide and valve seat work….please take note!!! This head
performs best with oversize (33.5) intake valves and cams with lifts .360 and over. A great
performing street head with 836cc and larger…..This head kicks ass…..no disappointments no
matter the displacement (400cc, 500/550cc, 750 etc.).
1975 CB550K1 "Blue" Stockish Restomod (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=135005.0)
1975 CB550F1 frame/CB650 engine hybrid "The Hot Mess" (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,150220.0.html)
2008 Triumph Thruxton (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,190956.0.html)
2014 MV Agusta Brutale Dragster 800
2015 Yamaha FZ-09 (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,186861.0.html)

"There are some things nobody needs in this world, and a bright-red, hunch-back, warp-speed 900cc cafe racer is one of them — but I want one anyway, and on some days I actually believe I need one.... Being shot out of a cannon will always be better than being squeezed out of a tube. That is why God made fast motorcycles, Bubba." Hunter S. Thompson, Song of the Sausage Creature, Cycle World, March 1995.  (http://www.latexnet.org/~csmith/sausage.html and https://magazine.cycleworld.com/article/1995/3/1/song-of-the-sausage-creature)

Sold/Emeritus
1973 CB750K2 "Bionic Mongrel" (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=132734.0) - Sold
1977 CB750K7 "Nine Lives" Restomod (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=50490.0) - Sold
2005 RVT1000RR RC51-SP2 "El Diablo" - Sold
2016+ Triumph Thruxton 1200 R (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,170198.0.html) - Sold

Offline Blackfin5

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Re: Gulfstream 550 Frame-Up Build
« Reply #22 on: November 08, 2013, 07:10:13 AM »
Perfect.  Thanks, Fan, for the reply.  I could only find some references on the forum but nothing that explained the differences.  Much appreciated. I'll send Mike a PM and see if he's taking new orders.

Offline Blackfin5

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Re: Gulfstream 550 Frame-Up Build
« Reply #23 on: November 08, 2013, 08:26:24 AM »
Sounds like Stage III is the way to go and in line with what I was thinking.  I've seen mention of a Stage IV - assuming it must be race application only.

Offline SOHC4 Cafe Racer Fan

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Re: Gulfstream 550 Frame-Up Build
« Reply #24 on: November 08, 2013, 11:48:20 PM »
Sounds like Stage III is the way to go and in line with what I was thinking.  I've seen mention of a Stage IV - assuming it must be race application only.

Stage 4 is a Stage 3 with the Kibblewhite 5mm valve conversion kit (34mm intake/28mm exhaust valves, guides, seals, springs, Ti retainers, spring bases and lash caps.
1975 CB550K1 "Blue" Stockish Restomod (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=135005.0)
1975 CB550F1 frame/CB650 engine hybrid "The Hot Mess" (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,150220.0.html)
2008 Triumph Thruxton (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,190956.0.html)
2014 MV Agusta Brutale Dragster 800
2015 Yamaha FZ-09 (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,186861.0.html)

"There are some things nobody needs in this world, and a bright-red, hunch-back, warp-speed 900cc cafe racer is one of them — but I want one anyway, and on some days I actually believe I need one.... Being shot out of a cannon will always be better than being squeezed out of a tube. That is why God made fast motorcycles, Bubba." Hunter S. Thompson, Song of the Sausage Creature, Cycle World, March 1995.  (http://www.latexnet.org/~csmith/sausage.html and https://magazine.cycleworld.com/article/1995/3/1/song-of-the-sausage-creature)

Sold/Emeritus
1973 CB750K2 "Bionic Mongrel" (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=132734.0) - Sold
1977 CB750K7 "Nine Lives" Restomod (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=50490.0) - Sold
2005 RVT1000RR RC51-SP2 "El Diablo" - Sold
2016+ Triumph Thruxton 1200 R (http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php/topic,170198.0.html) - Sold