Author Topic: CB750 1000cc RC Cobra Rebuild  (Read 54337 times)

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Offline michrobi

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CB750 1000cc RC Cobra Rebuild
« on: June 24, 2009, 09:36:19 PM »
Hi fellas. I hope you guys can find it in your hearts to forgive me for being so stupid and having such a wonderful piece of machinery. That said, let it begin...

Rocker cover off



CAM removed



CAM



Head removed



Head



Cylinder case removed



Cylinder case



Cylinder sleeve #4 and what's left of a once proud RC Goldenrod



I expected less space between the cylinders, a nice chunk in there though. That's it for tonight.   :)

« Last Edit: June 24, 2009, 11:03:47 PM by michrobi »
-Mike

'78 CB750F All stock except for the powerplant. Jived it off my Dad in the spring of '94. He had it since 1980 and it's the first bike I ever rode on.

Current project: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=67756

How's them SOHC4 patches coming?

Offline 754

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Re: CB750 1000cc RC Cobra Rebuild
« Reply #1 on: June 24, 2009, 09:45:21 PM »
It looks like a 1080 cc

 Is the cam a 327?...or a 315?
Maker of the WELDLESS 750 Frame Kit
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My next bike will be a ..ANFOB.....

It's All part of the ADVENTURE...

73 836cc.. Green, had it for 3 decades!!
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Offline michrobi

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Re: CB750 1000cc RC Cobra Rebuild
« Reply #2 on: June 24, 2009, 09:50:36 PM »
I don't think it's an RC CAM. It's just a .360... let me run out to the garage and take a shot of the CAM spec sheet...
-Mike

'78 CB750F All stock except for the powerplant. Jived it off my Dad in the spring of '94. He had it since 1980 and it's the first bike I ever rode on.

Current project: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=67756

How's them SOHC4 patches coming?

Offline michrobi

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Re: CB750 1000cc RC Cobra Rebuild
« Reply #3 on: June 24, 2009, 10:00:19 PM »


and here is everything

-Mike

'78 CB750F All stock except for the powerplant. Jived it off my Dad in the spring of '94. He had it since 1980 and it's the first bike I ever rode on.

Current project: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=67756

How's them SOHC4 patches coming?

Offline BLUE71TURBO

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Re: CB750 1000cc RC Cobra Rebuild
« Reply #4 on: June 24, 2009, 10:07:09 PM »
The pistons don't look like they have much of a dome on them. Do you know what the compression ratio is?
Remember; Before you can be old and wise, you must first be young and stupid !

Offline michrobi

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Re: CB750 1000cc RC Cobra Rebuild
« Reply #5 on: June 24, 2009, 10:11:32 PM »
11.5:1

Those pistons are out of something. A 500 or 600 or something. My dad is trying to remember.
-Mike

'78 CB750F All stock except for the powerplant. Jived it off my Dad in the spring of '94. He had it since 1980 and it's the first bike I ever rode on.

Current project: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=67756

How's them SOHC4 patches coming?

Offline Jerry Rxman Griffin aka MuthaF'er

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Re: CB750 1000cc RC Cobra Rebuild
« Reply #6 on: June 24, 2009, 10:47:31 PM »
Looked like "RC" on the cam picture.

What size valves?

Would be great if you could scan all the literature.
As of today 3/13/2012 my original owner 75 CB750F has made it through 3 wives, er EX-wives. Free at last.  ;-)

Offline michrobi

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Re: CB750 1000cc RC Cobra Rebuild
« Reply #7 on: June 24, 2009, 11:03:15 PM »
Scanning the literature is a good idea just for redundancy sake. I'll get that worked out. The Valves look like 28 ex and 32 int at first glance. I'll likely be sending it to MRieck for a face lift if I can get the bottom end replicated in a later case, bore that case and re-sleeve the #4 cylinder successfully. If all that falls into place, I think the resurrection is doable, and I'll hold off on my 836 project.
« Last Edit: June 24, 2009, 11:04:57 PM by michrobi »
-Mike

'78 CB750F All stock except for the powerplant. Jived it off my Dad in the spring of '94. He had it since 1980 and it's the first bike I ever rode on.

Current project: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=67756

How's them SOHC4 patches coming?

Offline HondaMan

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Re: CB750 1000cc RC Cobra Rebuild
« Reply #8 on: June 25, 2009, 06:57:42 AM »
A tip when you reassemble (from my upcoming book, "Performance" chapter):

In your first picture of the top end, it shows the K3 and later style rocker shafts with the 2 tiny 5mm bolts on each rocker shaft that locks it in place. This late-model mod by Honda costs HP and wears the rocker shafts very quickly, because the oil grooves in the rocker shafts seldom lined up with the oil holes in the rockers. You can change this and recover the HP and greatly extend the life of the rocker shafts (presuming you do NOT buy Honda's current rocker shafts) with the following steps:

1. Remove the eight 5mm bolts and throw them in your spares.
2. Assemble the rockers on the shafts in the cam towers and snug in the middle mounting bolt. Slide the rocker shaft to the left and right, as shown in the pictures below, and check to see if the oil groove is still visible through the oil hole(s) in the rocker(s). Chances are, not when at one extreme or the other (sometimes not even when the shaft is centered!).
3. Elongate the oil hole(s) as needed (as shown in the pix) with a tapered grinder stone, so the oil groove is always exposed to the oil hole. Usually this involves opening the hole toward the rocker's backbone ridge.
4. When reassembling in the final buildup, install one of the little 5mm bolts temporarily into one of the holes as a "handle" to let you turn the shaft back & forth while torquing down the long center bolt. This bolt should only be tightened to 7 ft-lbs, BTW: not covered in most manuals. When tightened down, make sure the shaft can still rotate, testing it with the little 5mm bolt handle. Then remove the 5mm bolt.

This process allows the rocker shaft to rotate while running, which distributes the wear and oil, and reduces friction.

One caveat: if you have a high-lift cam and are worried about breaking the rocker shaft and having the pieces slide out, consider just Loctiting the 5mm bolts into position, but not tightening them. At the same time, open up the rocker tower's holes so the shaft can at least rock back and forth a little bit.

Honda's current replacement rocker shafts have half-moon-shaped center "grooves" where the longer bolt goes through to hold the shaft in place. This does not allow for rotation of the shaft at all. And, the last new shafts I saw did not even have oiling grooves underneath the oil holes in the rockers! If you get new shafts, I recommend grinding in your own oiling grooves at least, and grinding the center groove all around, as well. If you go out and buy some 12.00mm Thomson shaft, which comes in 12" long pieces, you can make your own, sans 5mm holes altogether like the K0-K2 shafts, for a lot less $$.  ;)
« Last Edit: June 25, 2009, 07:03:27 AM by HondaMan »
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Offline michrobi

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Re: CB750 1000cc RC Cobra Rebuild
« Reply #9 on: June 25, 2009, 08:57:26 AM »
The CAM is definitely not RC. What looks like RC on the shaft in the pic is "R6". On the flip-side it has "Norris" carved into it. It was a custom order, but we can reproduce it with that spec sheet there.

The sleeves measure 70.91mm inner bore, and 76.27 outer. So I'm assuming those pistons are a 71mm bore. I haven't asked directly (yet), but I assume Big Jay can take care of the necessary repairs to the cylinders. As it turns out, this is the second RC goldenrod this engine has eaten. And it had a different HD rod let go before the goldenrods were put in. I think I am going to take a look at rods and see what's out there in 2009. I know Carrillo and Cycle-x have some good stuff that I want to evaluate. The super crank package APE has looks really nice also.

BTW - you guys are getting your stuff together to build your Cobra replicas as we go right?   :D
« Last Edit: June 25, 2009, 09:10:37 AM by michrobi »
-Mike

'78 CB750F All stock except for the powerplant. Jived it off my Dad in the spring of '94. He had it since 1980 and it's the first bike I ever rode on.

Current project: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=67756

How's them SOHC4 patches coming?

Offline 754

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Re: CB750 1000cc RC Cobra Rebuild
« Reply #10 on: June 25, 2009, 09:14:46 AM »
I am building a 970cc.. saving the 1000c for overbore purposes..

 if your bores are loose, you will have to resleeve or go out to 1080cc
 what can you tell us about the crank, Is it lightened? and stock stroke ?

 Tell us what the END of the cam has marked on it.
Maker of the WELDLESS 750 Frame Kit
dodogas99@gmail.com
Kelowna B.C.       Canada

My next bike will be a ..ANFOB.....

It's All part of the ADVENTURE...

73 836cc.. Green, had it for 3 decades!!
Lost quite a few CB 750's along the way

Offline michrobi

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Re: CB750 1000cc RC Cobra Rebuild
« Reply #11 on: June 25, 2009, 10:06:25 AM »

It only has about 7000 miles on it since the last rebuild, so I'm in hopes the three good sleeves are in decent shape. RC lightened and balanced the crank, and installed the goldenrods. If it's not stock stroke, my dad didn't mention it. I'll ask to make sure. I'll have a look at the end of the CAM at lunch.
-Mike

'78 CB750F All stock except for the powerplant. Jived it off my Dad in the spring of '94. He had it since 1980 and it's the first bike I ever rode on.

Current project: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=67756

How's them SOHC4 patches coming?

Offline MCRider

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Re: CB750 1000cc RC Cobra Rebuild
« Reply #12 on: June 25, 2009, 10:14:18 AM »
The CAM is definitely not RC. What looks like RC on the shaft in the pic is "R6".
snip


The R6 is a Honda mark so it must be a weld up regrind.  Which is fine, I'm just saying...
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Offline 736cc

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Re: CB750 1000cc RC Cobra Rebuild
« Reply #13 on: June 25, 2009, 10:25:33 AM »
Did u know those are 1969 sandcast cases?

Offline myhondas

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Re: CB750 1000cc RC Cobra Rebuild
« Reply #14 on: June 25, 2009, 10:37:20 AM »
Late K0 sandcast case..... one of the last 700 or so....
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1974 CB 750 K4 IN PART-OUT PROCESS (my original bike)
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Offline MCRider

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Re: CB750 1000cc RC Cobra Rebuild
« Reply #15 on: June 25, 2009, 10:51:20 AM »
Late K0 sandcast case..... one of the last 700 or so....

They've been violated!  Bored and studs.   :'(
Ride Safe:
Ron
1988 NT650 HawkGT;  1978 CB400 Hawk;  1975 CB750F -Free Bird; 1968 CB77 Super Hawk -Ticker;  Phaedrus 1972 CB750K2- Build Thread
"Sometimes the light's all shining on me, other times I can barely see, lately it appears to me, what a long, strange trip its been."

Offline HavocTurbo

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Re: CB750 1000cc RC Cobra Rebuild
« Reply #16 on: June 25, 2009, 11:02:24 AM »
Late K0 sandcast case..... one of the last 700 or so....

They've been violated!  Bored and studs.   :'(

But if they were voilated by RC himself... would that make it at least tolerable?
'48 HD Panhead - Exxon Valdez
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Offline michrobi

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Re: CB750 1000cc RC Cobra Rebuild
« Reply #17 on: June 25, 2009, 11:03:30 AM »
Russ can do whatever he wants to IMO   :D

-Mike

'78 CB750F All stock except for the powerplant. Jived it off my Dad in the spring of '94. He had it since 1980 and it's the first bike I ever rode on.

Current project: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=67756

How's them SOHC4 patches coming?

Offline MCRider

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Re: CB750 1000cc RC Cobra Rebuild
« Reply #18 on: June 25, 2009, 11:04:26 AM »
Late K0 sandcast case..... one of the last 700 or so....

They've been violated!  Bored and studs.   :'(

But if they were voilated by RC himself... would that make it at least tolerable?

Good point!

Never mind.   ;)
Ride Safe:
Ron
1988 NT650 HawkGT;  1978 CB400 Hawk;  1975 CB750F -Free Bird; 1968 CB77 Super Hawk -Ticker;  Phaedrus 1972 CB750K2- Build Thread
"Sometimes the light's all shining on me, other times I can barely see, lately it appears to me, what a long, strange trip its been."

Offline michrobi

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Re: CB750 1000cc RC Cobra Rebuild
« Reply #19 on: June 25, 2009, 11:22:49 AM »
Confirmed 28mm exhaust and 32mm intake valves. On the end of the CAM I can see (the #4 end) there is no mark. On the #1 end there is a washer bolted on that I can't see what's on the end of the CAM. There is "H750D" stamped right under Norris on the one side of the shaft.
-Mike

'78 CB750F All stock except for the powerplant. Jived it off my Dad in the spring of '94. He had it since 1980 and it's the first bike I ever rode on.

Current project: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=67756

How's them SOHC4 patches coming?

Offline michrobi

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Re: CB750 1000cc RC Cobra Rebuild
« Reply #20 on: June 25, 2009, 04:13:11 PM »
HondaMan,

   I'll to my dad about your rocker lube enhancement - and with some guidance, I'm keen to implement the design in the Cobra. Thanks for that, it's pretty damn cool!
« Last Edit: June 27, 2009, 10:08:46 AM by michrobi »
-Mike

'78 CB750F All stock except for the powerplant. Jived it off my Dad in the spring of '94. He had it since 1980 and it's the first bike I ever rode on.

Current project: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=67756

How's them SOHC4 patches coming?

Offline michrobi

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Re: CB750 1000cc RC Cobra Rebuild
« Reply #21 on: June 25, 2009, 06:52:03 PM »

Pistons removed



Pistons



Looks like they're Russ Collins hardware after all...



Not sure if you can see it but the case is cracked just to the right of center, going from the damage to the cylinder



The previous goldenrod that let go went up through the starter housing. Here is the result of that repair



I plan to split the cases this weekend.

-Mike

'78 CB750F All stock except for the powerplant. Jived it off my Dad in the spring of '94. He had it since 1980 and it's the first bike I ever rode on.

Current project: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=67756

How's them SOHC4 patches coming?

Offline 754

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Re: CB750 1000cc RC Cobra Rebuild
« Reply #22 on: June 25, 2009, 07:51:30 PM »
Well I would put the cases aside for now, and  maybe run newer ones.. but dont throw them out yet.

 I got considerably luckier than you on them 69 diecast bigbore cases I just got.. only slightly wounded..

 If you get rid of any Goldenrods, I would buy one for a wallhanger in my office.. along with my Yoshi alum superrods.

 ask your Dad if he used to have an RC cam in it, maybe he switched it for better street use.? Did he Dragrace or roadrace it?
Maker of the WELDLESS 750 Frame Kit
dodogas99@gmail.com
Kelowna B.C.       Canada

My next bike will be a ..ANFOB.....

It's All part of the ADVENTURE...

73 836cc.. Green, had it for 3 decades!!
Lost quite a few CB 750's along the way

Offline MRieck

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Re: CB750 1000cc RC Cobra Rebuild
« Reply #23 on: June 25, 2009, 08:26:34 PM »
The problem isn't rocker arm lubrication it's #4 rod journal lubrication. If that thing broke 2 rods in the same place.................
Owner of the "Million Dollar CB"

Offline michrobi

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Re: CB750 1000cc RC Cobra Rebuild
« Reply #24 on: June 25, 2009, 08:48:55 PM »
This last time was the #4 rod's 1st brake as far as I know. It was #2 that went through the time before, and I'm not sure the 69 sandcast was used for the first one. Not sure what rod that was, but I'll ask.
-Mike

'78 CB750F All stock except for the powerplant. Jived it off my Dad in the spring of '94. He had it since 1980 and it's the first bike I ever rode on.

Current project: http://forums.sohc4.net/index.php?topic=67756

How's them SOHC4 patches coming?